I've heard this and that about the Lansky sharpeners but some say that these guys are the standard others should be measured by. The Spyderco Sharpmaker 204 is talked of here highly but isn't that ceramic? My understanding is that using diamond is preferred for 154CM like the blade I carry. You can get diamond sets in the Lansky models but I'm not aware of diamond sets in the 204. What are the drawbacks of the Lansky rod angle sharpeners and why do you all prefer the 204?(Expand on it being idiot proof if that is your answer.) Thanks for the opinions. Have a good playoff weekend all.
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Lansky Sharpeners....Drawbacks?
- Thread starter Don Mega
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- Jan 2, 2001
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- 208
I use a lansky course diamond for reprofiling since it gives a nice straight edge. But for final edges or everyday sharpening it is a royal pain in the a$$. I also get much sharper edges on my bench stones. JMO
Alex
Alex
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- May 26, 2000
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The older 203 Sharpmaker came with diamond sleeves. I noticed the new Spyderco catalog showed diamond rods (or sleeves) for the 204... that should help with the modern steels.
Spyderco is very good for touching up an edge, but terribly slow for reprofiling an edge angle. Is also great for most serrations (Cold Steel excepted).
Lansky: I own, I use routinely, reprofiled and sharpened two 420V blades tonight.
Lansky is my favorite sharpener in terms of what I actually use. I use many things, depending on the knife... I use a Sharpmaker, 2 leather strops, a bench grinder, and a setup with soft backing and sand paper for convex edges.
I like the Lansky, but not blindly ...
Good about Lansky:
1. angle is fairly repeatable
2. can get diamond stones
3. I can get either a fairly polished (smooth shaving edge) or a nice rough medium diamond grabby edge (great for most real chores)
4. I can get very much shaving sharp edge, clean shave, not quite up to Chris Reeve's smooth cutting standard.
5. great for reprofiling an edge, faster than all but motor-driven methods.
6. fast to touch up for me on my daily carry folders (couple minutes per blade). I think those who have practiced w/ Sharpmaker can probably touch up quicker, but I can't. I just find Lansky more precise and predictable. If you practice w/ Sharpmaker, you'll probably be quicker. I have rounded off a couple nice blade tips on the Sharpmaker (a drawback for the amateur) and find that a drawback.
Cons re Lansky:
1. diamond stones do wear out over time
2. you only get 4 angles (17, 20, 25, 30)
3. you can only do up to about 4" blades without repositioning the guide on the blade
4. I've done up to 6" blades, using two jig positionings, but past that, you need another method.
5. angles might not be very accurate
6. Stones are separate from guide rods. They use a screw for a friction connection, which is not terribly accurate for repeatability, but as a minor benefit, allows rod and stone to break down into a more compact kit
You should look at the Gatco sharpener also. My buddy likes it better than the Lansky, he tried mine, and I trust his opinion. See also DMT...good diamonds from them, kit might be better still, not sure. Rods are permanently connected to stones... good for repeatability, but makes for less compact kit (pretty minor drawback to me).
EdgePro makes 2 kits, both more expensive than Lansky or Gatco. Many swear by them. Owner says diamonds don't hold up well, so he offers regular (I think) silicon carbide stones, which do wear out but he says are fine for modern CPM steels, etc, and you can replace or reprofile/flatten stones also. A "cadillac" system, with it's own pros/cons.
Use the search engine for rich content.
I use a bench grinder w/ two hard fiberboard wheels for anything 5" on up to machete length (22")...one wheel with silicon carbide grit, the other loaded w/ rouge. Angles are hand held. I can get a shaving edge on big machetes, even at 30 degrees. This may be close to the ultimate sharpening system, but it takes practice, a good eye, and muscle memory to keep a consistent edge angle.
Most makers use a slack belt and then a buffer or hard fiber or felt wheel for sharpening. This gives you the ability to put a flat or a convex edge on a final edge. Maybe I will use a slack belt someday too.
Spyderco is very good for touching up an edge, but terribly slow for reprofiling an edge angle. Is also great for most serrations (Cold Steel excepted).
Lansky: I own, I use routinely, reprofiled and sharpened two 420V blades tonight.
Lansky is my favorite sharpener in terms of what I actually use. I use many things, depending on the knife... I use a Sharpmaker, 2 leather strops, a bench grinder, and a setup with soft backing and sand paper for convex edges.
I like the Lansky, but not blindly ...
Good about Lansky:
1. angle is fairly repeatable
2. can get diamond stones
3. I can get either a fairly polished (smooth shaving edge) or a nice rough medium diamond grabby edge (great for most real chores)
4. I can get very much shaving sharp edge, clean shave, not quite up to Chris Reeve's smooth cutting standard.
5. great for reprofiling an edge, faster than all but motor-driven methods.
6. fast to touch up for me on my daily carry folders (couple minutes per blade). I think those who have practiced w/ Sharpmaker can probably touch up quicker, but I can't. I just find Lansky more precise and predictable. If you practice w/ Sharpmaker, you'll probably be quicker. I have rounded off a couple nice blade tips on the Sharpmaker (a drawback for the amateur) and find that a drawback.
Cons re Lansky:
1. diamond stones do wear out over time
2. you only get 4 angles (17, 20, 25, 30)
3. you can only do up to about 4" blades without repositioning the guide on the blade
4. I've done up to 6" blades, using two jig positionings, but past that, you need another method.
5. angles might not be very accurate
6. Stones are separate from guide rods. They use a screw for a friction connection, which is not terribly accurate for repeatability, but as a minor benefit, allows rod and stone to break down into a more compact kit
You should look at the Gatco sharpener also. My buddy likes it better than the Lansky, he tried mine, and I trust his opinion. See also DMT...good diamonds from them, kit might be better still, not sure. Rods are permanently connected to stones... good for repeatability, but makes for less compact kit (pretty minor drawback to me).
EdgePro makes 2 kits, both more expensive than Lansky or Gatco. Many swear by them. Owner says diamonds don't hold up well, so he offers regular (I think) silicon carbide stones, which do wear out but he says are fine for modern CPM steels, etc, and you can replace or reprofile/flatten stones also. A "cadillac" system, with it's own pros/cons.
Use the search engine for rich content.
I use a bench grinder w/ two hard fiberboard wheels for anything 5" on up to machete length (22")...one wheel with silicon carbide grit, the other loaded w/ rouge. Angles are hand held. I can get a shaving edge on big machetes, even at 30 degrees. This may be close to the ultimate sharpening system, but it takes practice, a good eye, and muscle memory to keep a consistent edge angle.
Most makers use a slack belt and then a buffer or hard fiber or felt wheel for sharpening. This gives you the ability to put a flat or a convex edge on a final edge. Maybe I will use a slack belt someday too.
You know what, let me expand on my knife. That may help me in the responses. I have an Emerson Commander. With this knife comes another obstacle...the recurve blade. This blade would make it tough to keep a constant angle in one direction with the curve of the blade extending out toward the stone. Has anyone used one of these kits on a recurve type blade? Thanks again.
- Joined
- Jun 23, 1999
- Messages
- 1,209
I have the DMT alignment system and 3 DMT diamond stones (x-coarse, coarse, fine). Like Lansky, the system has plusses and minuses. I decided to get the stone-based delux Lansky when it recently appeared for $32 in Smokey Mtn. I wanted to see if it was mechanically better than the DMT system.
The DMT aligner is not permanently connected to the stone. You mount it in a plastic holder. This mount is good as far as repeatability goes. Where it breaks down a little is in the connection between the rod and the stone holder. Over time this connection develops a wobble. Not much, but every little change matters right?
Like lansky, you can do up to about a 4" knife without repositioning the holder. Another down-side is that it will accept nothing thicker than 1/8" What is Lansky's limit here? Another thing I find strange is that the hole through which the rod passes (like the lansky there are 4 similar angle settings) is rather large leaving room for a sloppy stroke to be off by some fraction of a degree because the rod hits the top of the hole instead of the bottom (or vice versa).
The good thing about the DMT system is:
1. DMT stones are the best I think. They work for a long time at their rated coarseness. I almost always reprofile the edge of a new knife once the factory edge goes away (if I like that at all). I'm glad I got the x-coarse stone to do it, so I recommend that. Otherwise, the further combination of coarse and fine gives me just that amount of micro-toothieness I like.
2. Its lighter than lansky
3. Its cheaper than (the diamond version) of Lansky I think.
I am forced to do free-hand sharpening of my larger blades because they are all thicker than 1/8". For this I got the A DMT large two-sided bench hone. I've done a few machetes and larger knives on the combination of x-coarse/coarse has put some good edged back on these blades. I'd like to get a fine in this size stone too, but these puppies are expensive as you are buying always two hones in one! To get slightly more polish than the coarse diamond leaves, I sometimes do a few passes on a medium arkansas stone I still have from my pre-diamond days.
The DMT aligner is not permanently connected to the stone. You mount it in a plastic holder. This mount is good as far as repeatability goes. Where it breaks down a little is in the connection between the rod and the stone holder. Over time this connection develops a wobble. Not much, but every little change matters right?
Like lansky, you can do up to about a 4" knife without repositioning the holder. Another down-side is that it will accept nothing thicker than 1/8" What is Lansky's limit here? Another thing I find strange is that the hole through which the rod passes (like the lansky there are 4 similar angle settings) is rather large leaving room for a sloppy stroke to be off by some fraction of a degree because the rod hits the top of the hole instead of the bottom (or vice versa).
The good thing about the DMT system is:
1. DMT stones are the best I think. They work for a long time at their rated coarseness. I almost always reprofile the edge of a new knife once the factory edge goes away (if I like that at all). I'm glad I got the x-coarse stone to do it, so I recommend that. Otherwise, the further combination of coarse and fine gives me just that amount of micro-toothieness I like.
2. Its lighter than lansky
3. Its cheaper than (the diamond version) of Lansky I think.
I am forced to do free-hand sharpening of my larger blades because they are all thicker than 1/8". For this I got the A DMT large two-sided bench hone. I've done a few machetes and larger knives on the combination of x-coarse/coarse has put some good edged back on these blades. I'd like to get a fine in this size stone too, but these puppies are expensive as you are buying always two hones in one! To get slightly more polish than the coarse diamond leaves, I sometimes do a few passes on a medium arkansas stone I still have from my pre-diamond days.
- Joined
- May 26, 2000
- Messages
- 1,922
In fact, both knives I sharpened last night on the Lansky were recurves, one mild the other moderate, nothing as radical as the Commander. (one is a JW Smith 3.5" MRC, the other a JW Smith 4" RC... pics on Bladeart.com). I also sharpen my 710 this way.
However, I will say that I really have no problems with the Lansky on recurves since the stones are fairly narrow, narrower than the Gatco. Lansky stones are exactly 1/2" wide. You do need to be a bit careful to keep the stone moving and not to scrub in one spot too long, or you can put little flat spots on a recurved edge. Would the Commander be a problem? Not sure. Don't own one. I will say the very tight radius of the LaGriffe WAS a problem w/ the Lansky.
The Spyderco is probably ideal for recurves, but I just don't have a problem of any note with the recurves I own and the Lansky (excepting LaGriffe).
- Joined
- Jun 23, 1999
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- 1,209
Got a Lansky system (stone, not diamond). Compared to DMT I found...
1. The Lansky clamp is far superior to the DMT alignment clamp. Its metal (aluminum), not plastic. The alignment holes are more securely positioned. It holds much thicker knives (at least 1/4" vs the 1/8" max for DMT). The spread of the arms holding the holes is more repeatable with the Lansky.
2. The DMT stones are far superior to Lansky stones. Even if the Lansky diamonds are as good as DMT's the DMT stones are twice the width and therefore require only 1/2 the number of strokes.
3. Lansky permanently mates a holder and a stone. You have to add and remove the rod. The DMT system mates the rod and holder. You change stones in the holder. DMT gets the nod here because the over-all result is more repeatable. The downside to the DMT stone holder is that its connection to its rod becomes a little loose after a while. A tight wrap (around the joint) or a little superglue takes care of this problem.
I discovered that you can have the best of both worlds. <b>The DMT stones in the DMT holder <i>fit</i> the Lansky clamp!</b> Works great! Now I may achieve the holy grail of edges, the ability to part 02 molecules!
1. The Lansky clamp is far superior to the DMT alignment clamp. Its metal (aluminum), not plastic. The alignment holes are more securely positioned. It holds much thicker knives (at least 1/4" vs the 1/8" max for DMT). The spread of the arms holding the holes is more repeatable with the Lansky.
2. The DMT stones are far superior to Lansky stones. Even if the Lansky diamonds are as good as DMT's the DMT stones are twice the width and therefore require only 1/2 the number of strokes.
3. Lansky permanently mates a holder and a stone. You have to add and remove the rod. The DMT system mates the rod and holder. You change stones in the holder. DMT gets the nod here because the over-all result is more repeatable. The downside to the DMT stone holder is that its connection to its rod becomes a little loose after a while. A tight wrap (around the joint) or a little superglue takes care of this problem.
I discovered that you can have the best of both worlds. <b>The DMT stones in the DMT holder <i>fit</i> the Lansky clamp!</b> Works great! Now I may achieve the holy grail of edges, the ability to part 02 molecules!
- Joined
- Jan 25, 2000
- Messages
- 4,492
I agree with the use of DMT stones. I bought 4 of the small DMT hones (4" x 3/4") in extra coarse, coarse, fine, extra fine and epoxied them to some old worn out Lansky hones. They work beautiful and at approx. $5.00 each, alot cheaper than the Lansky diamonds!
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- May 26, 2000
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- 1,922
Very helpful post Matthew. Thanks for that.
I may buy some DMT stones to augment my Lansky kit if they'll sell stones w/ the holder+rod.
I would say that the DMT stones at twice as wide would probably be a disadvantage w/ recurves, but an advantage with regular blades.
Mix and match for the occasion/knife makes sense.
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- May 26, 2000
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I too reprofile almost everything I buy.
Diamond is a must... it's such a time saver.
And I very much agree ... the x-coarse stone is a tremendous time and energy saver in reprofiling edges, especially with things like 420V and 440V and hard D2 (or recent vintage ATS-34 Benchmades! Damn those are hard to sharpen, relative to older BM's). Having 4 grits, from x-coarse to coarse to medium to fine, all in diamond, is great. If I want it polished more than fine diamond (usually don't), to the strop or rouge-loaded wheel on bench grinder.
I like a bench grinder setup for big blades... hard fiberboard wheel with abrasive, and one with rouge. Anything bigger than 5" I'm typically doing on the bench grinder.
Kitchen Knives: these are the only knives (Henckels) that I run through a EdgeSelect (EdgePro?) Chef's Choice Model 120 motorized 3-wheel sharpener. I can literally resharpen a kitchen knife back to a scrapey-shavy edge in 30 - 60 seconds, depending on knife size. A whole block of knives very sharp in 15 minutes! But this machine is too harsh and hard to control for anything else but kitchen knives (which I view as having a finite life expectancy... I'm almost looking for an excuse to buy some custom kitchen knives someday).
- Joined
- Mar 26, 2001
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You can get more than 4 angles with a lansky sharpener. The rods mount to the stones with a wing nut. If you want a slightly wider angle than you are getting 17 to 18 or 19, loosen the nut and slide the stone out off the rod a little. Because no two stones wear the same this adjustment helps a lot. The rods have flats on them where the nuts tighten down, but they are limited. I have manually extended
these to maximize the adjustability. This allows me to copy existing factory angles I have also coated the inside of the clamp pieces with rubber so it doesn't scratch my knives (Plasticoat). After these modification, I really like mine a lot better and I find it much easier to use. Hope this helps.
these to maximize the adjustability. This allows me to copy existing factory angles I have also coated the inside of the clamp pieces with rubber so it doesn't scratch my knives (Plasticoat). After these modification, I really like mine a lot better and I find it much easier to use. Hope this helps.
- Joined
- Jan 4, 1999
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V sharpeners like the Spyderco are good for maintaining edges but not good for regrinding bevels. Systems like the Lansky will handle both but, of course, are quite a bit less convenient for maintenance. I think a V sharpener is a good thing to have (I have two of them including the Spyderco) but shouldn't be your only sharpener because bevels do need regrinding from time to time. Spyderco is slow for regrinding. Lansky is slow for touch up sharpening. Perhaps you should have both. Take care.
I'm just a rookie and have very limited experience with my Lansky but I found two things caused me trouble. 1) if your blade isn't very wide you have limited clamping surface to hold the knife because the guide rods have to clear the clamping screw. 2) I never knew what angle to sharpen to. That is a question I've been meaning to ask on this forum so I'd appreciate any help.
I have both the Diamond Lansky and the Edgepro. I echo the complaints of most of the others above about the Lansky. I didn't like the clamping, bending of the clamps, inaccurate angles, clamping and reclamping longer knives, etc. Yes, the Edgepro is much more expensive, but it does a fantastic job. I doubt the Lansky will be used again by myself. Someday I may even get the Spyderco, but yet again maybe I won't.
Bruce
Bruce
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- Dec 17, 2001
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- 1,055
But doesn't the Lansky, with all it's faults, allow you to maintain a more consistent angle than even the Sharpmaker? I would think a little slop around the contact points of the rods and stone holders would still provide more consistensy than holding your hand exactly perpendicular "by eye".
That has been my main concern about the Sharpmaker, other than its inability to reprofile edges (which I'm not sure how often I'd have to do, anyway...)
-- PG
P.S. Akwacko, you want to sell your Lansky? I'm going to buy one anyway... Send me mail if interested.
That has been my main concern about the Sharpmaker, other than its inability to reprofile edges (which I'm not sure how often I'd have to do, anyway...)
-- PG
P.S. Akwacko, you want to sell your Lansky? I'm going to buy one anyway... Send me mail if interested.
PG,
I'll email you tonight or tommorrow about the possible purchase of my Lansky system. I'll get the pieces together to let you know what I have and their condition. I have a class tonight so the email will probably come this Friday (or maybe even Saterday).
Bruce
I'll email you tonight or tommorrow about the possible purchase of my Lansky system. I'll get the pieces together to let you know what I have and their condition. I have a class tonight so the email will probably come this Friday (or maybe even Saterday).
Bruce
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2000
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What are the angles on the DMT alighner?
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- Jun 23, 1999
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- 1,209
The angles on DMT aligner are roughly the same as on the Lansky, 17, 20, 25, and 30 (roughly). Of course these angles will vary just a bit depending on the width and thickness of the knife just as they do on the Lansky. The idea behind the two systems is basically identical, they are just executed a little differently.
I've recently changed over to the 20 deg. angle after experimenting for a while (months) with the 17. The 20 makes a wickedly sharp edge and is a little less delicate than the 17. I see that most of the factory edges I get are closer to 25 deg. though.
I've recently changed over to the 20 deg. angle after experimenting for a while (months) with the 17. The 20 makes a wickedly sharp edge and is a little less delicate than the 17. I see that most of the factory edges I get are closer to 25 deg. though.