Latest acquisition - two Richards Wilcox grinding wheels

[bbforstr]

I just got back from Yakima Washington where I picked up two Richards - Wilcox grinding wheels. They aren't in perfect shape, but at $75 each, I couldn't pass them up. They are 19"x 2" and17"x 3" each. Both need some work on bearings and drive mechanism but they should be a fun restoration project. I probably spent as much in diesel picking them up as I did on the purchase price.

Does anybody know a source for parts for these things. I would like to replace the bearings.

Here's the worst chip on the 3" wide wheel.

Here's the worst chip on the 2" wide wheel.

I can't wait to get started working on them. It's been a 520 mile day so it will have to wait until tomorrow.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Nice, dude! A shame about the chips. I seem to recall a manual on tools for third world nations that described how to make a grinding wheel.

 

[bbforstr]

Blades

The chip on the 2" wheel shouldn't be an issue. The one on the 3" wheel led to some cupping in the center of the wheel. I'm not sure if a wheel dresser will work on these things or not. Maybe if I got one of the fancy diamond dressers.

 

[garry3]

I own a few. The bearings are a problem. I would think that a guy could rebuild them, replacement I have not found. Changing stones has not proven to be easy either.
That is a very good price. I came across a wooden hand crank this week end with a great stone, but he wanted $150. I walked away from it.

 

[bbforstr]

That is a very good price. I came across a wooden hand crank this week end with a great stone, but he wanted $150. I walked away from it.

I saw one on Craigslist yesterday for $800. It was nice but holy crap.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Blades

The chip on the 2" wheel shouldn't be an issue. The one on the 3" wheel led to some cupping in the center of the wheel. I'm not sure if a wheel dresser will work on these things or not. Maybe if I got one of the fancy diamond dressers.

Diamond "T" style dressers are fairly inexpensive and work nicely. :thumbup:

 

[garry3]

I saw one on Craigslist yesterday for $800. It was nice but holy crap.

Wow. It should have been new old stock.

The nicest I have seen was at a flea market this summer. It was a later one with everything in very good condition. The only thing it didn't have was the drip can. If I remember right he was asking $400 but told me he would take $350. It was so nice that if I didn't already have one I would have payed it.

I pick up parts and pieces when I find them. It won't be easy to find a seat for instance. The wheels are much more common then the axles and hard ware. You are in pretty good shape with yours.

 

[garry3]

I have a couple of very good wheels that I am planing for these rusty treadle grinders I posted. I am always looking for parts, if I come across a seat I will let you know. The better ones were on the earliar grinders and were cast. Like this one.

 

[bbforstr]

Garry

Wow! That is a nice wheel. I hope to get mine looking that good. Between the two, I should be able to come up with one pretty nice wheel. I like the anvil too. Is that a 300 lb anvil?

 

[garry3]

It has bearing issues. But I have found its not a big deal. That treadle grinder looked no where near as good as the two you have right now. It had a very out of round wheel that was about 6" in diameter when I bought it. No signs of paint at all, just rusted metal. It's been setting out side and the paint is fading a little, but it is not rusting away. I used implement paint from the auto parts store. Bomb cans.

The anvil is around 180lbs. Can't remember the make. It is an older wrought iron anvil with a hardened steel face. And a hundred punch marks on the off side in the soft wrought body. To diminstrate to costomers that there tools were properly heat treated.

 

[garry3]

It has bearing issues. But I have found its not a big deal. That treadle grinder looked no where near as good as the two you have right now. It had a very out of round wheel that was about 6" in diameter when I bought it. No signs of paint at all, just rusted metal. It's been setting out side and the paint is fading a little, but it is not rusting away. I used implement paint from the auto parts store. Bomb cans.

The anvil is around 180lbs. Can't remember the make. It is an older wrought iron anvil with a hardened steel face. And a hundred punch marks on the off side in the soft wrought body. To diminstrate to costomers that there tools were properly heat treated.

 

[bbforstr]

I decided which frame /bearing combo was the best and moved the 2" wheel onto that frame.

Each side has two bearings which I cleaned then packed with lithium grease.

The wheel is off-center. I tried a 1 1/2" wrench to reposition it but the wrench is too small. That's the largest wrench I have, so it looks like I will have to buy a new tool. Wife won't be too happy.

I haven't reconnected the drive mechanism yet but I sharpened a 1/2 inch chisel with centrifugal force only. The chisel is scary sharp with a nice finish.

Still trying to decide how to paint it. I'm thinking John Deere green on the frame with a bright red seat with black letters.

Later
Brent

 

[garry3]

You may find that the nut is froze tight. These stones being lubricated by water. Even if the threads look good from the outside water has run in between the stone and the nut. I tried every trick I knew to free mine only to end up breaking the shaft inside the wheel. Yours is not as rusty so maybe you will have better luck.
If you break the hollow shaft it is not an easy fix. And you still will end up not being able to center the wheel. Use caution, it is hollow.

 

[bbforstr]

You may find that the nut is froze tight. These stones being lubricated by water. Even if the threads look good from the outside water has run in between the stone and the nut. I tried every trick I knew to free mine only to end up breaking the shaft inside the wheel. Yours is not as rusty so maybe you will have better luck.
If you break the hollow shaft it is not an easy fix. And you still will end up not being able to center the wheel. Use caution, it is hollow.

Good advice Garry. I put some liquid wrench on it. I'll go put a little more on in a few minutes. None of the nuts have been easy to remove. All of the original nuts on the wheels are square. They don't seem to fit standard wrench sizes too well either. The hardest nut so far was on the seat. It was just a carriage bolt through a stamped sheet metal seat. I finally got it by clamping the threaded end with a vice-grip. I was still able to re-thread the original bolt.


I would never have imagined that shaft would be hollow. This project has been a lot of fun. By tomorrow I should have two working wheels.

Later
Brent

 

[bbforstr]

Diamond "T" style dressers are fairly inexpensive and work nicely. :thumbup:

Blades

After a,day of working on these wheels and not completing one, I'll definitely be looking for one of the diamond "t" dressers. I can't believe how sharp I got a chisel in just a couple of minutes. My son thinks you could shave with it, not that he has ever had to shave. I think you could shave with it too but I think I'll stick with Gillette for that chore.

 

[garry3]

Good advice Garry. I put some liquid wrench on it. I'll go put a little more on in a few minutes. None of the nuts have been easy to remove. All of the original nuts on the wheels are square. They don't seem to fit standard wrench sizes too well either. The hardest nut so far was on the seat. It was just a carriage bolt through a stamped sheet metal seat. I finally got it by clamping the threaded end with a vice-grip. I was still able to re-thread the original bolt.


I would never have imagined that shaft would be hollow. This project has been a lot of fun. By tomorrow I should have two working wheels.

Later
Brent

A steel axle goes through what looks like a bolt. A set screw keeps it from just turning free inside the wheel.

 

[garry3]

The other side.

That big black bolt is hollow.

 

[bbforstr]

Garry

That looks pretty much like my favorite one of the two wheels. The other is totally different and already broken.

Does yours have a set screw on the opposite side of the hollow shaft? I'm having a hard time getting the set screw tight enough to keep the wheel connected with the shaft. I might just need to clean it better. I'm kind of going slow to learn how these things are put together. This is turning into one of the funnest restorations ever. I hope I don't screw something up.

I really appreciate your advice. I think it will go a long way in preventing me from learning the hard way. I already told my boss I' taking tomorrow off to work on these things. He's pretty cool about my hobbies. He has some of his own.

Thanks again.
Brent

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Blades

After a,day of working on these wheels and not completing one, I'll definitely be looking for one of the diamond "t" dressers. I can't believe how sharp I got a chisel in just a couple of minutes. My son thinks you could shave with it, not that he has ever had to shave. I think you could shave with it too but I think I'll stick with Gillette for that chore.

I actually sharpened a chisel on my 10" Grizzly today! Amazing what a hollow will do for a chisel, eh?

With the dressing tool try to build yourself a jig that'll hold the tool at a set distance from the stone. I carved a channel in a scrap piece of 2x4 and jammed the handle of the tool down in it then set it against the tool rest and turned the machine on. I slowly moved it closer and closer to the stone until the high spot would hit and then just held the dresser there until it stopped contacting, then advanced it a little more. I had rusting steel particles all over the stone from previous use so it made seeing the nice white dressed spot on the stone very easy. As you keep going the spot will get bigger and bigger until you're making contact all the way around. From that point on you can just use the dressing tool for shaping the face of the stone since it'll wear true.

With sandstone wheels and some kinds of synthetics (not all) it's important not to let them sit in water for extended periods or they'll soften and break. Not so much a problem with drip can stones, but with bath style rigs it's important to keep in mind.

 

[Steve Tall]

Here's a 1919 ad for R-W grindstones:

The stones are composed of Berea sandstone, quarried in Ohio, as detailed in this book:
http://books.google.com/books?id=1il2qNB5srIC&lpg=PP1&ots=8tMM1hHU_Q&dq=sandstone%20center%20of%20the%20world&pg=PP1#v=onepage&q&f=false

One of the old companies, Cleveland Quarries, is still in operation (these days making paving stones instead of grindstones):
http://www.clevelandquarries.com/

Stacks of grindstones:

from http://www.bereahistoricalsociety.org/site/Sandstone.aspx