Lets talk GEC!

[JohnDF]

Speaking of over-used shields...
How about Case with their over-used ovals
or Northwoods with their over-used arrowhead
or Canal Street with their over-used circle
just to name a few.

I think we are lucky that GEC gives us options,
they don't just stick with the Tidioute and UN-X-LD designs.

 

[Mayonardo]

Shields are a minor concern for me. I can’t say I would not purchase a knife just because of a shield. But, GEC stainless for a traditional pattern knife, not. One of the things I respect about GEC is their use of traditional materials for their traditional knives. If I want a traditionally styled knife made with modern components there are plenty of candidates. Why should GEC follow other makers designs. Stay traditional.

 

[2Dead]

They used the Cyclops stamp on the 2018 Wall Streets (440C)...

View attachment 1152471 Cyclops still on 2016 blades.

Excellent!! Thanks for the confirmation guys. I really hope GEC continues with they Cyclops stamp on their 440C knives for an easy marker on whats what.

 

[2Dead]

2Dead Trand, some useful scholarship there thank you and that Ivory bone fixed is stellar!

I'm totally with you on the stainless front, keep hoping that GEC has the ability and WILL to invest some of its profits in new blade stamping machinery so they can offer more stainless knives. The argument is that stainless is too gruelling on their existing machinery. This may or may not be the case but there's a desire for modern all stainless construction with Traditional patterns and materials.

I agree, a Churchill, particularly a Spear version would be most attractive. Have there been any stainless Spears while we're on that one? A Eureka is a grand candidate for stainlessisation

Thanks, Will

Agreed Will. I know you'd be first in line for some more stainless. Right now only the #25 is coming to mind with a spear blade.

 

[2Dead]

Shields are a minor concern for me. I can’t say I would not purchase a knife just because of a shield. But, GEC stainless for a traditional pattern knife, not. One of the things I respect about GEC is their use of traditional materials for their traditional knives. If I want a traditionally styled knife made with modern components there are plenty of candidates. Why should GEC follow other makers designs. Stay traditional.

The first stainless steels used in knives happened over 100 years ago. GEC has been using stainless steels since they started in 2006.
https://knifesteelnerds.com/2018/07/16/first-stainless-steel-for-knives/

 

[Markeologist]

Shields are a minor concern for me. I can’t say I would not purchase a knife just because of a shield. But, GEC stainless for a traditional pattern knife, not. One of the things I respect about GEC is their use of traditional materials for their traditional knives. If I want a traditionally styled knife made with modern components there are plenty of candidates. Why should GEC follow other makers designs. Stay traditional.

Uh? Sorry, picture came blurry (from Bladeforums: Pocket Knives of the 1920s)...but you can read "stainless" on blade....sure looks awfully traditional to me.

 

[Markeologist]

Courtesy of WorthPoint on interweb...easier to read. Pre-War Camillus.

 

[Sabercat]

Thanks, Al. The new #93 does look ever so slightly slimmer and curvier than the #47, but the difference is so small that I'm surprised they would redo it.

Jeff, do you suppose they created an entire new pattern for the 93 (when the 47 is quite similar) in order to replicate the exact shape and dimensions of a particular Sheffield? I'm just speculating, but it's the best guess I can come up with.

 

[black mamba]

Ryan, that seems like a real possibility.

 

[Camillus]

Its gotta be an 47 frame imo. If you have to use callipers to tell them apart, there is no reason for them not to have used an existing pattern.

 

[Pinemoon]

Shields are a minor concern for me. I can’t say I would not purchase a knife just because of a shield. But, GEC stainless for a traditional pattern knife, not. One of the things I respect about GEC is their use of traditional materials for their traditional knives. If I want a traditionally styled knife made with modern components there are plenty of candidates. Why should GEC follow other makers designs. Stay traditional.

That's great that you like the 1095.
It'd also be great if stainless-lovers could have traditional offerings from GEC. It doesn't have to be one or the other. There's room for both.

 

[Boxer .45]

That's great that you like the 1095.
It'd also be great if stainless-lovers could have traditional offerings from GEC. It doesn't have to be one or the other. There's room for both.

Stainless lovers can have traditional offerings from GEC, but most of the traditional offerings will be in carbon steel.

 

[Mayonardo]

Stainless steel was patented in 1916 as cutlery steel.
“Brearley went on to obtain patents in Britain, U.S., France, and Canada. His US patent was granted in 1916. He didn’t patent simply a stainless steel, however, but steel for cutlery. In fact, the patent is titled simply, “Cutlery.” Therefore, the first stainless steel was patented as a knife steel.“
- https://knifesteelnerds.com/2018/07/16/first-stainless-steel-for-knives/

Since folding knives had been made for centuries, a case can be made that carbon steels are in fact more traditional than stainless.

 

[waverave]

Interesting that GEC would post about Frech Kate pins being available...did they find a hidden stash of pins or is this some new way of leaving us clues for an upcoming release? Or was this pin never available and now it is?

http://greateasterncutlery.net/blog/2019/06/27/now-available/

 

[Markeologist]

Stainless steel was patented in 1916 as cutlery steel.
“Brearley went on to obtain patents in Britain, U.S., France, and Canada. His US patent was granted in 1916. He didn’t patent simply a stainless steel, however, but steel for cutlery. In fact, the patent is titled simply, “Cutlery.” Therefore, the first stainless steel was patented as a knife steel.“
- https://knifesteelnerds.com/2018/07/16/first-stainless-steel-for-knives/

Since folding knives had been made for centuries, a case can be made that carbon steels are in fact more traditional than stainless.

I wouldn’t argue against that point but on that logic you could say blades have been made for millennia and therefore obsidian is more traditional than carbon steel. While true, that doesn’t, however, make carbon steel blades any less traditional. You were dismissing stainless blades as not being traditional and 2Dead and I were only pointing out that stainless blades have been around for a century and meets the definition of traditional as utilized in this forum.

 

[Mayonardo]

What is that definition? Style over materials? A blend of old and new? No locks? Or an informal consensus?

I’m genuinely curious.

 

[Will Power]

Advancing the idea that carbon is some manner of 'purist' Traditional is convoluted to put it politely. As others have pointed out stainless has not only been around since before any of us were born...but has been improving in quality and availability for half a century.

GEC opts not to use much stainless as they say it punishes their equipment, OK fair enough they must look after their machinery-if they don't have plant capable of stamping out Sandvik, 154, 440c etc. But the 'Traditional' argument that carbon is the real material is specious. You could say that Micarta has no place on a Traditional knife, GEC uses it. You could condemn Acrylic for the same reason as being too 'modern' or the use of certain woods like Osage Orange that were not used before but GEC uses it very effectively. The recent introduction of a foreign non American pattern, the Lamb Foot by GEC could be criticised by purists as being non traditional - the English make them we don't, traditionally. But this would be an absurd piece of pedantry.

Locks have existed widely on Traditional knives since the c19th. Perhaps when multi blade knives appeared, purists decried them as not being real Traditionals, only single-blades please....

From its outset in 2006 Great Eastern had three distinct lines: Tidioute, Northfield and GEC stainless with acorn shield/squirrel etch. They did not claim to be solely manufacting in carbon as it is more Traditional. Carbon has many obvious virtues, very cheap to make, easy to work with and sharpen. But it has distinct disadvantages, it needs constant use or maintenance or it will rust and engulf the whole frame, its edge hold is nothing to write home about either, and it can impart flavour on foods. Fair enough when people prefer carbon for the ease of sharpening, the mystique of patina but to claim it is more traditional after a century of stainless is frankly dubious. Most custom makers use stainless, are they not somehow traditional?

Regards, Will

 

[Markeologist]

What is that definition? Style over materials? A blend of old and new? No locks? Or an informal consensus?

I’m genuinely curious.

No problem Mayonardo, all be good! You are correct in the broad sense that carbon steel is generally considered more traditional (and thus my statement that I would not argue against you there), I was just pointing out that stainless is also a traditional material. Folding knives do in fact go back centuries and the beloved (around here) Barlow pattern dates back to the 17th Century, clearly well before the advent of stainless steel. That said, many if not most of the patterns we consider traditional only date back to the late 19th and early 20th Centuries. As was pointed out, stainless steel became available in the first couple decades of the 20th Century and thus is generally considered a traditional material.

...and for the record, here are the guidelines for this forum:

"If a regular knife user of the mid 1960's would find nothing out of the ordinary about the design, then it's traditional.

That means large Buck 110-ish lockbacks are in.

SAKs date to the late 1800's. If they are not one hand opening, they are in. (See comments on materials of construction.)

Modern locking mechanisms such as Walker liner locks, pocket clips, holes / studs to allow one hand opening are all out. (Traditional liner locks, such as the lock on a TL29, are in.) Add a clip to a stockman, and it needs to be posted elsewhere. By the same token, if it is traditional except for a clip and you remove the clip, feel free to post it here.

We tend to have some tolerance when it comes to fixed blades. But, new designs with features such as glass breakers, are not included in this forum.

We give leeway on materials of construction. So if you have a nice stockman with G10 covers, it's traditional enough for us. After all, plastics have been used on knife handles since the 1800's. Stainless steel has been used in cutlery since the 1920's, so stainless is considered traditional. And even though PM alloys are new developments, that fella in the mid-1960's would never know the difference if he were looking at the knife, so they are OK, too."

 

[2Dead]

I wouldn’t argue against that point but on that logic you could say blades have been made for millennia and therefore obsidian is more traditional than carbon steel. While true, that doesn’t, however, make carbon steel blades any less traditional. You were dismissing stainless blades as not being traditional and 2Dead and I were only pointing out that stainless blades have been around for a century and meets the definition of traditional as utilized in this forum.

Exactly what I was trying to say. I'm not against carbon steel knives. I've probably got more 1095 #48s than I do stainless GECs of all patterns. There's room for both. I just want GEC to make some stainless jacks under their name which they haven't done yet.

 

[Buzzbait]

I’d go as far as to say that if carbon steel didn’t develop such a lovely patina, probably nobody here would prefer it. For the size knives that were taking about, any perceived increase in toughness from carbon steel is a moot point. And with the edge thicknesses were speaking of, there’s almost no difference in ease of sharpening. Stainless easily gets the nod in abrasion resistance.

But the allure of patina is great. Carbon steel knives tend to look more and more beautiful as we use them over time. Stainless is much the opposite. I happily use carbon steel throughout the winter, and enjoy taking my well-patinated pictures. But come summer, carbon steel is just so much work and risk.