Looking for a c. 175mm. Santoku, Wa handle and stainless blade

K

Khromo

Joined
May 25, 2018
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203
Here is what I am looking for:

A traditional style santoku, 7"/175 mm. or so, gyuto is okay as well.
Stainless blade. I tried to explain this below.
Wa handle, I really want to experience the weight and balance, the feel of a lightweight knife, as opposed to the Westernized knives I've been using (Miyabi Artisans, excellent knives, but a little heavy in the handles.)

I don't need no stinking Damascus, and I don't need a hammered finish. I am no slave to fashion! Just a traditional style knife with a good stainless blade.

It looks like the best access might be ordering from Japan on the auction site. I'd like to keep it under $300 US. If they don't make anything good like this, I can pass, but I did find one site that had exactly what I am looking for, with SG2 blades. Except they were sold out, and it is hard to gauge quality from an auction ad!

DISCLAIMER!!!
I live in the United States, and I am not a professional chef. After I finish cooking something I eat it immediately, while it is hot. I may live in the U.S.A., but I am not a barbarian. I don't let the food get cold while I wash my knives. So they sit, and sometimes they sit overnight.

For this reason, I believe the corrosion resistance of stainless far outweighs any performance advantage of Aogami Super or the other popular steels for use in traditional style knives.

I understand it is no longer a Santuko but an inbred bastard child. I understand I have combined church and state and pissed off the purists but I am talking about cooking, not religion. No need to be clutching at our pearls because we are departing from the traditional pattern!
 
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Khromo said:
Here is what I am looking for:

A traditional style santoku, 7"/175 mm. or so, gyuto is okay as well.
Stainless blade. I tried to explain this below.
Wa handle, I really want to experience the weight and balance, the feel of a lightweight knife, as opposed to the Westernized knives I've been using (Miyabi Artisans, excellent knives, but a little heavy in the handles.)

I don't need no stinking Damascus, and I don't need a hammered finish. I am no slave to fashion! Just a traditional style knife with a good stainless blade.

It looks like the best access might be ordering from Japan on the auction site. I'd like to keep it under $300 US. If they don't make anything good like this, I can pass, but I did find one site that had exactly what I am looking for, with SG2 blades. Except they were sold out, and it is hard to gauge quality from an auction ad!

DISCLAIMER!!!
I live in the United States, and I am not a professional chef. After I finish cooking something I eat it immediately, while it is hot. I may live in the U.S.A., but I am not a barbarian. I don't let the food get cold while I wash my knives. So they sit, and sometimes they sit overnight.

For this reason, I believe the corrosion resistance of stainless far outweighs any performance advantage of Aogami Super or the other popular steels for use in traditional style knives.

I understand it is no longer a Santuko but an inbred bastard child. I understand I have combined church and state and pissed off the purists but I am talking about cooking, not religion. No need to be clutching at our pearls because we are departing from the traditional pattern!
Click to expand...
The santoku rules supreme in most Japanese homes, is stainless, and rarely costs them more than $50, so anything approaching $300 will probably buy you damascus--or some rare steel--light weight, with a wa handle: an artisan knife. You can find a good selection of Westernized and Artisan santokus at Cutlery and More here in the USA. In Japan, you might find some helpful information and great knives at Sakai Ichimonji Mitsuhide:

global.ichimonji.co.jp

Sakai Ichimonji Mitsuhide : Premium Japanese Knives from Osaka

From 1953 to today, Sakai Ichimonji Mitsuhide has been connecting home cooks and professional chefs to sharpness through Japanese knives from the heart of Osaka! We carry over 2,000 types of Sakai made knives. We ship internationally, so give your cooking a big boost with our amazing sharpness...
global.ichimonji.co.jp global.ichimonji.co.jp
 
I think you can do much better than Hocho for Japanese knives both for information and price. Compare wth alternative providers who don't mislead with promotional gimmicks.
 
Thanks for the help, Doctor. This looks like a fairly typical item; 170 mm., AUS-8 blade, 125 grams, magnolia handle. I really love to sharpen, so the AUS-8 will not present a problem. I can probably use some practice freehanding the appropriate low angle, so this plan is truly coming together!


That looks like what an academic might call a Japanese knife (except for maybe the plastic in the handle) so it should be a fair guide to whether I want to spring for an uptown version someday.

I talked to the cooks at my favorite Japanese restaurant about this, and they chuckled and showed off a motley collection of "workers" with metal bolsters and thick, stainless, industrial blades, and just a few fine blades of various styles, kept seperately, for the expert jobs. No Damascus, no hammered finished that I saw.
 
I think that posted kitchen knife would be perfect for you as a starter.

They have a section in their website where the local Japanese chefs show the knife models they use. I think you'd find it interesting.

I just ordered a kitchen knife from Sakai Ichimonji Mitsuhide a few minutes ago--a gyuto. My Japanese former student bought a gift knife from the Osaka store for me last Fall--and ever since I've been trying to purchase this "sold out" model. When I contacted them by chat, they found one for me. I intend to use it for an evaluation project on cultural fusion.
 
Should be able to find something fairly easy in the $100-150 range for something like that. Gin3, VG5, VG10 I think be the most common stainless. You may also be able to consider a stainless cladded carbon steel blade, where only the core steel is reactive, as the maintenance is much easier than a carbon/iron cladding blade, or less expensive monosteel. I much prefer the forged blades, if I'm getting a Japanese knife.

All of the places I found with good Japanese kitchen knives are not forum dealerships so I can't post links.

Uptown Cutlery
Chef Knives to Go
Bernal Street Cutlery
Knife Japan (direct from Japan, mostly carbon steel knives)
 
Dr. Rayeye said:
I think that posted kitchen knife would be perfect for you as a starter.

They have a section in their website where the local Japanese chefs show the knife models they use. I think you'd find it interesting.

I just ordered a kitchen knife from Sakai Ichimonji Mitsuhide a few minutes ago--a gyuto. My Japanese former student bought a gift knife from the Osaka store for me last Fall--and ever since I've been trying to purchase this "sold out" model. When I contacted them by chat, they found one for me. I intend to use it for an evaluation project on cultural fusion.
Click to expand...

It came to $87 US shipped to San Diego. They say it will be here in four days!

I am planning to use it a lot, side by side with a Mizabi Aristocrat 7" santoku which weighs about 210 grams. If I fall in love with the new one, I will consider upgrading the handle, or the whole knife!
 
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Here is the knife I ordered two days ago. It took a little under 48 hours to get from Ichimonji in Osaka, Japan, to me in San Diego, CA USA. The modern world continues to blow me away! How do they do it?!?! Cost was $13,618.

That's in yen. $13,618 is the cost in yen. It cost (including about $25 for shipping) $87 US.

The blade is AUS-8, with bevels on both sides and a 168 mm./6 5/8" cutting edge. It is a svelte 1.85 mm thick at the spine, and it weighs a tidy 114 grams.

The magnolia handle was pretty smooth and well fit, but it was not sealed (This was noted on the website.). I saw this as an opportunity to dye the handle blue. It will need a few coats of a poly/oil sealer before it is ready to cook. The handle is comfortable, plain but attractive enough, and practically weightless.

It sliced paper towels and kleenex out of the box.

The balance point is easily an inch forward of any of the Westernized santoku's I've been using for years, well forward of the heel! The light weight and more forward balance are very obvious. If I didn't know what to expect, my instinct would have been "This feels like a toy." but that would be a reflection of my "Too much is not enough" background. I am learning that a lighter tool is not necessarily inferior to a heavier tool.

I am looking forward to making a big, really big salad when I have the handle sealed up!

I will be doing a side-by-each comparison with the Miyabi Aristocrat (210 grams) and this thirty-year-old Solingen (185 grams).

Yt96IAR.jpg


I think the Ichimonji has already won the beauty part of the contest. That baby has grace! That Ichimonji has grace up the ying-yang! I like the way the spine tapers down at the tip, the generous knuckle clearance, it has all the understated elegance of a little black dress.

Try to find a little black dress for $87. It is not gonna happen.

Even without having cut anything, I think the difference in feel is going to be worth the time and energy expended.

And I really like this knife already. I have to thank DR. Rayeye for steering me to the vendor! I'm already eyeing a few more items, all out of stock!
 
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Khromo said:
HxrxrN5.jpg


EvdS9mX.jpg


R63BRbI.jpg


Here is the knife I ordered on Monday afternoon. It took a little under two days to get from Ichimonji in Osaka, Japan, to San Diego, CA USA. The modern world continues to blow me away! Cost was $13,618.

That's in yen. $13,618 is the cost in yen. It cost (including about $25 for shipping) $87 US.

The blade is AUS-8, with bevels on both sides and a 168 mm./6 5/8" cutting edge. It is a svelte 1.85 mm thick at the spine, and it weighs a tidy 114 grams.

The magnolia handle was pretty smooth and well fit, but it was not sealed (This was noted on the website.). I saw this as an opportunity to dye the handle blue. It will need a few coats of a poly/oil sealer before it is ready to cook. The handle is comfortable, plain but attractive enough, and practically weightless.

It easily sliced paper towels and kleenex out of the box.

The balance point is easily an inch forward of any of the Westernized santoku's I've been using for years, well forward of the heel! The light weight and more forward balance are very obvious. I am looking forward to making a big, really big salad when I have the handle sealed up!

I will be doing a side-by-each comparison with the Miyabi Aristocrat (210 grams) and the thirty-year-old Solingen (185 grams).

Yt96IAR.jpg


I think the Ichimonji has already won the beauty part of the contest. That baby has grace! That Ichimonji has grace up the ying-yang! I like the way the spine tapers down at the tip, the generous knuckle clearance, it has all the understated elegance of a little black dress.

Try to find a little black dress for $87. It is not gonna happen.

Even without having cut anything, I think the difference in feel is going to be worth the time and energy expended.

And I really like this knife already. I have to thank DR. Rayeye for steering me to the vendor! I'm already eyeing a few more items, all out of stock!
Click to expand...
Looks great! Mine comes tomorrow. If you want more information, feel free to chat with them--ask for Brad Jolly. He's been very helpful
 
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