My new design - R-1 Radical fighting hawk

idaho

idaho

Joined
May 5, 2005
Messages
955
I wanted to show you my new hawk.

LR-0112.jpg


Lightweight, hand to hand combat oriented.
8mm thick 4340 steel (like always), about 450grams (1 pound) and 320mm(13 inches) long.
micarta handle slabs over skeletonized tang.

I wanted to make something completely different than anything available.
Short, compact, and with carefully thought-out every angle and line.
and... I've made a have which turned out to be almost identical to Iranian bronze age hawk - like four thousands years old design. This is what I call NEW :D
102736_2.jpg


Anyway.

Hawk is optimized for fighting (based on McLemore "Fighting tomahawk")and works great.
Whether is is cut, chop, jab or rake - there will be excellent cutting power.
Edge geometry causes "guillotine style" effect - deep hit is started on the tip and is continued on very small area each moment.
Car hood, wooden door, zombie skull - penetration up to the handle every time.
Side effect - it is useless for utility work :D Will not chop wood at all.

13934957_533569163498346_322748359310409455_n.jpg
 
That deep bit reminds me of a Francisca which is, to me, the most aesthetic axe-like implement ever made. I like how you steered away from the "well beaten path", I rarely take a 2nd look at any tactical tomahawk (anything "tactical" for that matter), but this one is original, so I did :). Guess I like some curves on my blades and less ugly angles :P, and yours fits the bill :). Nice.
 
Not to derail the thread, but something I've always wondered about these smaller, lighter hawks (even after I've got a custom one myself - but that one is rather useful for smaller wood chopping chores as well) is whether they would have any advantage versus a big knife in a hypothetical self defense scenario (forget guns, I don't want to go there). I'm no real, nor mall ninja :) so I'm at loss answering my own question :). Any thoughts on this?
 
I would sure hate to get hit with that thing!
 
Moonw said:
Not to derail the thread, but something I've always wondered about these smaller, lighter hawks (even after I've got a custom one myself - but that one is rather useful for smaller wood chopping chores as well) is whether they would have any advantage versus a big knife in a hypothetical self defense scenario (forget guns, I don't want to go there). I'm no real, nor mall ninja :) so I'm at loss answering my own question :). Any thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
I don't have a hawk yet so take it with an ocean full of salt water.

The edge is smaller than a knife's also behind that edge in the direction of the movement you have much more mass than on a knife. Basically deeper penetration or easier penetration of tough materials like winter clothes and skulls :-o
The head being forward of the handle will allow you to hit the target with your wrist not being overextended. That allows you to hit harder and faster and if you use it often prevents carpal tunnel and other issues ;-)
The spike on the back allows for easier and a little bit faster return strikes.
 
Moonw said:
Not to derail the thread, but something I've always wondered about these smaller, lighter hawks (even after I've got a custom one myself - but that one is rather useful for smaller wood chopping chores as well) is whether they would have any advantage versus a big knife in a hypothetical self defense scenario (forget guns, I don't want to go there). I'm no real, nor mall ninja :) so I'm at loss answering my own question :). Any thoughts on this?
Click to expand...

For a DUEL - I would choose a long blade, because of agility, dexterity, and a pointy tip, which allows you to keep distance.
But for a combat - where there is no choice of environment, and aim is to quickly overwhelm the enemy - a hawk.
 
Fair points, Idaho. I may have underestimated what a lighter, fast hawk can do. Time to do some tests of my own :).
 
Defiantly ready. I want one. I use similar designs and all of our Major name Hawks but this is something that I really like in a head/handle design for training to disable opponent without firearm. That long bit is hard to find without self customization. Looks like a great hawk to be effective with most techniques.
 
IMHO the short overall length combined with the light head reduces the penetrating force compared to that of the same head on a longer handle.
Very light “battle axe” heads are indeed thousands of years old, but those had longer and straight handles.
The most recent, widespread military use of those in Europe was that of the ‘fokos’, commonly used during the Hungarian uprising lead by Ferenc Rákóczi II in the early 18th century, both by the light cavalry and infantry of the ‘kuruc’ freedom fighters.

Also, I think the curved handle locks the grip in a certain position and the spike is reduced to a slashing implement rather than a penetrating impact point.
Consider the difference between a short vs. longer handled framing hammer.
Did you consider a version with a straight and slightly longer handle (45-50 cm)?. It will be still much shorter than a fokos.
I know nowadays photogenic looks and clever advertising sell more products than functional designs, and most of these “pocket hawks” will be purchased by collectors, but maybe you can offer a straight handled combat version for military personnel too. ;)
 
Here is a picture of a heavy fokos and a spiked war hammer:

http://m.cdn.blog.hu/si/sirasok/image/Fonyód/fokos.jpg

Note the downward facing edge of the axe part. Most fokos had a more forward facing edge.

This type of fokos is called ‘czekan’ in Polish, and interestingly the similarly sounding Hungarian word ‘csákány’ is used to denote the spiked war hammer (called ‘nadziak’ in Polish) rather than the axe/fokos.

Here is the pic of a reproduction Scythian light battle axe:

http://www.turania.hu/catalog/image/cache/catalog/img/fokos_12-240x320.JPG

It has also a more downward facing edge.
 
I like this R-1 Radical fighting hawk,be sure to keep us posted.:thumbup:
 
Jens Schuetz said:
Yeah. But will we still be laughing when he grows up, starts a big knife company and makes millions?
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Being successful at business very more often indicates a person's willingness to do and sacrifice anything for money rather than their humanity or emotional maturity, so yes I will still be laughing. If anything I stay as far away from people who get their sense of self-worth from money and material objects as I possibly can because they are usually the most shallow and petty humans there are......

As far as being related to axes goes, I would much rather hang out with someone who has a few axes and uses them in traditional daily activities than someone who collects them because of their style, because they resemble something in a comic-book or video-game etc.. It is just like someone who buys a base pickup truck because they actually have work to do with it, and someone who buys one which spends it's life with a cover over the bed and a loud aftermarket exhaust which never stops screaming "look at me".

I view fashion as a destructive force in society, it is simply a falsehood and disintegrates any facet of life it invades.
 
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idaho said:
I wanted to show you my new hawk.

LR-0112.jpg


Lightweight, hand to hand combat oriented.
8mm thick 4340 steel (like always), about 450grams (1 pound) and 320mm(13 inches) long.
micarta handle slabs over skeletonized tang.

Anyway.
Click to expand...


gben said:
How most people see the owner's of "hawks" like this:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPPj6viIBmU
Click to expand...


You likened this tool that he researched, developed, and created from start to finish a meme-worthy video?

This is link to a better place to share that kind of thing:

Like-minded tool oriented people




That took energy on your part to type up there Gben.


It's only raining where you are.
 
Jens Schuetz said:
Yeah. But will we still be laughing when he grows up, starts a big knife company and makes millions?
Click to expand...

Well yeaaah, I bet Lynn Thompson's start was just as unimpressive :D. (That kid has cemented a place in Internet history, and what saved some of us (excluding all you fine gents of course :) ) from some embarrassment during our younger years was the more humble technology available...:P)

[L.E.] I did not fully get the vibe in Gben's original comment. I don't see the need for disparaging one's efforts, I don't see anything flawed with the design to warrant any critique, let alone a less ceremonious one. If anything, Idaho sounds like a good dude.
 
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But its handle isn't wood and it looks slightly different from the approved ax designs supported by the Council of Elders! Mnah! Mnah, I say! :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Looks like a solid fighting design to me, with some historical precedence. It's actually less funky than the Iranian ax. I am curious how the edge being that far forward will affect how it handles impact, but it gives a looooot of hooking ability to catch and re-direct limbs and necks.
 
gben said:
Being successful at business very more often indicates a person's willingness to do and sacrifice anything for money rather than their humanity or emotional maturity, so yes I will still be laughing. If anything I stay as far away from people who get their sense of self-worth from money and material objects as I possibly can because they are usually the most shallow and petty humans there are......

As far as being related to axes goes, I would much rather hang out with someone who has a few axes and uses them in traditional daily activities than someone who collects them because of their style, because they resemble something in a comic-book or video-game etc.. It is just like someone who buys a base pickup truck because they actually have work to do with it, and someone who buys one which spends it's life with a cover over the bed and a loud aftermarket exhaust which never stops screaming "look at me".

I view fashion as a destructive force in society, it is simply a falsehood and disintegrates any facet of life it invades.
Click to expand...

Good thing I was laying on my couch when I read this. Lol. :stupid:

How did we get to this?
 
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