New car / automobile buying & leasing tips for CPK'ers

Lorien, first and foremost major congrats :thumbsup:

I'd be interested to know as to how you find its AWD capabilities as you put it through its paces. Before I got (leased) my current Acura MDX SH-AWD, I was thinking about the newer body of your rig (the new Ridgeline) because I've been a very, very happy Honda (and by extension Acura) owner. I was thinking Ridgeline because that was the only model which Honda was prepared to deal on vs the new Passport which there were no deals and I didnt want the soccer-mom Pilot models. I wanted a truck because I could do more with it and the Dog but Accuracies was giving away MDXs on their lease programs. All that said, I find the MDX more on the feminine side so I'll probably be sourcing a truck soon.

One can't touch a darn used Taco (Toyota Tacoma) in the used market as they go for an alarm, a leg and a kidney! Better off to get it new or lease/buy end of lease. BTW on the subject of leasing, some states like CA are leasing "friendly" which means the sales tax is charged monthly on the payments which makes a lot more sense as opposed to states which are unfriendly by charging the entire sales tax upfront. Of course if one intends to buy at the end of lease, that becomes kinda moot but like in my case, I'd probably just walk away from this somewhat feminine MDX either before or at the lease's maturity.
 
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for the dog, the back seat folding up out of the way was a big part of the decision. I also like the sealed compartment under the bed, which adds a little over 8 cubic feet of capacity. Handling wise, I drove in pretty shitty conditions last night- lots of rain- and definitely pushed it pretty hard over the Malahat. It felt very solid in the corners, very stiff and the independent suspension felt amazing. It's very comfortable to sit in and it handles a little like a car. I don't expect it to see much more than logging roads, but I don't doubt its abilities for light offroad stuff. It's definitely a luxury vehicle, with dual climate controls, heated seats, power sunroof and windows and leather interior, (which was a deciding factor wrt pooch). I prefer the look of the older model, as the new one looks like a regular pickup. I don't get too hung up on looks, but this thing reminds me of Deckard's rig and that's cool
 
also, I never had a vehicle that I could unlock remotely. This one has the added bonus for the lazy asshole to also put your windows down before you get there. Obviously for California mall goers, lol
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Lorien said:
for the dog, the back seat folding up out of the way was a big part of the decision. I also like the sealed compartment under the bed, which adds a little over 8 cubic feet of capacity. Handling wise, I drove in pretty shitty conditions last night- lots of rain- and definitely pushed it pretty hard over the Malahat. It felt very solid in the corners, very stiff and the independent suspension felt amazing. It's very comfortable to sit in and it handles a little like a car. I don't expect it to see much more than logging roads, but I don't doubt its abilities for light offroad stuff. It's definitely a luxury vehicle, with dual climate controls, heated seats, power sunroof and windows and leather interior, (which was a deciding factor wrt pooch). I prefer the look of the older model, as the new one looks like a regular pickup. I don't get too hung up on looks, but this thing reminds me of Deckard's rig and that's cool
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I agree Lorien, that model is nicer looking than the new ones! They are a great truck, enjoy!
 
Lorien said:
haha:D

the Ridgeline is an HDFK of pickup trucks
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Yessir, very versatile :)

I owned it's sister production model, the 2014 Honda Pilot, the boxy model before Honda butchered it IMHO and went with the soccer-mom pleasing new body in 2016. Had mine been an AWD, I would've still kept it. There is not need for an AWD here in So. Cali but it's a nice feature to have when you wanna go a bit off the freeway to say some camping site or some outdoor and natural shooting range on gravel roads in our southern deserts!

Oh, I forgot! You don't like shooting guns :p
 
Casinostocks said:
Yessir, very versatile :)

I owned it's sister production model, the 2014 Honda Pilot, the boxy model before Honda butchered it IMHO and went with the soccer-mom pleasing new body in 2016. Had mine been an AWD, I would've still kept it. There is not need for an AWD here in So. Cali but it's a nice feature to have when you wanna go a bit off the freeway to say some camping site or some outdoor and natural shooting range on gravel roads in our southern deserts!

Oh, I forgot! You don't like shooting guns :p
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who said I don't like shooting guns?
 
Update:
Buyer Beware!
CarFax is not always CORRECT about what it said concerning your vehicle you bought, if it was used.

Remember the great deal I got on a 2017 RAM 3500 4x4?
The one I “thought I stole”?
Uh huh, well guess what?
I took my 2017 RAM Turbocharged Cummins 6.7 with Aisin transmission now with 26000 miles to a different dealership than where I bought it as I could feel an odd vibration and looseness in the steering. After fighting the selling dealership since end of October to fix it, I went to the “big city” and another RAM dealer for service and repair under Bumper to Bumper warranty.
After waiting half the day last week in the cozy customer lounge, the Service Manager says
“we found the PROBLEM!” & can you wait another 2 hours, the Regional Service Manager is coming in from Albq. and needs to speak with you about your truck...

Long story but basically the previous owner was in a collision (not reported on the CarFax)
and at that time he had this truck towed into their place for repairs. The regional Service Manager personally had inspected it, & took photos, (July 2019) and they told him he was out of luck for any repair or replacement as it was collision damage, & not manufacturer defects, to go to a body shop, and call insurance companies...

In a nutshell he then took it to a “lowlife” auto body repair shop that replaced the damaged body and repainted everything from the collision, but that was all he did. Then he took it to a local dealership (where I bought it) he had never claimed it on the insurance, and he traded it in.

The Regional Service Manager tells me “your truck has PREEXISTING FRAME DAMAGE” and I have photos from when previous owner was here right after the collision, photos that I will give you,
but you were possibly DEFRAUDED and you might need an attorney’s representation...

So today making contact with the owner of the selling dealership himself again,
I made him a proposition
to reconcile things, in my favor and possibly his...
(I had traded my nice 2012 TOYOTA FJ Cruiser in for the RAM, the selling slime ball dealer still has it on the lot .

I told the owner that “I have contacted the NM State Attorney General office and I filed a claim for FRAUD against your business”. “I also consulted with a Law Firm and they want to take on the case,
and I have scheduled to meet with them this Thursday in Albuquerque”.
“I also believe I have a strong case against you, you in fact sold me a vehicle with preexisting frame and collision damage that was not on the CARFAX nor was it reported to insurance by the VIN.
I was defrauded”

I offered him this -
I will accept back my trade vehicle the Toyota if it is in the same “great” condition and similar mileage as when I traded it in, but I want:
“THE TITLE FREE AND CLEAR” in return for not pursuing a fraud case against you and your dealership, in court”...

Silence, he paused. I then reminded him I am a disabled combat Veteran and do not think it will go well in court, and this could drag out for years to come...
He is still silent here, “pin drops”... He then says “how much did you owe on your FJ when traded in for the RAM?” I tell him $11000. He goes silent again...
I then say that this is “nothing compared to a potentially lost fraud case in court, that if we go to court, I am seeking damages and compensation for the time, hassles, and aggravations, plus FRAUD, which could be 4 times more than the $11000 we are talking now.”

HE pauses then says “Let’s do this”...!
He says also that since first speaking with me, he found a buyer for the dealership in question and is selling the dealership this Friday & that he will meet me this Friday, I can return the frame damaged RAM 3500 and he will have the Toyota detailed and waiting at our meeting!

So, I will get my FJ Cruiser back, and with TITLE free and clear!
Saved me $11000 and going to court to sue him...
I also now think he may not have been able to finalize his sale of the dealership with my pending FRAUD case coming, so he took the deal I offered him!

Lesson learned for me here
“DO NOT TRUST CARFAX” &
“If it seems to good to be true, it PROBABLY is!”

Once I get my sweet Toyota back & I have the clear title in my name,
I may pursue all the advice here from Casino and look for an “end of the year discounted deal” on a new RAM, but now at least I have options again, am back where I started in October, and will have a “paid off” truck, that the dealership paid off, & not me... ;)

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So, thanks guys, I hope that somehow this post helps someone somewhere someday!
What a f&$#ing hassle this has all been, but my persistence paid off...finally.
 
^ Mike, I'm sorry that you had to learn in a hard way that CarFax is not always accurate. Only insurance companies report repairs to CarFax when they have to pay above and over the deductible. This is why you must alway, Always, ALWAYS check out a used car / truck before buying it. Having come from the other end of the fence, I know that it can be irritating and annoying to aa seller to be put through the wringer, when a buyer negotiates the price and then takes to a mechanic AND in most likelihood comes back again re-negotiate the previously negotiated price ( :D ) but I feel that reasonable people can always mitigate as long as the buyer is genuine and doesn't give the seller the run around either.

Now I am very lucky to have the kick and the knowhow to just look at a car and immediately see things like previous bodywork, bond, overspray, orange-peel and wonky/wavy metalwork, but most peep are not! You can also buy those gadgets which test the paint on the panels for uniformity and immediately alarm you when panel/panels are off! Still nothing like putting a rig up on the hoist to look from underneath!

Those RAMs are built like tanks so I am very surprised to hear that the frame (rails?) were damaged on a body-on-chassis rig and I'm actually surprised that airbags were not deployed (or maybe they were). I honestly view your situation as being some of this and some of that but the most crucial fact being that your seller should have absolutely disclosed the frame damage to you because as you found out: frame issues, true-miles-unknown and salvage titles including theft and flood damage will void warranties, although damaged frame doesn't always end up in voiding out the manufacturer's warranty.

Word of advice: this dealer seems to be very skeezy so protect yourself and find out if he's already in escrow or what not. Big franchise dealers (not so much the Mom-Pop types) have clauses in their insurance to cover for such litigious matters even if/when they sell the business.

I wish you the best my CPK brethren.

PS. RAM dealer/factory was also chicken-BLEEP for not addressing the transmission issues for the first owner because this issue could've been mutually exclusive. I have had these older RAMs and friends with them too, so I know that they have had issues but I don't feel like writing a whole War & Peace piece about them!
 
Casinostocks said:
^ Mike, I'm sorry that you had to learn in a hard way that CarFax is not always accurate. Only insurance companies report repairs to CarFax when they have to pay above and over the deductible. This is why you must alway, Always, ALWAYS check out a used car / truck before buying it. Having come from the other end of the fence, I know that it can be irritating and annoying to aa seller to be put through the wringer, when a buyer negotiates the price and then takes to a mechanic AND in most likelihood comes back again re-negotiate the previously negotiated price ( :D ) but I feel that reasonable people can always mitigate as long as the buyer is genuine and doesn't give the seller the run around either.

Now I am very lucky to have the kick and the knowhow to just look at a car and immediately see things like previous bodywork, bond, overspray, orange-peel and wonky/wavy metalwork, but most peep are not! You can also buy those gadgets which test the paint on the panels for uniformity and immediately alarm you when panel/panels are off! Still nothing like putting a rig up on the hoist to look from underneath!

Those RAMs are built like tanks so I am very surprised to hear that the frame (rails?) were damaged on a body-on-chassis rig and I'm actually surprised that airbags were not deployed (or maybe they were). I honestly view your situation as being some of this and some of that but the most crucial fact being that your seller should have absolutely disclosed the frame damage to you because as you found out: frame issues, true-miles-unknown and salvage titles including theft and flood damage will void warranties, although damaged frame doesn't always end up in voiding out the manufacturer's warranty.

Word of advice: this dealer seems to be very skeezy so protect yourself and find out if he's already in escrow or what not. Big franchise dealers (not so much the Mom-Pop types) have clauses in their insurance to cover for such litigious matters even if/when they sell the business.

I wish you the best my CPK brethren.

PS. RAM dealer/factory was also chicken-BLEEP for not addressing the transmission issues for the first owner because this issue could've been mutually exclusive. I have had these older RAMs and friends with them too, so I know that they have had issues but I don't feel like writing a whole War & Peace piece about them!
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Thank you Sir!
I wholeheartedly agree with you! I leaned a lot from your thread, and now realize that that little “10 minute test ride” around the vicinity of dealerships is not enough time to evaluate a potential hauling vehicle as being “okay or worthy”. I need to ask in the future something like “ can I take it for the weekend, keep my trade vehicle here, if all goes well, we will work it out when I come back on Monday, but to take it out On The Highway too, Or fully loaded down and up to like 65-70 mph if considering a used vehicle.
This RAM once it was connected and loaded up with over 10000 lbs of firewood with a gooseneck trailer or my bumper hitch trailer, showed the problems only then...
I was all set for a new lower control arm, & bushing and a steering stabilizer until they took it apart to add those parts:
that is when they noticed the frame damage at the lower control arm mount point...
Thank you Sir, & this is a great thread!
 
you have to be careful about how you phrase things like that. Your wording may have met the legal definition for extortion and could have gotten you into some trouble too.

You wanted someone to do something and you threatened them with something to get them to do it. That is a minefield.
 
Nathan the Machinist said:
you have to be careful about how you phrase things like that. Your wording may have met the legal definition for extortion and could have gotten you into some trouble too.

You wanted someone to do something and you threatened them with something to get them to do it. That is a minefield.
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Thank you Sir-
Impeach me!
 
Nathan the Machinist said:
you have to be careful about how you phrase things like that. Your wording may have met the legal definition for extortion and could have gotten you into some trouble too.

You wanted someone to do something and you threatened them with something to get them to do it. That is a minefield.
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Finding out, after the facts, that the used vehicle which you (the general U) had bought had undisclosed frame damage is very jarring to the average Joe! One feels cheated, duped, taken, defrauded, driving his/her family in a "death trap", etc... No bueno for one's psyche so Mike naturally got all hot and bothered and not for naught! But as always your words are sage words Kemosabe!

Sometimes or rather very often the auction houses announce "frame damage" on many vehicles (specially fleet & lease returns) specially if bank / finance co owned assets that were involved even in the slightest fender-bender, if shows on CarFax or caught by those who check-in the vehicles. Some ofd these framers are just ticky-tack BS because no real structural damage has been caused to the vehicle but the bank / finance co doesn't want any liability. The dealer who buys the said vehicle knows this but will not disclose and if every consumer had access to the internal auction papers, then we would see a whole host of law suits for undisclosed "facts". Many franchise dealers do not buy vehicles announced as frames but will let a proxy buyer to buy and then sell to them to wash that announcement off and be removed one more step from the potential headache. An aggressive and well adept atty can cause hell for a dealership! Little guys (mom & pop types) often will have to buy vehicles with announcements because otherwise they will not have any inventory. Very rarely they disclose!

About 15 years ago down here in San Diego there was a big scandal whereby a dealer had gotten in with one of the guys who used to be the head tech and condition report person for FMCC (Ford Motor Credit Corp) and since they were in cahoots, he'd write frame-damage announcement on certain vehicles which were in reality all kosher and then that dealer would end up buying at a discount. This thing finally caught up with them because the other dealers/buyers were no idiots and could see that the announcements were bogus. The crooked dealer made over a million in profits, no arrests, no prosecution, just got booted out. The tech lost his job and was banished. I doubt that the crooked dealer even took care of the tech guy after he was blacklisted. It's like when bank employees skim from banks: most cases are handled internally!
 
Nathan the Machinist said:
you have to be careful about how you phrase things like that. Your wording may have met the legal definition for extortion and could have gotten you into some trouble too.

You wanted someone to do something and you threatened them with something to get them to do it. That is a minefield.
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I’m joking on the “impeachment comment above, I have a “twisted Sense of humor”,
but honestly what you said too Nathan is absolutely correct, and I need to watch my wording in future situations.
The owner of the dealership had ask me “what do you want”, and I should have added that to my post above, much appreciate your courteous reminder, and add to what CasinoStocks said about not being an asshole or an irrate loud jerk of a customer.
A voice in my head way back there somewhere told me “ it will work out, stay cool, don’t yell, watch what you say”.
So thank you Nathan, that is great advice there that I did not realize I said it that that way until your post, it is much appreciated!
I still can’t believe that in less than 5 minutes by ME remaining calm and focused on resolving things ending the nightmare, he accepted my offer, and the “skies parted, the sun came back out overhead, and everything would be just fine.”
Lesson learned once again for me-
don’t be a dick...
 
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