One set of stones or two (VG-10 to Maxamet)

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David Richardson

Joined
Nov 30, 2018
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498
A lot of steels. The question is one set of stones or two? Maybe Shapton Glass if I go with one set? Currently using an EdgePro for the harder stuff. Would like to start using bench stones more for everything.

One set of stones is easier to manage and I don't have to switch stones while sharpening. Splash and go with the Shaptons is nice. Two sets likely gets me better results and is less expensive.
 
I would look into getting the Venev stones from gritomatic if you want stones for the Edge Pro or I would contact DeadboxHero on this site and ask him about his new diamond bench stones he's releasing very soon.

DeadboxHero's stones are a resin stone and if they are anything like a Venev stone they will wear for an extremely long time.

I have a Spyderco in Maxamet and I would not use the Shapton Glass or any Shapton stone on Maxamet,the Shapton stones are just aluminum oxide and it's to soft to abrade the vanadium carbide in Maxamet.

@DeadboxHero jump in and help David out.
 
Thanks. Not looking for EP stones. I'm well covered there. Looking for bench stones and just needed a recommendation for one or two sets.

I could go with diamond matrix. That would mean two sets as I'd rather not them for most non-vanadium steels. I get that Shapton Glass likely would not do Maxamet. The glass stones are fine with some other high-vanadium steels, but agree that they would not do well on Maxamet.

Probably should not have mentioned Maxamet in the title. Saying I want to sharpen it means the answer will be diamond stones. Let's say these stones should be able to do S90V or hard 4V and leave Maxamet off the list.
 
For high alloy steels.
Ultrasharp 300/1200, Spyderco UF ceramic strop with 1 micron diamond compound.

Low alloy steels.
Naniwa Pro 400
Naniwa Aotoshi 2000
Atoma 140 for lapping.
 
Jason B. said:
FYI, once a steel reaches 4% Vanadium content just switch to diamonds. It will make the question "what stones should I use" that much easier
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I'm there. I slept on this and woke up asking myself why I'd ever use anything other than diamond matrix stones for my high alloy steels. I use them for all the high alloy steels on my EdgePro and could not be happier with the edges. They're game changers. No idea why I didn't go there first with bench stones. If I get those I just need to cover low allow steels. Many options for those.

The green brick (Aotoshi) is an interesting recommendation. I'll so some reading on it.

Edit: guessing I was looking for other options due to the lack of availability for diamond matrix bench stones. I assumed they're hard to find. If I don't find some I'll see what BBB comes up with.
 
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Could do that. Non high-alloy steels tend to load my EP matrix stones more quickly and it seems like they don't cut as well on the softer or lower-allow steels. I find using AlOx or SiC stones easier with the easier on the low allow steels.
 
Benchstones I'd probably keep a set of waterstones and a set of diamond plates on hand until bonded diamond/cbn benchstones become more widely available.
 
Good suggestion. I have some inexpensive diamond plates and also tried them on my EdgePro. Not a fan. No question they can cut but I dislike the edge they leave. The coarse plates leave a rough edge that takes forever to clean up. I know many people like them and they do work. You know... I'll sharpen my S35VN chef's knife on the plates tomorrow and see how it goes. It's been a while since I tried them.
 
I can't say anything about the Matrix stones I haven't tried them yet,but the Venev stones I have don't seem to load very much at all and the Metallic Bond CBN stones don't load at all they might get a bit of swarf in them but when I was them with Bar Keepers Friend a tiny bit comes off of them but it's more just an extremely small amount.

Contact DeadboxHero and ask about his diamond bench stones and what they work like,he won't steer you wrong and is very trusted on many forums.
If you want to pm him join the spyderco forum he has the same name over there as well.

David Richardson said:
Could do that. Non high-alloy steels tend to load my EP matrix stones more quickly and it seems like they don't cut as well on the softer or lower-allow steels. I find using AlOx or SiC stones easier with the easier on the low allow steels.
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wade7575 said:
I can't say anything about the Matrix stones I haven't tried them yet,but the Venev stones I have don't seem to load very much at all and the Metallic Bond CBN stones don't load at all they might get a bit of swarf in them but when I was them with Bar Keepers Friend a tiny bit comes off of them but it's more just an extremely small amount.

Contact DeadboxHero and ask about his diamond bench stones and what they work like,he won't steer you wrong and is very trusted on many forums.
If you want to pm him join the spyderco forum he has the same name over there as well.
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Yep. I know who he is. We're local to each other. He'll be at Blade West and has indicated he will have stones there. I'm looking at the Venev stones now.

Mr.Wizard said:
I haven't needed diamond for Paul Bos S30V so maybe at 4% some need it, some don't? I have yet to get my hands on M4 for example.
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Need is probably not the right word. I've sharpened Maxamet, S90V, K390, 10V, 4V, ZDP, and others with SiC and AlOx. You can get them sharp without diamonds. For me the diamond matrix stones changed my attitude about sharpening these steels. Faster, easier, and much better results. I use these for all my high-carbide steels.

That the guy who makes the EP matrix stones is active here and offers advice has helped with my success and enthusiasm. It's the stones + his recommended technique that really made the difference. (Edge trailing only after you apex, limited and alternating passes per side. I also don't apex with stones below ~200 grit or ~60 micron.)
 
My bench stones are going to happen, hopefully before the end of the year. I made the molds a year ago now and have pretty much everything else figured out, which is a lot. The last issue was my desire to hard anodize the aluminum backs so it is something I can offer as an upgrade, it definitely is a lot nicer than raw aluminum. I think I have figured out how to glue to the hard anodized surface, which is supposedly a very bad idea. You can mask a surface so it doesn't get anodized but that triples the price, which is already much higher than a type 1 anodize, so it's pretty much a deal killer for this. My first test went very well and the second test is in the oven right now doing the curing cycle. Right now my cnc mill is down getting the spindle rebuilt, to the tune of 10k when it is all said and done and I am doing nearly all the work. Once it is back up and running then I will be playing catch up for a while. Once they are for sale I will give BF members 1/3 off as an introductory offer to help get the word out, so stay tuned. Sorry to drag this out for so long but I am a one-person operation and it is a lot of development work to get to production.

Once the stones are in production then I will start working on the holders, with the 1x4 stone holders first, paddle and palm. All aluminum stone blanks are going to have a small dovetail cut into the ends for the holders I will make for them, small enough that they don't cause problems for other more conventional methods of holding them.
 
Thanks for jumping on the discussion. I was wondering if you were making the stones BBB is getting ready to sell. What you described sounds very nice and I'm interested to see these. My first thought when you mentioned the glue issue was to mill them on the inside. Then I realized you'd be milling, anodizing, and then milling off the anodizing. Not very practical or cost effective.

Yikes on the spindle rebuild. That is spendy, esp since you're doing most of the work.

I'm not in any hurry. I'll keep an eye on you to see when they're available.

PS: Diemaker has a pass-around of his EP stones. If you have an EP do yourself a favor and try these. I got impatient and bought them before the pass-around could get to me.
 
Milling the anodized face off would be a lot cheaper than masking it but tool life would be dismal, as in just a few parts per tool. That stuff is HARD! Is BBB doing resin bond or vitreous? I thought his stones were vitreous bond CBN or diamond, much harder in every respect.
 
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