Ontario Rat AUS-8 v. Ontario Rat D2...is it really worth it if you live in a moist climate zone?

L

Lasador

Joined
Sep 11, 2019
Messages
310
Everyone loves the Ontario Rat I & II knives, and I am definitely one of those people. So, when the hype for D2 began, I struggled with whether or not to purchase a Rat in D2. After all, Ontario does a terrific job with AUS-8, and it's also about $15.00 cheaper than the D2 version. Then, there is the issue of corrosion resistance of the D2 steel, which all evidence points to poor corrosion resistance for this steel. Being in a moist climate zone, this is problematic for me. Lastly, there is video evidence of AUS-8 outperforming D2 steel, at least in the Ontario Rat models. I just don't have the time for daily maintenance on my budget work knives. At the same time, I just do not like rusty knives. So, is it really worth it???

One of my previous threads touched on this issue, but I'd like this discussion to be more fully addressed and developed; and, hopefully, I will get enough information in order to decide whether or not to invest in a Ontario Rat D2.
 
I live in a fairly humid area. If I'm not going to use a knife in D2 for more than a week or two, I just run a little mineral oil over it. No problems thus far, been doing it for years. On the other hand, while I have both AUS8 and D2 versions, my AUS8 Rat 1 takes a great edge and sharpens easily. I don't mind sharpening it when it needs it.
 
Yeah, that makes perfect sense to me. I have several Rats in AUS-8, and I love them, but all the talk about the D-2 makes me feel like I'm missing out on something.
 
If you find yourself sharpening your AUS8 Rats more than you want to, then D2 will help some by holding the edge longer. If that's not an issue for you, you should be good to go with what you have. I'm not aware of any other real benefits to D2 over AUS8 except edge holding capability. You're not gonna be batoning with it or otherwise beating on it too hard, are you?

Lasador said:
Yeah, that makes perfect sense to me. I have several Rats in AUS-8, and I love them, but all the talk about the D-2 makes me feel like I'm missing out on something.
Click to expand...
 
I live in a perpetually humid environment (South Florida) a few minutes from the ocean, and I've never had an issue with D2 rusting. If you're really concerned, you can just coat the blade with something like WD40, mineral oil, or a more specific product like Tuf-Cloth.
 
My preference is D2.
If you fear humidity, rub a wax over the blade from time to time. Carnwax, floor wax, Renaissance wax, any wax designed as a protectant will perform better than an oil for staying in place.
 
I like the RATs, AUS 8 and D2. D2 is better IMHO and holds an edge better.
D2 is not exactly a carbon steel as it has enough chromium to be "somewhat" stainless.
My two homes are both within 100 yards of salt water and I adore carbon steel blades such as Becker's 1095 CroVan, 52100, Cold Steel's Carbon V and SK5. I have never had a problem with corrosion as I periodically wipe my blades with mineral oil as it is food safe. The only blade that had a good bit off patina on it in my beloved Cold Steel Master Hunter in Carbon V which is basically 1095 CroVan; the patina is from deer blood, not moisture.
I said all of that to say this: D2 to fine in humid environments, to include salt water humid environments.
If you are truly concerned, a tissue wipe with some mineral oil now and again will give you peace of mind and your knife will probably like it as well.
 
I posted the video in your other thread. I'll share it here too. This is a test from Outpost 76. He puts the same edge on both knives. He tapes off a 1" section of blade and cuts the same media the same way. He puts new edges on the knives until the test results are repeatable (getting past any effects from factory grinding). Based on averages from other tests using AUS-8 and Chinese D2, Ontario seems to do a nice job with both of these steels.

The surprising thing is that the AUS-8 did a better job than the D2 in this particular test. Of course, it should be noted that this test used a polished edge versus cardboard. Your results may vary depending on what kind of edge you put on your knife and what you are cutting with it. While someone pointed out that the Rats are made in Taiwan, there does seem to be a larger issue comparing hype to reality on Chinese D2. Possible issues include compositional variation and challenges with mass heat treatment. Some companies definitely seem to do better than others but overall, we've also seen Chinese D2 outcut by 9Cr18Mov and 14C28N.

As far as corrosion issues, I've experienced it but only in the summer. Summers are very humid where I live and I tend to sweat. Based on my experiences, putting in extra care doesn't always work and just ends up being annoying. So I don't carry my D2 knives in the summer.

 
rje58 said:
If you find yourself sharpening your AUS8 Rats more than you want to, then D2 will help some by holding the edge longer. If that's not an issue for you, you should be good to go with what you have. I'm not aware of any other real benefits to D2 over AUS8 except edge holding capability. You're not gonna be batoning with it or otherwise beating on it too hard, are you?
Click to expand...
No, I won't be batoning. I'm not really big into batoning with knives, but if I did, I would go with my ESEE Junglas, Becker BK2 or my BK7. Thanks again for the advice!
 
OrangeBlueOrangeBlue said:
I live in a perpetually humid environment (South Florida) a few minutes from the ocean, and I've never had an issue with D2 rusting. If you're really concerned, you can just coat the blade with something like WD40, mineral oil, or a more specific product like Tuf-Cloth.
Click to expand...
Interesting. South Florida is about as humid as you can get! I'm surprised it's holding up without regular maintenance there. I really am.
 
SOLEIL said:
If you take care of your knife it wont rust no matter what it is or where you're at. It is so simple. As basic as water is wet.
Click to expand...
That is true, and I do take care of my nicer knives like my PM2, Cold Steel AD10, etc. However, I'm always looking for some beaters that I don't have to put much time into maintaining but still can use frequently without rusting.
 
SALTY said:
I like the RATs, AUS 8 and D2. D2 is better IMHO and holds an edge better.
D2 is not exactly a carbon steel as it has enough chromium to be "somewhat" stainless.
My two homes are both within 100 yards of salt water and I adore carbon steel blades such as Becker's 1095 CroVan, 52100, Cold Steel's Carbon V and SK5. I have never had a problem with corrosion as I periodically wipe my blades with mineral oil as it is food safe. The only blade that had a good bit off patina on it in my beloved Cold Steel Master Hunter in Carbon V which is basically 1095 CroVan; the patina is from deer blood, not moisture.
I said all of that to say this: D2 to fine in humid environments, to include salt water humid environments.
If you are truly concerned, a tissue wipe with some mineral oil now and again will give you peace of mind and your knife will probably like it as well.
Click to expand...
Well, there's another vote for D2 holding up surprisingly well. Again, I'm impressed with everyone's praise of D2 steel. Thanks for the information!
 
Chronovore said:
I posted the video in your other thread. I'll share it here too. This is a test from Outpost 76. He puts the same edge on both knives. He tapes off a 1" section of blade and cuts the same media the same way. He puts new edges on the knives until the test results are repeatable (getting past any effects from factory grinding). Based on averages from other tests using AUS-8 and Chinese D2, Ontario seems to do a nice job with both of these steels.

The surprising thing is that the AUS-8 did a better job than the D2 in this particular test. Of course, it should be noted that this test used a polished edge versus cardboard. Your results may vary depending on what kind of edge you put on your knife and what you are cutting with it. While someone pointed out that the Rats are made in Taiwan, there does seem to be a larger issue comparing hype to reality on Chinese D2. Possible issues include compositional variation and challenges with mass heat treatment. Some companies definitely seem to do better than others but overall, we've also seen Chinese D2 outcut by 9Cr18Mov and 14C28N.

As far as corrosion issues, I've experienced it but only in the summer. Summers are very humid where I live and I tend to sweat. Based on my experiences, putting in extra care doesn't always work and just ends up being annoying. So I don't carry my D2 knives in the summer.

Click to expand...
Thanks again for posting this. This is the information and video that gave me pause about purchasing the Ontario Rat in D2 steel. It seems that there is at least argument to be made that Ontario's AUS-8 is just as good if not better than its D2 steel. The consensus appears to be that Ontario does a fabulous job with their AUS-8 steel. The test here is clear proof of that. The fact that the AUS-8 Rats outperformed the D2 Rats is simply remarkable. Excellent information once again, thank you.
 
SOLEIL said:
If you take care of your knife it wont rust no matter what it is or where you're at. It is so simple. As basic as water is wet.
Click to expand...

Sorry man, not true.

I also live in Florida. In addition to the perma heat and humidity here, I have really acidic sweat, and I sweat all day because of my job. I take care of my knives but I still fight rust, if it's a plain satin blade.

I vote to stay away from D2. Rat knives in Aus 8 perform very well!
 
Yeah, and I appreciate you saying this even though it won't be popular with the D2 fanboys. lol. I mean, for every one person that says D2 is fine in a humid climate, there seem to be 3-4 people who complain about the corrosiveness of D2 steel. And, maybe people have different experiences, I don't know, but I've hesitated more than once on D2. Maybe I'll just buy the Ontario Rat D2 with black coating. I wonder if that coating is any good or not? All of my other Rats are satin.
 
This is very true and great advice - UNLESS he will be using the knife for food prep. In that case, he would either need to 1. make sure the wax he is using is Food Safe or 2. use mineral oil instead.

CWL said:
My preference is D2.
If you fear humidity, rub a wax over the blade from time to time. Carnwax, floor wax, Renaissance wax, any wax designed as a protectant will perform better than an oil for staying in place.
Click to expand...
 
Lasador said:
Yeah, and I appreciate you saying this even though it won't be popular with the D2 fanboys. lol. I mean, for every one person that says D2 is fine in a humid climate, there seem to be 3-4 people who complain about the corrosiveness of D2 steel. And, maybe people have different experiences, I don't know, but I've hesitated more than once on D2. Maybe I'll just buy the Ontario Rat D2 with black coating. I wonder if that coating is any good or not? All of my other Rats are satin.
Click to expand...

For D2 to be a good deal versus another steel, the edge retention needs to be as much better as the corrosion resistance is worse.

It definitely is versus 8Cr13Mov or lesser steels. The trouble is that it isn't clear-cut versus AUS-8. Depending on individual heat treatments and such, there seems to be overlap in edge performance between Chinese D2 and AUS-8 with AUS-8 sometimes being better. It definitely isn't versus 9Cr18Mov and 14C28N, which are much more stainless and tend to offer better edge retention. A good coating can help to protect what it coats but I've wondered if corrosion affects the actual edge.
 
Yes, corrosion does affect the edge. I've got 1095 knives with coated blades and the only place that I ever see the beginnings of rust is - of course - the edge. Of course the more you use them and the better you maintain them, the less likelihood for this to occur. I don't see it often, but when out in the field for more than a day or two and not using the knife much, it can crop up pretty quick in humid conditions, especially if sweat or saltwater are in proximity. Or rarely when I come in from the field and don't maintain my blades right away. That's on me.

Chronovore said:
A good coating can help to protect what it coats but I've wondered if corrosion affects the actual edge.
Click to expand...
 
Just buy the AUS8 version and be done with it. When you get tired of sharpening your knife, then buy the D2 version.

In reality they’re both fine knives. You’ll be happy with either one of them.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top