Question for Mr. Glesser - compression lock/clips

[Candycane]

First, I can appreciate that many people might know the answer to the following questions but, while I am sure that there are many, I have no idea who here knows what they are talking about. That said, I’m not really asking for lots of opinions.


Dear Mr. Glesser,

I have been a customer for many years but am new to this forum. First, I just wanted to say that it’s great to see you so involved with your customers. Your passion is clearly still very much alive and well. Great to see!

Please forgive me for asking a question that I’m sure has been covered many times, but I have been unable to find your thoughts on these topics

First, with the compression lock, from my experience (I own around 30 PM2/PM2/Sage etc knives with compression locks) there is a fair amount of variability in the amount of “pop” or “stick” or whatever people call it when the lockbar is engaged and the user disengages it. On some of my knives there is zero stick no matter how hard I open the blade, and with others it is significant even when opening lightly. My sense is that all of these are within spec, and I certainly am not worried whatsoever that the ones with no stick do not keep the blade open as securely, but this has always been a question to me.

If you were to ask your staff to bring you a, say, PM2 for a gift for someone, what would your preference be regarding the stick? I have to assume that you might have a personal preference as the experience is a bit different.

Also, why not make deep carry clips? There are obviously plenty of after market options but, IMHO, none of them look like they came from Spyderco.

Thanks so much for your time.

 

[Danke42]

I have the PPT with the stock deep carry clip and I find it's harder to get out of a pocket. I prefer the clips like the PM2 has that leave a good chunk of knife exposed so I can grab it.

 

[SpyderPhreak]

Despite deep carry clips being a current fad, not everyone likes them. The target demographic for knife designs like the Military/PM2 likely prefer easier access to their knives, not deep carry to conceal them.

 

[Eljay2]

Despite deep carry clips being a current fad, not everyone likes them. The target demographic for knife designs like the Military/PM2 likely prefer easier access to their knives, not deep carry to conceal them.

Using the term "fad" is incorrect. Deep carry is a preference. I'm pretty confident that you won't be seeing Spyderco deep carry clips go away anytime soon. Would just be nice if they were offered on all models like some other companies. Some people don't want something that many people perceive as a weapon to be seen in their pocket. I appreciate your speculation, but can also appreciate the OP's question, which was directed to Sal. It's always interesting how people like to jump in to boost their posts, even after the OP directed the post to a specific person.

 

[Sal Glesser]

Hi Candycane,

We also have a forum on our own site.

On the question of stick? Compression Locks are very hard to make and the tolerances are very close. Different blade steels affect the lock bar differently. So, even though they are the same, they are different. In my experience, "stick" lessens or goes away with enough use. I like the blade to just drop once it's broken in. Some of the new models with pivots designed to hold that tolerance, like the new Sage FRN, will drop right out of the box. Others may take a little breaking in. If you are going to give one as a gift, you might mention that a break in period improves the breed. A little oil can help, but not too much. Most people that take them apart reduce the quality, so just break them in rather than try to improve them by taking them apart. Some are more capable than others at disassembly, but few are as good as the knife-makers that put them together.

On the clips; We make many models and many clips. It is really difficult for us to try to make different clips for different models. Just too much variety. Also there are many aftermarket makers making clips for our models, some as a part of their income. I would hate to take that away from them for a project that is difficult for us to do in the first place.
I hope that answers your questions?

sal

 

[SpyderPhreak]

Using the term "fad" is incorrect.

I disagree. That's my opinion, and I'm entitled to it, as you are yours.

Some people don't want something that many people perceive as a weapon to be seen in their pocket.

I can appreciate that, but if you're so worried about it, drop it all the way into your pocket.

... but can also appreciate the OP's question, which was directed to Sal. It's always interesting how people like to jump in to boost their posts, even after the OP directed the post to a specific person.

This is a public forum (that belongs to Spark), and if the OP didn't want anyone else to chime in, he could have simply e-mailed Sal, his e-mail address is easy enough to find online. Did the OP really think that nobody else would come in here and state their own opinion? I hope not, that wouldn't be terribly realistic.

It's interesting to me, how some people like to jump in and act like a white knight, when really there's nobody that needs "saving". BTW, I've been here quite awhile, and certainly have no need to boost my post count.

 

[Eljay2]

I disagree. That's my opinion, and I'm entitled to it, as you are yours.



I can appreciate that, but if you're so worried about it, drop it all the way into your pocket.



This is a public forum (that belongs to Spark), and if the OP didn't want anyone else to chime in, he could have simply e-mailed Sal, his e-mail address is easy enough to find online. Did the OP really think that nobody else would come in here and state their own opinion? I hope not, that wouldn't be terribly realistic.

It's interesting to me, how some people like to jump in and act like a white knight, when really there's nobody that needs "saving". BTW, I've been here quite awhile, and certainly have no need to boost my post count.

I disagree. That's my opinion, and I'm entitled to it, as you are yours.



I can appreciate that, but if you're so worried about it, drop it all the way into your pocket.



This is a public forum (that belongs to Spark), and if the OP didn't want anyone else to chime in, he could have simply e-mailed Sal, his e-mail address is easy enough to find online. Did the OP really think that nobody else would come in here and state their own opinion? I hope not, that wouldn't be terribly realistic.

It's interesting to me, how some people like to jump in and act like a white knight, when really there's nobody that needs "saving". BTW, I've been here quite awhile, and certainly have no need to boost my post count.

Deep carry clips have been around for years and it certainly seems like they are popular. May be why you're seeing them on more and more models across brands. You can say that Spyderco is catering to this "fad" but, at some point, I suppose most folks would accept that this is certainly not a fad.

I am well aware that this is a public forum. Any person who runs a fairly large company (e.g. Sal) usually gets a lot of email. I can appreciate that the OP wanted to ask Sal in a public forum so that more people could benefit from the time that Sal spent answering the question - just seems more respectful.

Yes, it is your right to have everyone hear your opinion, and it certainly helps explain your number of posts here. I'm sure you have a rebuttal but I'm going to spare everyone any more of this and let you continue to increase your post count.

 

[SpyderPhreak]

Deep carry clips have been around for years and it certainly seems like they are popular. May be why you're seeing them on more and more models across brands. You can say that Spyderco is catering to this "fad" but, at some point, I suppose most folks would accept that this is certainly not a fad.

I am well aware that this is a public forum. Any person who runs a fairly large company (e.g. Sal) usually gets a lot of email. I can appreciate that the OP wanted to ask Sal in a public forum so that more people could benefit from the time that Sal spent answering the question - just seems more respectful.

Yes, it is your right to have everyone hear your opinion, and it certainly helps explain your number of posts here. I'm sure you have a rebuttal but I'm going to spare everyone anymore more of this and let you continue to increase your post count.

 

[91bravo]

Deep carry clips have been around for years and it certainly seems like they are popular. May be why you're seeing them on more and more models across brands. You can say that Spyderco is catering to this "fad" but, at some point, I suppose most folks would accept that this is certainly not a fad.

I am well aware that this is a public forum. Any person who runs a fairly large company (e.g. Sal) usually gets a lot of email. I can appreciate that the OP wanted to ask Sal in a public forum so that more people could benefit from the time that Sal spent answering the question - just seems more respectful.

Yes, it is your right to have everyone hear your opinion, and it certainly helps explain your number of posts here. I'm sure you have a rebuttal but I'm going to spare everyone anymore more of this and let you continue to increase your post count.

What does post count have to do with anything?

 

[Candycane]

Hi Candycane,

We also have a forum on our own site.

On the question of stick? Compression Locks are very hard to make and the tolerances are very close. Different blade steels affect the lock bar differently. So, even though they are the same, they are different. In my experience, "stick" lessens or goes away with enough use. I like the blade to just drop once it's broken in. Some of the new models with pivots designed to hold that tolerance, like the new Sage FRN, will drop right out of the box. Others may take a little breaking in. If you are going to give one as a gift, you might mention that a break in period improves the breed. A little oil can help, but not too much. Most people that take them apart reduce the quality, so just break them in rather than try to improve them by taking them apart. Some are more capable than others at disassembly, but few are as good as the knife-makers that put them together.

On the clips; We make many models and many clips. It is really difficult for us to try to make different clips for different models. Just too much variety. Also there are many aftermarket makers making clips for our models, some as a part of their income. I would hate to take that away from them for a project that is difficult for us to do in the first place.
I hope that answers your questions?

sal

Thank you so much for taking the time to post such a thoughtful response! Just a few follow-up thoughts:

The tolerances are so tight that it makes sense that you have to walk that line of a little stick when new verses too little lock bar engagement. It makes perfect sense that you would prefer the lock to be a little sticky when new. I'm embarrassed to admit it, but my problem (and I'm sure a problem that is shared by some others as well) may be that I own enough Spyderco knives that very few of them ever get really broken in. I have my users, some of which I've had for many years, but as a sucker (in a good way) for the latest sprint version it's hard to really wear them all in.

In terms of dropping shut, it seems like most all of them that I buy these days either drop shut beautifully on day one or just require a bit of use. Some of the sprints that I have received in the last year or so came with action out of the box that is truly incredible. The precision with which you guys build the knives is very impressive, and this brings me to the next point.

I have always been one to take the knives apart, pretty much on day one. I like to see how they work, add my own oil etc. That said, 9 of of 10 times I've taken a Spyderco knife apart I've either degraded the action, messed up the centering or something else. I have no doubt that there are many people who know exactly what they are doing but apparently I don't. My impression is that the tolerances are just very impressive and, as you said, that for average folks like me it's a lot smarter to leave the knives as is.

With regard to your comment about clips, I've gotta say that Spyderco continues to earn my business each time I interact with the company. You are telling me, in part, that you don't make deep carry clips for your own products because it would hurt someone else's business. Sadly, this kind of ethic seems like an uncommon thing these days.

Thank you again for taking the time to answer my questions. I have a lot of respect for the brand and will certainly check out the forum on your website.

 

[sharp_edge]

I kind of agree to what the OP said about break-in. My very first PM2 (DLC S30V) has had a bit lock stickiness that could never go away even after several years' break in. It does not bother me, though. A slightly sticky lock is much less of a problem than, say, lock rock.

 

[David Nowlin]

I always wondered about the deep carry question that i feel Sal gave a great answer.
I had mentioned that to Spyderco customer service many years ago when seeking a screw for my 92 military as one had gone missing. Pretty much got the same answer.
I do love the deep carry wire clip that come on some models. By far my favorite clip.

love the A-10. Had same experience in the AF fire dept. just not that low. Thanks for sharing.

 

[David Nowlin]

i agree the knives are not as easy to get into action with deep carry hence the lanyards.

 

[Danke42]

Fan of the wire clip too! Seems like a fair number of folks don't like them but I find they grip really well and if you want something less noticeable they may suit. Spidiechef in pocket now and waiting on the Dodo.