Question: Good camping knife/hatchet/saw/machete?

H

HDCase

Joined
Jul 15, 2012
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Hi,

I'm looking for an outdoor camping tool for light backpacking (nothing too weight conscious). I'm wondering if you can recommend something in the $50–$100 price range. Initially I was looking for a large cutting knife (maybe 8 inches). But I realize I need a knife, a hatchet, a saw, and perhaps a machete. I wonder if there are tools that sort of serve these functions. Or is it best to buy some of them separately?

I'm really looking for a quality tool, rather than a weapon or a fun item. I tend to avoid names like "zombie cutter" or "recon killer knife" as I am simply looking for something slightly different. But hey, if it is a good tool....

And, frankly, I'm not a survival person, so perhaps my initial ideas are not perfect.

I am leaning towards this, as a knife:

http://www.ontarioknife.com/catalog/item/29


http://www.ontarioknife.com/catalog/item/38

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0009DX8U2/

http://www.amazon.com/Gerber-31-000705-Gator-Machete-Sheath/dp/B004V2EE82/ (not sure if these tools are camp tools)

www.amazon.com/Gerber-31-000759-Machete-Junior-Sheath/dp/B004BSGFPG/

I haven't done a huge amount of research though (although more than I probably need to).
 
Hi HD, things move a little slower on this forum, but I think you'll get good advice. Personally, I generally prefer a knife of 4 or 5 inches, and if I need one and can spare the weight I carry a small Wetterlings axe. I have my own Jack Black Knives U1 knife, but you'll have difficulty getting one of those. I carry a SAK, generally a Victorinox Hunter, and if I'm travelling really light, that's all I'll take. The Hunter has a good saw on it, which is surprisingly useful, but I occassionally carry a longer folding saw (mine is made by a company whose initials are ARS). Other light knives I like are Moras and I like the Cold Steel Finn Bear. If I need a machete I have a Tramontina, and I also own a CS LTC Kukhri

I can imagine the folks over here will recommend you ESEE and Becker knives, as well as Condor and Fallkniven. Have a look at what they've got on offer, I don't think you'll go far wrong in terms of knives or big choppers. There's a whole separate axe and hatchet forum too on Bladeforums which is always worth looking at.

Hope you find some gear that works for you and happy camping.

Jack
 
A couple of questions just so the other guys here can get a better idea of your likely uses.
Where do you camp? what kind of environment/season?

But a couple thoughts right of the top of my head,
small folding saws are great for cutting up firewood, and can be had for fairly cheap. The fiskars ones are pretty good.
From the links you posted, Ontario is pretty reputable (I won't comment on business side of things, other folks have beaten that to death, lets not do that here) the woodsmans pal is fairly specialized, but for the right enviroment, I've heard good things. For the Gerber things, right now the reports are that they are having major QC problems in production, so I'd avoid them for machetes and stuff.

Depending on your environment you will likely only need two of your options there. A knife is always good (obviously) hatchets are good for hardwoods (but there is a safety factor to consider) machetes for light foliage, and saws for mixed wood areas. Both of the knives you list would work fine for batoning if that is your style, so either of them and a small saw could be all you need.

My current tropical combo is an ESEE-3 and 16inch Tramontina machete.

I'm sure once you start browsing here you'll find a whole world of cutlery! Careful, they will start following you home!
 
I'll throw my two cents into the pot :-)..

The Woodsman's Pal is an old and reliable design, although, I'd go with Ontario on that one.. You certainly SHOULD do more research, it can keep you safe and help you to make a more informed, reliable choice. I can't tell you exactly what would suit you best, only you can decide that, although I can offer up many suggestions. I've been in woods/bush-crafting and survival skills for twenty six years, fished and hunted as long--I only buy from well-reputed companies,
and I only buy items which have been extensively tested and proven. Here is a short list. I'll try to keep them low-cost.

Folders:

Buck-110. Sharpest knife (for it's modest price) you may ever own. Reliable and well-made. Buck has a fantastic warranty. Good people.
Ka-bar Mule (G-10, Aus-8A) Tough as nails, nearly as sharp as the buck. Great handle. Strong lock, typically.

Fixed-blade:

Gerber Prodigy:Tough, thick, fairly good handle, although the "skin" has a tendency to tear off. Can be wrapped with nylon cord to help. Holds a pretty good edge. I busted through a seasons worth of wood with one. Sheath is nice, retains it's blade well, although, I'd recommend a means of support for the sheath. 420-HC or Sandvik.
Gerber LMF:Better all-around, although shorter, than it's cousin above. Better sheath than the Prodigy. 420-HC. If I remember correctly, it is hollow-ground (much like the Buck-110, and the Mule.) It comes with a manual depicting various uses. Should have a good warranty.
Kabar:Next Generation 440-A or D2. Heh, I put a 440-A through many chores--battoning, hacking, peeling, gutting, you name it. It held up. Watch the pommel though. The point is stronger on the 440-A than on the D2. Sheath was decent. One of the best fixed-blades I've ever used.
SOG:Seal Pup Elite. Short but tough. Light. Hollow-ground. Very well heat-treated Aus-8A. Excellent small knife, comes in either plain or combo edge.
Well-recommended. As good as all the others, although shorter. From what I've found, a very good all-around small knife.
Bk-11:Tough as nails, takes and holds a good edge. Sheath stinks. Has a wire and bottle-opener notch, as well as lashing and lanyard holes. A highly-versatile and useful neck-knife. Loved mine.

Axes/Tomahawks:

Coldsteel Trailhawk:Light, efficient, quick. It's tough as nails and can easily take and hold a hair-shaving edge. I've taken down fair-sized trees with one without serious trouble. Highly-versatile. Can be used to split, hack, shave, chisel, wedge, hammer, and many other chores.

Machetes:

Coldsteel Kukri:Cheaply-priced and effective. Takes and holds a razor edge. Can clean through a brushfield like a wildfire. Tough as nails.

Coldsteel Latin:Much the same. These, when sharpened well, can go through small trees like butter. Makes good shavings and kindling as well.

Coldsteel Bolo:This model has more forward weight, but is as effective as the others.

Good luck finding what you are looking for, and again do research an item before you buy..

Have a good one,
:-P
 
I would stay away from Gerber and Ontario. Not the best of quality.

For the money, I would go with Kabar or Mora for a knife.
Kabar, get the BK16.
Mora, get the Light My Fire Mora Knife w/ Fire Steel

For an axe, get the 19" Wetterling.

For a saw, get a BAHCO Laplander Folding Saw

For a machete, get a Cold Steel Panga.
 
I personally like the Knife, Saw, Axe and Machete combo.

My Axe is a 3/4 Axe with a 2.5# head that I got from the local hardware store for around $21. It had a bad edge out the door, but after working it over on my belt sander, it's been working great! Edge is holding up fine when I don't hit rocks. ;)

Tramontina, Ontario and Fiddleback Forge are my prefered small machete makers. Right now my 12" Fiddleback is lashed to my pack, but I'm thinking of switching it with my customized 12" Ontario Cutlass machete (I ground it into a nice clip point) if I go camping/hiking this week. . Sometimes I'll trade my Machete out for a thin and fast H.I. Khukri like a 20" Sirupati or a 16.5" WWII.

For Saws, I rotate between a Korona Folding saw, a SOG Hunter Revolver in saw mode or a Stanley 15" Sharptooth. The neat thing about the SOG Hunter revolver (and the SEAL revolver for that matter) is that it doubles as a knife. Sometimes the Hunter Revolver is my main blade, but most of the time it rides backup just in case. ;)

When it comes to fixed blades, I have so many, I tend to rotate throught them. Some trips I'll be carrying an old hunting knife like a Western, a Esee-4, Buck, SOG, Custom fiddleback, Ka-bar or anything in between. When I do a four blade combo the fixed blade is normally around 4" to 5" but sometimes I'll go up to a 6-7" blade. I mainly stick with the 4-5" blades because I figure that my Machete can handle the big cutting.

Ontario makes Old Hickory Kitchen knives. There 6" boning knife and 8" Slicing knife will both make great woods knives. The handles and blades need a little work out of the box, but they are a good price and made from a good steel. I have 3 or 4 of their 6" Boning knives, one I bought new the others were picked up at yard sales and thrift stores. One of them I took, convexed the edge, rounded and smoothed the handle and squared up the spine. It's now one mean slicer! If I ever get around to making a pouch sheath for it, it will go into my outdoor blade rotation. Along with Bowies, a Modified kitchen knife was a very popular blade in the West.

I think you can deck your self out with at least 4 blades for around $100 to $150. $20 to $50 (Council Tool, they are american made, Used extensively by the Forestry industry and a lot of their models can be had for $50 or less from dealers) for an Axe, fixed blade around $10 (old Hickory) to $50 (Buck, SOG, Ontario, Kabar), Machete will run $10 to $20 and a saw around $6 to $20.
 
Condor 14" Eco Survivor machete
Fiskars sliding saw
Condor Scout Hatchet or Fiskars X5 hatchet
Opinel No.8 or Mora Companion (really a ton of choices here)
 
Belt Knife - Condor HudsonBay
PocketKnife - Vict. SAK Farmer or Hiker
in your pack - Gerber/Fiskars Sportaxe or Condor Scout hatchet
Machete - Tramontina bolo
 
To answer your question, i'd say yes, most tools are "better" purchased separately. It's pretty well impossible to find a single tool that does the wide range of tasks you will encounter in moderate backpacking/camping.

To me, camping tasks generally fall into a few basic categories;
1) firewood preparation
2) basic cutting tasks - everything from opening packages/bags to cutting cordage
3) food preparation
4) carving/whittling - more of a pass-time than anything else...

I didn't include shelter making b/c if you're "camping" odds are you have a fabric shelter of some sort (tent/bivy/hammock/tarp/etc)....

Also, I'm not sure if you're meaning to stay under ~$100 or what you actual price range is, but i'll make suggestions with that in mind.

1) folding saw - you actually can go cheap here - most cut pretty similarly (despite what many will say to the contrary) something like the Coghlan's Sierra Saw - around $12.99 at BassPro. I have a cheapie folding saw much like it in my EDC bag and it will flat-out saw some wood in a hurry.

2) pocket knife - i really like my Swiss Army Knife "Huntsman", but any similar small-bladed folder is super handy and will manage most cutting tasks with aplomb. I must say here that a multi-tool like a Leatherman works very well in this role, though a good bit heavier than the SAK Huntsman, BUT with it's pliers it can be indispensable for fixing stuff. I have had my Leatherman "Wave" for 15yrs now and it's served me well and *always* goes in my pack no matter where i'm hiking or what i'm climbing.

3) fixed-blade "heavy-duty" field knife - since i'm *not* a wood-chopping-with-my-knife aficionado, i don't really need a long-bladed knife. So, for heavy duty firewood/fire prep tasks i prefer something of moderate blade length with a thick, stout blade. - something like a Becker Campanion "BK2" 5.25" long and .25" thick wood-splitting (aka *batonning*!!!!) steel goodness.

4) i also like to carry a Mora Knife - they are very ergonomic and *cheap* (like ~$12 or so - call it $15 and you're easily covered).

So, these are my basic recommendations and what i've 'evolved' my camp-carry tool set to and it's a pretty useful set of tools - i hope you find some useful info there.
 
I have hated myself for a few years because I found myself buying a ton of knives, folders, fixed, choppers, machetes, axes...I am a knifaholic! I have way too many and still find myself wanting more! I only use a few which is the shame of this! I have experimented with a number of knives. Most on camping trips. So my take is...you will take too many knives on your first outing and never use most of them. If you are shelter building this might be different but most dont go out without a tent on the 1st night even when building a shelter so you will have a ton of stuff to carry. And chopping is so over-rated to me it is crazy! If you are merely camping and like to hike some on your camp out...short of what I would consider backpacking (this is me) you wont like the extra weight from all those items (axe, saw, fixed, folder...etc!!).

Axe: I have found that a small axe like a wetterlings 19" (which I have) wont take on many tasks like you would think! Hardwood that has a thick trunk isnt easy at all to cut down and burns tons of cals trying to do it!!! Using it smart isnt as obvious as you think...just because it is an axe doesnt mean it can do all! Use it wisely. Also, It can also be dangerous!! Miss a log out in the wood with a small axe...because it wont catch the ground (because of its short swing radius) youll be in bad shape! Not to say there isnt a place for an axe as well as other might love them...I myself look at solving a problem like wood processing in a different way! You dont need to cut down a 60' oak tree! I stopped carrying an axe...didnt suit my style and I just wasnt that good with it nor did I find the extra weight worth it. I can process small firewood just fine with a knife and a saw. And get all the fire I need in the process without risking serious injury. I tend to camp solo so safety and risk are something to always consider! So for me...I have past on the axe

Saw...well a light small folder like bahco seems to work better than I thought. I use it for tons of stuff...it is efficient and fairly fast, just know its limits and you will do fine! I can cut some limbs or smaller trees down into something I can baton with my knife for wood and not once again worry about injury and not expend too many cals! I dont always take a saw but it beats the hell out of chopping!

Knife: I found my sweet spot which is a 6" or less fixed. I love falknivens!!! I started with an A1 and it has been a beast! I have put this blade thru hell! I love the grind for it is the most versatile. Grip is grippy when wet and doesnt transfer shock! Sheath I originally hated but found the minimal side a huge plus!!! Wrapped my with some 550 and it is still small and light! S1 has slowly became a favorite as well. You have to understand there limits. But they are very effective...plus you will get very good with whatever you uses most! I can baton (within reason), shelter build, whittle, food prep, carve and so on...all fairly well! I have also taken a ESEE Junglas and hated it...one dimension, big and heavy! I do like my ESEE 4 and 6 alot! My BK2 is also nice...a little thick and heavy but I still like it. I put some nice micarta scales on it...and it is really nice! I do like the sheath and it was a very good value...didnt like it at first then changed the scales and it is really nice! But my S1 is my fav and does everything quite well!

I do like a folder as well...heres why, if I dont strap my fixed on my hip I pop the folder in my pocket and have it ready when I am hiking with my pack on my back. I love the para2 or the griptilian! Para2 is a slicing god! However I do like the BM grip better! Doesnt slice as well but the feel and lock I like much better! I have also had my para2 pop open when drawing from the pocket! For as sharp as it is....becareful!! Food prep is so good on the para2 and grip! Any fine work is also so much better it is crazy...process a fish is actually not to bad...better with a mora but the mora is bigger!

Machete...unless you are cutting a trail or path...or in the jungles it isnt necessary! I love my condor and marble way better than my ESEE junglas because they are faster, lighter, easier to swing, and wont tire you out! They have their purpose so choose it wisely!

Just my take, I just like to keep it simply
 
Personally I find a machete to be an absolutely indispensable tool, but that's just me. :)
 
Yeah technique and strike placement are your best friend in preventing stuck blades but they do happen from time to time depending on your model and target. :)
 
Thanks very much for all the very informative posts! I can add some more details: I'm looking for survival tools for a temperate climate (forests), mostly non-winter months (for camping). So perhaps a machete is not as crucial? Although some kind of bush-cutter might be helpful.

I'm leaning towards a big, cutter knife, but I don't really want to go much bigger than 8 inches or so. Although I seem to see a lot of 7 inch knives and a lot of really big knives.

I do have a few small knives (like a Mora 612—hand guard).

I am interested in something along that line: Cheap, no frills, but great quality. I'd prefer Developed-country made (just because I want to have working conditions that the USA has!). And, and this may not be a deal breaker, but I'm looking for a non-leather sheath, if possible. But some kind of big, cutting knife. The Condor 8.5 inch is very close: http://www.amazon.com/Condor-Hudson...door-recreation&ie=UTF8&qid=1349583235&sr=1-4

http://www.amazon.com/Condor-8-Inch...oor-recreation&ie=UTF8&qid=1349583294&sr=1-28

http://www.amazon.com/Condor-Mounta...oor-recreation&ie=UTF8&qid=1349583418&sr=1-97 (Note that one is stainless steel—420 HC?)


I have a couple of questions also. That Ontario Gen II series has a Rockwell hardness of 53–55 or something. It's 5160 carbon steel, but I heard one comment that it's too soft a steel for using to chop wood. Anyone know any info about why they may have chosen this low Rockwell hardening?


With regard to Buck knives, I've had those for a long time (and lost them), but I wonder why their steel is considered good, when there seems to be a move towards carbon steel rather than stainless. Is their steel good enough for outdoor work? And if so, should I look for a big, stainless steel knife also? It seems it makes more sense when getting it moist frequently. Although maybe a larger knife can shatter more easily?


A Swiss Army Knife is a good idea. I can look for one with a saw on it.


So I am gathering that a folding saw is a good idea.


I wonder if I need a hatchet/machete if I go with a larger knife. I probably will have a tool that does not cut wood or brush as well as a hatchet or a machete, but I wonder if it is serviceable.
 
you might want to read around the becker section of the forum here. lots of good info on them (but as far as I know they are all great) Becker, and ESEE have great warranties, and are very tough if you feel like you want to really hammer on them.

Buck still has a good reputation, but any time you have a stainless steel, you won't be able to beat on it quite as hard as high carbon. Things swing back and forth, Buck does a good job with their stainless, and it has advantages over something like 1095, but then again high carbon steel has advantages. Its hard to really compare steels directly IMHO since there are so many contributing factors.
Personally I prefer a smaller knife to combo with an axe, instead of having overlap. just depends on how much you want to carry.

I think you'll have to try out some of this stuff to see what works for you. If cost is a concern to you, a quick look in the exchange section will show you what kind of secondary market you can find for the knives you are looking at.

Things to think about.
 
HDCase said:
Thanks very much for all the very informative posts! I can add some more details: I'm looking for survival tools for a temperate climate (forests), mostly non-winter months (for camping). So perhaps a machete is not as crucial? Although some kind of bush-cutter might be helpful.

I'm leaning towards a big, cutter knife, but I don't really want to go much bigger than 8 inches or so. Although I seem to see a lot of 7 inch knives and a lot of really big knives.

I do have a few small knives (like a Mora 612—hand guard).

I am interested in something along that line: Cheap, no frills, but great quality. I'd prefer Developed-country made (just because I want to have working conditions that the USA has!). And, and this may not be a deal breaker, but I'm looking for a non-leather sheath, if possible. But some kind of big, cutting knife. The Condor 8.5 inch is very close: http://www.amazon.com/Condor-Hudson...door-recreation&ie=UTF8&qid=1349583235&sr=1-4

http://www.amazon.com/Condor-8-Inch...oor-recreation&ie=UTF8&qid=1349583294&sr=1-28

http://www.amazon.com/Condor-Mounta...oor-recreation&ie=UTF8&qid=1349583418&sr=1-97 (Note that one is stainless steel—420 HC?)


I have a couple of questions also. That Ontario Gen II series has a Rockwell hardness of 53–55 or something. It's 5160 carbon steel, but I heard one comment that it's too soft a steel for using to chop wood. Anyone know any info about why they may have chosen this low Rockwell hardening?


With regard to Buck knives, I've had those for a long time (and lost them), but I wonder why their steel is considered good, when there seems to be a move towards carbon steel rather than stainless. Is their steel good enough for outdoor work? And if so, should I look for a big, stainless steel knife also? It seems it makes more sense when getting it moist frequently. Although maybe a larger knife can shatter more easily?


A Swiss Army Knife is a good idea. I can look for one with a saw on it.


So I am gathering that a folding saw is a good idea.


I wonder if I need a hatchet/machete if I go with a larger knife. I probably will have a tool that does not cut wood or brush as well as a hatchet or a machete, but I wonder if it is serviceable.
Click to expand...

Personally it sounds to me like you might want to give a 14"-16" machete a try. I get the feeling that if you were to combine either a Condor 15" Bolo or 14" El Salvador with a folder or small fixed blade and a light saw you should have things pretty well covered.

Regarding your desired point of good working conditions, Imacasa/Condor (Condor is an Imacasa subsidiary) has exceptional work conditions, PPE, and training. They're an ISO 9000 certified manufacturer as well.
 
the fiskers saw has a tension screw that you tighten down to hold the blade in or out (does that make sense) works pretty well.Plus if the lock does fail, it fails "safe" the blade just slides back into the handle, no way for it to snap shut on your hand, and even unlocked it still works on the pull stroke.
 
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