Riveting handles

L

langchop

Joined
Jun 16, 2007
Messages
301
Ok I know I'm asking a lot of questions but heres another: Most of the rivets used on knives I have seen made by guys on this site seems to be 'pins' rather than 'rivets' Do most of you experienced guys just put the pin through and cut off the excess, or do you actually hammer/compress the ends so that it forms a 'mushroom' to hold the handle on securely?

Thanks

Lang
 
langchop said:
Ok I know I'm asking a lot of questions but heres another: Most of the rivets used on knives I have seen made by guys on this site seems to be 'pins' rather than 'rivets' Do most of you experienced guys just put the pin through and cut off the excess, or do you actually hammer/compress the ends so that it forms a 'mushroom' to hold the handle on securely?

Thanks

Lang
Click to expand...
Good question. Yes, "riveting" can be used, but most of the time is not.
As you create the mushroom, and the pin expands laterally inside the hole, it can cause fractures/cracks in the handle material either immediately, or later as the material may expand or contract.
It'd be a real drag to have those craks after so much time has been invested!
 
Most all my pins are glued in and cut and sanded flush so there is no pressure on the surrounding material. I really like the looks of a spun dome but I havent mastered it as of yet. I also like the looks of the hammered dome but as mentioned above can crack the handle unless it is soft handle material. Im not brave enough to hammer a pin over ivory and the spun dome may overheat it. Hammered domes can also work harden and break an edge off. Also can leave a stray hammer mark on the handle material.

If anybody has a mastered the spun dome please chime in. Has anybody made their own spinner?

One trick I like is to dome and polish mosaic pins before installing them. Its time consuming but worth the effort.

Good question!
 
Bruce, have you tried the head spinner sold by TKS and others? It does a pretty good job on 1/16- 1/8 pins. I like it for pins in stag.
Stacy
 
Hi langchop :) for the most part I use either "Corby Style Handle Screws" or what we've come to know as "Loveless Style Screws" (not sure how that came to be as it is my understanding Bob L. doesn't use this type of fastener). Those fasteners, along with good adhesive (Loctite 324/325/326) http://midwestknifemakers.com/vcom/index.php ,will keep your handles on for the life of the blade.

I was also under the impression that peening pins into for instance, stabilized woods or micarta could possibly lead to splitting/fracturing etc. That is until I started seeing the busse style flared tubes and several of our members here at BF started experimenting (not the same as a peened pin, I know ;) ). I now believe it is possible to apply a large countersink to the scales and flare a piece of tubing into the CS to retain scales without too much worry of failure. Although I'm not crazy about how it looks it seems to be a very sound method of keeping scales on a blade. There was a quite large thread that transpired here in shoptalk with tutorial and pics. If interested I'm sure a quick search would bring it up.

I like the look of domed pins too Bruce and would be very interested in hearing about the methods used :thumbup: ;)
 
Bruce Bump said:
If anybody has a mastered the spun dome please chime in. Has anybody made their own spinner?

One trick I like is to dome and polish mosaic pins before installing them. Its time consuming but worth the effort.

Good question!
Click to expand...

I've used the pin head spinner also with great success. Don't remember where I got it, though!
Get the pin to the exact length - first - dome the heads - them epoxy in place!
Looks great in stag.
bf4.jpg
 
You can also get them to the exact length and put them on a mini lathe, file or sand the dome, then epoxy.
 
Yes you can. Before I got my lathe that's exactly how I would spin stuff. Could call!!!
 
The pin head spinner Stacy mentioned is good for spinning round domes on pins, and if that look is your objective, good.
If you need to spin pins to actually create a lip to hold material on like jigged bone on a slipjoint, your gonna use a different..most for sure homemade spinner. One for the heads on the handle pins(1/16") and one for the spun head on the pin in the center of the spring (likely 3/32" or 1/16"). You can make a spinner from a 1/16' and 3/32" drive pin punch that you may have broken the useable tip off from. Size of the point is important. and it should be squared off. then put it in a lathe or drill press and a small round diamond bit in a dremel or foredom, and grind a centered cup shape in the end. Try it on some pin material held in a small vice...if you get a good lip all around the pin head and material to sand/polish into a rounded dome, you have a good one.

If you have it, the Shadley /Davis book on Multiblade Folding Knives gives a good explanation of doing the pins and pics of the spinners....
By the way, I am responding because of experience.....there is alot I could confidently say I haven't mastered.....
 
John R. Fraps said:
The pin head spinner Stacy mentioned is good for spinning round domes on pins, and if that look is your objective, good.
If you need to spin pins to actually create a lip to hold material on like jigged bone on a slipjoint, your gonna use a different..most for sure homemade spinner. One for the heads on the handle pins(1/16") and one for the spun head on the pin in the center of the spring (likely 3/32" or 1/16"). You can make a spinner from a 1/16' and 3/32" drive pin punch that you may have broken the useable tip off from. Size of the point is important. and it should be squared off. then put it in a lathe or drill press and a small round diamond bit in a dremel or foredom, and grind a centered cup shape in the end. Try it on some pin material held in a small vice...if you get a good lip all around the pin head and material to sand/polish into a rounded dome, you have a good one.

If you have it, the Shadley /Davis book on Multiblade Folding Knives gives a good explanation of doing the pins and pics of the spinners....
By the way, I am responding because of experience.....there is alot I could confidently say I haven't mastered.....
Click to expand...

Thats the info Ive been hoping for John. Thanks a bunch

I checked your gallery! Geez you make a nice folder!
 
David Wesner said:
I now believe it is possible to apply a large countersink to the scales and flare a piece of tubing into the CS to retain scales without too much worry of failure. Although I'm not crazy about how it looks it seems to be a very sound method of keeping scales on a blade. There was a quite large thread that transpired here in shoptalk with tutorial and pics. If interested I'm sure a quick search would bring it up.
Click to expand...

this one? - link
 
I have made a panhead screw into a countersunk before just with a hand powerdrill and a file (ok so it was urgent and the shops were closed!), so even if you dont have a drill press or a mini lathe I think one could do a decent job of making a dmoed head on the pin. Drill, file, and a few different grits of sand paper and you're on your way.
 
Has any one thought of using Alumnium aircraft rivets ?
They come in many sizes and lengths and if you look on ebay you will find a few of the rivet sets under "aircraft tools" In the USA they call them rivet sets UK and downunder we call them rivet snaps.
If its allowed I can post a few links or just the number.
 
They do make pop rivet washers for material too soft for the tail end to get a good hold on. Otherwise, if kba was worried about expanded pins stressing the scale material, I imagine expanded rivets could be even worse.
 
I can asure you there are not many "POP" rivets used on aircraft . Most of them are either raised head or countersunk aluminium alloy ,you can get Monel and Titianium even Aluminium ones that you heat treat.
If we need to use a blind rivet then we mostly use a rivet named "CherryMax" a big step up from a pop rivet as it has a locking ring that holds onto the pin.
 
maybe this exists already, but what about having a thin 'sleeve' of harder steel around the rivet material so that whe compressing/hammering the rivet it doesnt expand lower down in the scale and cause damage?
 
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