How To Sharpening a Whittler?

Ace Rimmer · Jul 10, 2017

I've decided to give whittling a try and I've ordered a Rough Rider 375 as a cheap way to get started. This knife has a spear main blade and pen and coping smaller blades. I've read through all the whittling threads that I could find here on BF and I know I need to sharpen at least the two small blades to about a 20 degree angle (10 dps). I'm not sure about the main blade, though. In the first place I'm not sure of its function (is it only for removing lots of wood or is it just there for general purpose cutting?). So the question I would appreciate some help with is, should the large blade be sharpened the same way as the two smaller blades, or should I leave it more around 40 degrees inclusive for general purpose work?

Thanks!

Bartleby · Jul 10, 2017

Most people use the main blade for roughing out as you suggest. The hardness of the wood you are carving will dictate the angle. The RR whittlers are pretty nice to start out with, although you may find that you will want something with a bit more thickness and less flex to the smaller blades, depending on your technique.

Mr. Chips · Jul 10, 2017

I sharpen my whittlin' knife blades (actually pretty much all my blades) 10 degrees per side. They work well for carving wood and for deer and moose disassembly. Just strop as needed.
The Rough Rider knives make very good whittlin' tools.

Trout Hound · Jul 11, 2017

As mentioned above, it will depend a lot on the type of wood you're carving. 10 dps is a good starting point. I have gone as low as 7-8 dps for detail carving in basswood, but that edge would probably roll in maple or other hardwoods. There's a bit of trial and error involved to find the right angle for your blade, in the wood you're using, with your particular carving style.

A couple tips. You will find out very quickly that an edge at that angle will roll very easily if you apply any lateral pressure to it, which adds up to a lot more sharpening than carving. Also, a good leather strop, and a stick of either Flexcut gold or Veritas green compound, is the difference between "sharp" and "carving sharp."

Have fun, be safe, and post up some pics of your work in the whittling thread!

Ace Rimmer · Jul 11, 2017

Thanks for the responses so far, this helps a lot. Sounds like I don't want to just jump right in and immediately reprofile everything all the way down to 10 dps until I get a feel for how the blades perform in whatever wood I find to work with. That's very good to know and may save a lot of work and frustration. I have a roll of nice carving leather from back when I was fooling around with that hobby and I have been planning to make a strop, but I've been unsure as to what compound to buy. Now I know, and Amazon has Flexcut Gold, so I'll go with that. My knife was shipped USPS first class parcel on Monday so I should have it by the end of the week.

Now as to pictures of my "creations," I'm sure I'll start very simple and I'm recalling an episode of M*A*S*H where one of the local Koreans shows something he carved to Major Burns --

K: I made this!
Frank: That looks like a two by four!?!
K: Thank you!

Bartleby · Jul 11, 2017

Take your time, build your confidence, don't cut your thumb! If it isn't relaxing, try doing it a different way. Don't use wood you have to pay for (or at least use cheap wood) until you feel comfortable. Like most good things, you will learn it best by doing it.

Trout Hound · Jul 11, 2017

I have never seen a factory edge that was anywhere close to whittling sharp, so it will still benefit you to reprofile the blades, as you will definitely want them at a lower angle than they come from the factory. There is positively nothing more frustrating than trying to carve with a knife that isn't sharp enough for the task.

Ace Rimmer · Jul 11, 2017

Bartleby said:
Take your time, build your confidence, don't cut your thumb! If it isn't relaxing, try doing it a different way. Don't use wood you have to pay for (or at least use cheap wood) until you feel comfortable. Like most good things, you will learn it best by doing it.

Trout Hound said:
I have never seen a factory edge that was anywhere close to whittling sharp, so it will still benefit you to reprofile the blades, as you will definitely want them at a lower angle than they come from the factory. There is positively nothing more frustrating than trying to carve with a knife that isn't sharp enough for the task.

Thanks again! I'll plan on making incremental adjustments to angles and test the performance as I go along using scrap wood. Sounds like it's time to start searching for and studying YouTube videos.

Ace Rimmer · Jul 13, 2017

I just picked up a bag of basswood blocks at Hobby Lobby. Now if that darn knife would just get here (mailed first class on Monday from not that far away, so should be here in the next couple of days.)

Bartleby · Jul 13, 2017

Ace Rimmer said:
Now if that darn knife would just get here

There is a little song to pass the time while whittling (or waiting for "that darn knife" to arrive) called "Barlow Knife":

"I've been whittin' all my life,
Ain't got nothin' but a Barlow knife.
brown bone handle and a Barlow blade,
best darn knife that was ever made."

Its traditional, and so there are several variants on youtube.

WhittlinAway · Jul 13, 2017

Trout Hound said:
There is positively nothing more frustrating than trying to carve with a knife that isn't sharp enough for the task.

Only slightly less frustrating is trying to reprofile a blade with too fine of a stone.

I don't think this has been mentioned yet, but rreprofiling down to 10 DPS goes much faster if you start with something like a Norton Crystolon Coarse or a DMT DiaSharp Extra Coarse. I had a lot of frustrating sharpening experiences until I learned that.

Ace Rimmer · Jul 14, 2017

WhittlinAway said:
Only slightly less frustrating is trying to reprofile a blade with too fine of a stone.

I don't think this has been mentioned yet, but ....

Thanks! I've been thinking that I probably don't have the right equipment for this and am going to have to go shopping. The only halfway fast cutting stone I have is a small diamond sharpener of unknown quality or grit. I did a practice run on a small, cheap Gerber and it seemed to do OK, but I don't yet know how it will work on the RR 440 steel. At least it turned the Gerber into a pretty good pencil sharpener!

(Of course, I followed up the diamond with my old Buck stone, a very fine ceramic rod, and a piece of leather.)

Trout Hound · Jul 14, 2017

WhittlinAway said:
Only slightly less frustrating is trying to reprofile a blade with too fine of a stone.

I don't think this has been mentioned yet, but rreprofiling down to 10 DPS goes much faster if you start with something like a Norton Crystolon Coarse or a DMT DiaSharp Extra Coarse. I had a lot of frustrating sharpening experiences until I learned that.

This is absolutely true. For carving, it also helps to go through a thorough succession of grit sizes. Otherwise, you just get deeper scratches that have been polished by the strop, which doesn't cut as well. For a new knife from the factory, I currently use the following progression for a whittler:

DMT XC
DMT C
DMT F
DMT EF
Spyderco M
Spyderco F
Strop with Flexcut gold

Now, you may not have the budget for all that right now, so both sides of an $8 Crystolon stone, plus the ceramic and a strop will probably be enough to get you started. You could also wrap some wet/dry sandpaper around the Crystolon stone to add a few steps to the progression. You really have to make sure you apex cleanly and remove any significant burrs at each stage, otherwise you'll be going backwards. It takes a while to get a feel for it, but you get the hang of it after a while.

Ace Rimmer · Jul 14, 2017

Thanks to all who commented. The RR375 arrived today, as did the Flexcut Gold (which wasn't even supposed to ship until Monday!). Yes, I can see that a diamond sharpener can really leave some scratches! I've got the knife working well enough to make some pretty thin, shallow cuts in basswood, but there is more work to do on it and a lot to learn both about sharpening and whittling!

Ace Rimmer · Jul 16, 2017

Well, I'm making quite a nice pile of wood shavings...

First I did a bit of reprofiling. I picked up a Smith's dual grit diamond stone (750/325) but even the 750 seems pretty aggressive so I instead tried my small "Eze Lap" diamond stone of unknown grit (but seems to cut slower than the Smith's). I followed that with my old Buck Washita stone, then a very fine ceramic rod, and then my newly-made leather strop with Flexcut Gold. I suppose I could insert my old Buck hard Arkansas stone in the process if needed, but I like the ceramic rod better. (No data on the rod, it's something my father had before he passed away.)

Then I picked out a block of basswood and started carving some curved surfaces just to get a feel for the wood and the blades, and to try various cutting techniques as seen on YouTube. I'm mostly working with the main blade and will be giving the pen and coping blades a try next.

I like the knife a lot! I probably need to go with a narrower angle on the main blade as I get more experience. No idea what to make first. I do a bit of pencil sketching and have the same problem; I'd do more drawing if I had any idea what to draw.

Excelsior! (pun intended)