Sharpening hunting knife for friend - what angle?

Terry M.

Terry M.

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My buddy asked me to sharpen some of his knives he's going to use to dress a longhorn bull. I can sharpen them but I've never hunted and never dressed a deer or anything. What would be the best angle to use for such a task? 30 degrees for more toughness or 17-20 for the sharpest edge?
Can some knife knut hunters give me some advice? Thanks!
 
'A Longhorn bull'... For me that would be an elimination animal. One that's old and has been used as a service bull. Now, I'm going to put him in the freeze.
Which will mostly be ground for hamburger. Then sell his rack. His hide will be tough and could have been grain fed for the last 2 months. If the blades have good geometry and not sluggish cutters. I may shoot for a 17* angle. Remember your butts on the line to make this look good. DM
 
They started dressing him with a friend's advice who dresses deer quite often and they had terrible luck with the knives dulling quickly. That's when he turned to me. He wants some sharp ass knives. You're right, my butt is on the line to do good. Apparently the bull is like cutting stone. That's why I sought help here. Thanks for your advice.
 
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No guru here, but that never stops me :) . A good friend is and has been a butcher for 15+ years. He's really good. He uses Victornox bonnig knives; nothing special about them at all, about $15 each.
He is adamanent that his "work" knives never will see a fine stone. Weekly, he freehand sharpens the factory angle on a medium grit oil stone. this is for edge retention/longevity. Then, as needed (several times per day) he will steel his knives on a smooth steel, at about 5' more angle - giving it a microbevel. It "looks" to me like the factory angle is 17-20' per side, his micro bevel is about 25' per side.

I did a huntin knife like described above for a friend, I had to take some of the shoulder off, but I finished it medium grit with a micro bevel. He dressed a small deer with it this year, and was pleased to death with it. I checked it out, and it was still sharp as heck (no need to touch it up).
 
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dom, Your friend's experience is good advice. Sharpen more coarse and the edge lasts longer. Plus, you should check the price of Victorinox knives lately. The commerical grade meat cutters knives. DM
 
I got a couple of these, and while the edge wasn't great, after I sharpened them they have been holding up nicely! I reprofiled them to 15 dps.

so far I have processed a 300 lb pig w/ them hitting bone and such and no damage to speak of, although I did have some blunting the sharpness came right back after steeling on a smooth steel. The key is to get your edge angle as low as possible w/ out going too low that it will deform or fracture =) some of that will be just experimenting around!
 
If your using a Victorinox boning knife with a steel in the 55RC range then I would agree that a fine stone is useless. Soft steel can't hold a fine edge. It's the reason it's become commonplace to see coarse stones and honing steels where these knifes are used. It's a maintenance routine that's proven to work with the softer German and Swiss knives, but not every knife.

If we were talking about a Japanese knife with a 62RC then I would say a coarse finish is the not a very good idea. Steel at this hardness holds a fine edge much better, but not too fine, a 2k-3k waterstone is recommended for most quality knives that are used in these tasks.

Do you know the brand of the knife or what steel it is made from?
 
Some more info on the knives would be helpful. Jason hit the nail on the head.

If they are mystery steel start around 20dps at 1k and see how they hold up.
 
His main knife will be a Buck 110 ?(not sure of steel) and a Kershaw Diskin Hunter he just bought which has 14c28n stainless steel.
 
I thought about taking my carbon steel Damascus generic bone handle knife over to use too.
I should mention that I think the angle on the knives currently is 20 dps.
 
That angle is fine. If the Buck knife is in your possession what is the blade stamp? And I'll tell you the steel. DM
 
Sorry, I don't have the Buck yet. He's bringing it to me tomorrow. I'll post it then. Thanks.
 
Start by cuttng back the angle to 15 dps then sharpen to the 300-600 grit area. Reducing the angle will yield higher levels of sharpness and better edge retention pretty much regardless of the steel.
 
My father told me a story a few years ago. He was on an elk hunt in the Western US and he shot an elk far away from base camp, up on a ridge which was quite a hike. Luckily he had a guide with him that was helping and two other guys that were there to help the guide. They all went to work on the elk with their own blades. The idea was to break it into quarters that each man could carry in a pack and get back to camp.

Dad started with his Randall made knife, which I believe is a variety of 440C or similar. He's always been a fairly good sharpener and he told me that blade would shave hair from his arms easily and probably his face. Minutes into trying to get through the tough (and probably VERY dirty) hide and hair of the animal, dad was struggling. The other guys were zipping their blades through the hide at an incredible rate. After they finished the whole thing and got back to camp, dad asked about their blades and they showed him. They all used Cutco hunting knives with orange handles and their characteristic "double D" serrated pattern.

Dad bought one (they have them with the name of the hunting company screened onto the blade, so they were obviously an item they sold often) and brought it home. He used that blade for lots of tasks and beat it up pretty good. I've restored it to good sharpness several times since then and it cuts well.

The point of my story (aside from it being fun) is that a coarse (and in this case macro-coarse) blade ends to do better in tough materials and very abrasive materials. Dirty hide, kind of like dirty thick pile carpet, can hold sand and that wears a blade very quickly. Now don't take my word; I don't hunt and I don't dress out animals. I'm just saying what I've read and what I've been told by those that know more.

The other thing that's universally true is this: Thin Is Sharp. If your friend is using a big ole' honkin' thick bladed knife to dress that bull, I'll bet it's going very hard and slow simply because the blade geometry makes it hard to slide through the media he's cutting. Notice that several people in this thread have recommended a Victorinox boning knife? Those blades, very much like a carving knife at home, are very thin stock and they blade is short from spine to edge. This means minimal blade material will be sliding through the media being cut.

If it were me, I'd recommend thin blades to start with and I'd sharpen them to something like 220 to 450 grit and deburr with a little higher grit, to maybe micro-polish the "teeth" left behind. I'm not sure what someone else, who's actually dressed out animals would think of my approach. I'd welcome any input from anyone who's got more experience.

Good topic!

Brian.
 
I am a HUGE fan of the micro bevel. You want to impress your friends? Sharpen the knife on a low grit stone, say 220, at about 10 degrees per side or less. Yes...that's right TEN PER SIDE. Don't apex, tho. Just enough to where your grind is almost at the apex of the edge.....VERY close to the apex. This thins the edge geometry. You can use a higher grit stone after wards if you want to polish out the scratch marks. But don't apex...yet!

Using a 600 or 1000 grit stone, raise the angle to 15 degrees per side, and put on a micro bevel. You can use a stropping technique during your final strokes if you'd like. Very little pressure, if any, during micro beveling. You can cut a photon with that edge all week long.
 
samuraistuart said:
I am a HUGE fan of the micro bevel. You want to impress your friends? Sharpen the knife on a low grit stone, say 220, at about 10 degrees per side or less. Yes...that's right TEN PER SIDE. Don't apex, tho. Just enough to where your grind is almost at the apex of the edge.....VERY close to the apex. This thins the edge geometry. You can use a higher grit stone after wards if you want to polish out the scratch marks. But don't apex...yet!

Using a 600 or 1000 grit stone, raise the angle to 15 degrees per side, and put on a micro bevel. You can use a stropping technique during your final strokes if you'd like. Very little pressure, if any, during micro beveling. You can cut a photon with that edge all week long.
Click to expand...

+1
A coarse edge with a fine microbevel can give some impressive results.
 
Response to Brian: "They all used Cutco hunting knives with orange handles and their characteristic "double D" serrated pattern."

I wouldn't bet my life on this, but I have read in several places that Cutco uses 440A shrug
 
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