Recommendation? Sharpening stones or sharpening systems?

What is this either or business? :) My vote is to get a decent set of bench stones and a wicked edge. I've got both and use both.

That's a good idea. I was thinking a KME, it's in a similar price range to the low end Wicked Edge.

The Wicked Edge definitely seems reliable, it was a very difficult to decode all their incremental upgrades from one system to the next (a little better clamp here, take away one stone there, throw in extra stones in another system, etc). In the end, it looks like the material costs between their low end, and their top end systems isn't very differnt but has near $900-$1000 difference between them..

I found this comparison chart below. Decided that I wanted the Pro Pack 3, then slowly sat back down when I saw the price tag $$$$$ :D.

https://www.bestsharpeningstones.com/article_details.php?id=3&article_name=Wicked Edge Models
 
That's a good idea. I was thinking a KME, it's in a similar price range to the low end Wicked Edge.

The Wicked Edge definitely seems reliable, it was a very difficult to decode all their incremental upgrades from one system to the next (a little better clamp here, take away one stone there, throw in extra stones in another system, etc). In the end, it looks like the material costs between their low end, and their top end systems isn't very differnt but has near $900-$1000 difference between them..

I found this comparison chart below. Decided that I wanted the Pro Pack 3, then slowly sat back down when I saw the price tag $$$$$ :D.

https://www.bestsharpeningstones.com/article_details.php?id=3&article_name=Wicked Edge Models

Holy Cow that's pricey!
I thoroughly enjoy having a guided sharpening unit, but mine is a homebrew offshoot designed to work with a belt grinder and bench stones. Even still I don't use it very often. It cost about $100 in materials.

My recommendation is to get some stones and a few knock-off/cheap knives - a folder or two and a kitchen utility knife and chef's knife. Practice with these till you like the result. If you can find a guided widget for under $150 it might be worth it. I can't imagine spending hundreds when that could have gone into premium stones/plates and actual knives, unless you plan on making $ with it or are big into very expensive knives.
 
Can you recommend a solid and versatile setup with specific brands, type and products? I feel like I'm going to pick up a wrong set and then end up replacing it later.
 
"...Unless you sharpen consistently, freehand sharpening isn't for you. The skill can be lost without practice. A fixed angle system would be much more reliable.

Not really. It's like riding a bike. You never forget how to do it. The muscle memory comes back really quickly.

This.^

The thing about 'practice' is, it's about practicing until the muscle memory picks it up. If one gives up on practice before that happens, the opportunity is lost. Quite literally, in my experience, when you practice mindfully & thoughtfully past a certain point, the hands will pick up the skill, even when it seems like the brain isn't fully conscious of what's working or why. When it finally 'clicks' automatically in this way, it'll surprise you, as if you never saw it coming. It really is like riding a bike and it becomes intuitive in the truest sense of the word, and will stay with you forever.
 
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Hi all, apology for the long post. I'm after your recommendation what sharpening systems or stones I should buy (little to no real world freehand experience).
....
Should I look at getting the Spyderco Medium and Fine ceramic bench stones, a large DMT Diamond Stone, or a sharpening system like the KME, or Wicked Edge Pro (I feel this one is rather expensive for someone who sharpens a blade or two every other week like myself) that will do the same job but more reliably?

A great, honest question that I've had too! Not an expert but can talk about things I've tried, which might help. As you implied, Sharpmaker seems OK but limiting. I found it very slow to sharpen things. As you see in the signature, also tried an Edge Pro Apex with diamond stones, a good step up from Sharpmaker, but selling mine after a few months. It offered one thing better than pure hand sharpening, which is very consistent edge bevels. It works pretty well and I can get knives extremely sharp. But also very slow to sharpen things because of the little stones. Add-on things like stones are much more expensive than regular bench stones, and there's a curve that's so high, you might as well spend the same time to learn to sharpen by hand. It's very easy to get bevels that are not precise because the knife is not held or clamped, even with available add-ons like the magnet. It's a system that is popular and can get great results if you put in the time to learn. But I found it slow, expensive, and still not precise and repeatable enough, considering the cost.

If you want really precise edges that are repeatable and professional-type results, I'd look at a system with a more advanced design that clamps the knife, like Wicked Edge. As some here say, that is a system that definitely gets results and seems like the gold standard of guided manual sharpeners. But wow is it costly! I'm looking at one for those knives that just have to have a picture-perfect edge, but can't quite part with the cash. Have to decide if you want pretty edges bad enough to spend $1000 or more. If you sharpen a lot, maybe that's worth it, I may break down and get one.

What I've come back to for most ordinary sharpening is where I started: sharpen by hand on small stones or bench stones. It seems like sharpening by hand is not trivial but also not rocket science. Everyone who uses a knife could learn basic knife sharpening if we just invest a little practice, it's not that hard to get a decent edge. You just accept ahead of time it won't be as picture-perfect as a Wicked Edge! But you can get a few things to help, like inexpensive angle guides that you can rubber-band to your stone.

For your stones I think it's true what others said, get a couple diamond stones with grits going from coarse to fine. I like the DMT stones, at bare minimum get something coarse, and something fine, to start. With those and maybe add a strop, you can sharpen anything.
 
I'm in the "both" camp. I use w WE 130 system for edge repair setting new bevels but touch ups and routine sharping are handled with DMT Diamond plates followed by a Spyderco Ultra Fine stone. I have also recently just picked up the new Spyderco CBN benchstone and have been very impressed so far. It might even replace the DMT Diamonds plates?

Both systems have there place and I use both. But, I do really love free hand sharpening. Just something relaxing about it for me.
 
I have also recently just picked up the new Spyderco CBN benchstone and have been very impressed so far. It might even replace the DMT Diamonds plates?

Interesting. I was skeptical...but it seems early reports are favorable.
 
Interesting. I was skeptical...but it seems early reports are favorable.

I'm still breaking it in but so far, it's performed really well. The coarse 400 grit cuts really well and raises a burr with ease. The 800 seems a finer than it's rated or at least a seems to be a larger jump than 400 to 800 if makes sense? But, it does a great job as well. I still follow it up with a Ultra Fine.
 
I don't know what a guided system would have to offer anyone that can free hand?
It's really not that hard and the skill will follow you for the rest of your life. I think I could set anyone down that really wanted to learn and have them doing pretty well in about fifteen minutes.
 
I'm still breaking it in but so far, it's performed really well. The coarse 400 grit cuts really well and raises a burr with ease. The 800 seems a finer than it's rated or at least a seems to be a larger jump than 400 to 800 if makes sense? But, it does a great job as well. I still follow it up with a Ultra Fine.

I have mine broken in, it's excellent as a 'one stone solution' for somebody looking for a high quality starting setup where you could get this one stone, and maybe add higher grits or a strop later. What I typically sharpen EDU's with is a progression like DMT C > DMT EF, and strop. Sometimes C straight to strop. With this stone, it's 400/800 > strop, and I get edges as good, acc to my home sharpness tests, as the DMT progression. It's a fine stone but can't objectively say it's better than a similar DMT set.

I'm OCD I guess, still cautious about recommending it here to folks getting started though, as it hasn't stood the test of time yet. I want to see a couple things first:
* Does it start to have problems with particle tear-out, esp on soft steels. I tested mine with some 440 and so far so good on the particles staying put, but I was VERY light on pressure, kinda babying the stone. After all, it cost $90! :D
* Does the abrasive lose its sharp edges quickly, necessitating a 'refresh' of some type (etching, whatever).

The answer to both is a firm I dunno. For somebody getting started, I'd still say the proven option if you have super steels, is diamond stones by the usual suspects (Atoma, DMT, Ultrasharp, or the handheld Venevs). I don't think I'd start with this as-yet unproven CBN. But that's me, some may feel if Spyderco produces it, it'll be g2g and there is some truth in that.
 
Hi all, apology for the long post. I'm after your recommendation what sharpening systems or stones I should buy (little to no real world freehand experience). I currently own a Spyder Sharpmaker with their default ceramic (mediium, fine + ultra fine) rods. I picked up a tiny Fallkniven DC4, two leather stops, one with compound and one without, some diamond compounds. That's about all I have to sharpen with. My current blade steels are:
  • SK5 (scandi, currently using 600, 1200, 2000, 3000 grit sandapapers)
  • S35VN
  • 12C27 (scandi)
  • VG-10
I'm waiting for a couple of small to medium length blades in 1095 (flat / saber grinds), CPM-CruWear (full flat grind), and 3V (convex). Should I look at getting the Spyderco Medium and Fine ceramic bench stones, a large DMT Diamond Stone, or a sharpening system like the KME, or Wicked Edge Pro (I feel this one is rather expensive for someone who sharpens a blade or two every other week like myself) that will do the same job but more reliably?

Wicked Edge always gets my vote!
 
onionsninja, I suggest you read and study The Razor Edge Book of Sharpening, by John Juranitch. It helped me immensely to understand and apply the few simple sharpening principles better than anything I had read before, and the great photos and drawings helped a lot. The best part was I could get sharp edges afterwards, which I couldn't before. Even if you don't end up freehand sharpening at least you will understand what you are doing and why; make better decisions about what works best for you; and make better use of the good info and advice given here.

Another thing I suggest is deciding early on if you really need and want smooth, refined knife edges. Otherwise you could end up buying high grit stones you don't need.

I don't have anything against guided systems or machines but freehand is usually much less expensive; almost no set-up time; requires very little sharpening space and storage space; edges can be touched up almost anywhere with just a small, portable abrasive; and I get a sense of satisfaction sharpening freehand that I don't with other methods.
 
onionsninja, I suggest you read and study The Razor Edge Book of Sharpening, by John Juranitch. It helped me immensely to understand and apply the few simple sharpening principles better than anything I had read before, and the great photos and drawings helped a lot. The best part was I could get sharp edges afterwards, which I couldn't before. Even if you don't end up freehand sharpening at least you will understand what you are doing and why; make better decisions about what works best for you; and make better use of the good info and advice given here.

Another thing I suggest is deciding early on if you really need and want smooth, refined knife edges. Otherwise you could end up buying high grit stones you don't need.

I don't have anything against guided systems or machines but freehand is usually much less expensive; almost no set-up time; requires very little sharpening space and storage space; edges can be touched up almost anywhere with just a small, portable abrasive; and I get a sense of satisfaction sharpening freehand that I don't with other methods.

Totally agree. It's why I have both. Sometimes I just want to put an edge on and use a stone. Sometimes I want to put a ridiculous edge on and have the time to do the setup.
 
That's a good idea. I was thinking a KME, it's in a similar price range to the low end Wicked Edge.

The Wicked Edge definitely seems reliable, it was a very difficult to decode all their incremental upgrades from one system to the next (a little better clamp here, take away one stone there, throw in extra stones in another system, etc). In the end, it looks like the material costs between their low end, and their top end systems isn't very differnt but has near $900-$1000 difference between them..

I found this comparison chart below. Decided that I wanted the Pro Pack 3, then slowly sat back down when I saw the price tag $$$$$ :D.

https://www.bestsharpeningstones.com/article_details.php?id=3&article_name=Wicked Edge Models

If you want a guided system look at Hapstone they are very systems for the money and are fairly well made,with the Wicked Edge the thing to remember is that you have to buy 2 of every stone and that get's cost's fast plus they don't have a lot of different stones to choose from.

It's also been brought out in another thread that TSProf and Hapstone have made a changes to their systems and some parts were not always backwards compatible with their newer systems and that is true but booth company's have seemed to learned their lesson's that way.

If you get a guided system stick with something that use's edge pro format stones as your selection of stones will be second to none and the 6 inch long edge pro stones are faster to sharpen with over the KME and the stone selection again is much better over the KME's 4 stone selection.

https://www.gritomatic.com/collections/hapstone
 
Totally agree. It's why I have both. Sometimes I just want to put an edge on and use a stone. Sometimes I want to put a ridiculous edge on and have the time to do the setup.

Having the guide-crafted edge to compare also makes a good benchmark for your freehand. Never stop improving.
 
That's a good idea. I was thinking a KME, it's in a similar price range to the low end Wicked Edge.

The Wicked Edge definitely seems reliable, it was a very difficult to decode all their incremental upgrades from one system to the next (a little better clamp here, take away one stone there, throw in extra stones in another system, etc). In the end, it looks like the material costs between their low end, and their top end systems isn't very differnt but has near $900-$1000 difference between them..

I found this comparison chart below. Decided that I wanted the Pro Pack 3, then slowly sat back down when I saw the price tag $$$$$ :D.

https://www.bestsharpeningstones.com/article_details.php?id=3&article_name=Wicked Edge Models

I have the KME and I came to the same conclusion you did. A lot of other systems look more ridged, sturdy, have larger stones, etc but for whatever reason most of these systems are nearly double the price of the KME. The shorter stones just take a bit longer but with the extra coarse the work is still very quick on even high carbide steels. I think the KME is about the point of diminishing returns in the guided knife sharpening market right now. Sure you can pay more to get a better system, but the returns you get in edge performance for every dollar spent gets pretty slim.
 
onionsninja, I suggest you read and study The Razor Edge Book of Sharpening, by John Juranitch. It helped me immensely to understand and apply the few simple sharpening principles better than anything I had read before, and the great photos and drawings helped a lot. The best part was I could get sharp edges afterwards, which I couldn't before. Even if you don't end up freehand sharpening at least you will understand what you are doing and why; make better decisions about what works best for you; and make better use of the good info and advice given here.

Another thing I suggest is deciding early on if you really need and want smooth, refined knife edges. Otherwise you could end up buying high grit stones you don't need.

I don't have anything against guided systems or machines but freehand is usually much less expensive; almost no set-up time; requires very little sharpening space and storage space; edges can be touched up almost anywhere with just a small, portable abrasive; and I get a sense of satisfaction sharpening freehand that I don't with other methods.

Thanks. I just ordered a copy. I've been hoping there would be a hardcover edition of Larrin's book, but I guess I should give up and get the paperback.
I'm just the opposite - I love the precision and simplicity of my Wicked Edge, especially when reprofiling a blade. I sharpened by hand most of my life and hated reprofiling by hand. With my WE130, I can reprofile/sharpen a blade to just about any angle that I want with near perfection. There's not a man on this planet that can do that by hand.
Can you make an edge cut good by hand? Sure. Do we need a good system to be able to sharpen an edge? Nope. But they sure are great to have!
 
If you want a guided system look at Hapstone they are very systems for the money and are fairly well made,with the Wicked Edge the thing to remember is that you have to buy 2 of every stone and that get's cost's fast plus they don't have a lot of different stones to choose from.

It's also been brought out in another thread that TSProf and Hapstone have made a changes to their systems and some parts were not always backwards compatible with their newer systems and that is true but booth company's have seemed to learned their lesson's that way.

If you get a guided system stick with something that use's edge pro format stones as your selection of stones will be second to none and the 6 inch long edge pro stones are faster to sharpen with over the KME and the stone selection again is much better over the KME's 4 stone selection.

https://www.gritomatic.com/collections/hapstone

Each pair of Wicked Edge stones have two grits. So you are actually buying two sets of stones, not just one. Tell the whole truth, please.
 
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