Sheaths for Brass Knuckles ??

[Mark W Douglas]

Now in Ohio you can carry a weapon, so, does anyone make sheaths for brass knuckles to carry on a belt? I can finally carry them on me in the open and call them brass knuckles, instead of carring them in my pocket calling them paperweights

 

[Nismo]

not shure who to go to but get someone to mold you a kydex belt sheath

 

[Blue Jays]

Hi All-

"OUCH! That's gonna' leave a mark!

~ Blue Jays ~

 

[K Williams]

You're serious?!? You can really carry brass knuckles in OH?

 

[Mark W Douglas]

Yes, from the mouth of a cop friend of mine and a little research.

Truth of the matter is, there never really was a law against owning brass knuckles or even carring them, it was illegal to have them on your person and concealed.

The way around that at the time was: NEVER admit to them being brass knuckles or that they are for self defense but rather a paperweight. For example, back before the new carry law Ohio now has if a cop were to find them on you and asked why you are carring brass knuckles, your comment would be: "You mean that paperweight?" At that point they would not be brass knuckles but a paperweight because of how you replied to his question.
A cop would not arrest you for finding them if you answer was of that. A cop would also need to ask you that question if found.

I may go to the Army Navy Surplus store sometime this weekend to see if there may be sheath or carry pouch that these will fit in.

 

[Mark W Douglas]

I never carried these on me and do not plan on carring them with me all the time either .... I would just like to once and a while have them on me as a conversation piece, is all, because they are kind of kool!

 

[Mark W Douglas]

http://www.ag.state.oh.us/web_applications/concealcarry/About.asp

 

[tonyccw]

Truth of the matter is, there never really was a law against owning brass knuckles or even carring them, it was illegal to have them on your person and concealed.

OK. I'm confused. What's the legal difference between "carrying" and "have them on your person" in Ohio? In NYC, they are one and the same.

 

[eda-koppo]

Possible snag: LEOs or the courts might surmise that a "paperweight" typically does not require a belt holster, regardless of the letter of the law.

 

[Mark W Douglas]

Possible snag: LEOs or the courts might surmise that a "paperweight" typically does not require a belt holster, regardless of the letter of the law.

Exactly! Before the new concealed carry law if you were going to carry these bad boys, then you would carry them in you pocket referring to them as paperweights. Now that you can carry them on you person, in a pouch or sheath you can now refer to them as brass knuckles, if you wish. This is my understanding of the new law from what a LEO told me and from what I have gathered from reading about this.

 

[Mark W Douglas]

http://onlinedocs.andersonpublishing.com/oh/lpExt.dll?f=templates&fn=main-h.htm&cp=PORC

See Article 2923.20 Unlawful transaction in weapons. Publication Ohio Revised Code.
Or in the search field on this site, type in Brass Knuckles.

Basically the laws pertaining to these weapons still being illegal weapons to have or carry refer to individuals while intoxicated or under disability. Section #'s 2923.13 or 2923.15 Also individuals with convictions or records it is illegal for them to carry weapons.

Individuals who are not any of the above, it's now legal from what I see and hear.

 

[tonyccw]

http://onlinedocs.andersonpublishing.com/oh/lpExt.dll?f=templates&fn=main-h.htm&cp=PORC
Individuals who are not any of the above, it's now legal from what I see and hear.

Watch out for Article 2923.24, Section A:

§ 2923.24. Possessing criminal tools.

(A) No person shall possess or have under the person's control any substance, device, instrument, or article, with purpose to use it criminally.

In NYC, the intent of using that item to defend yourself, regardless of how it's carried, qualifies as a criminal intent, because the act itself is nothing short of potential assult with a dangerous "paperweight".

It's certainly a good thing the statutes in Ohio are on the vague side.

 

[pcnorton]

In NYC, the intent of using that item to defend yourself, regardless of how it's carried, qualifies as a criminal intent, because the act itself is nothing short of potential assult with a dangerous "paperweight".

Does anybody elese here find this offensive? I mean using them to defene=criminal intent? Come on, when does defense become criminal intent.


Paul

 

[Mark W Douglas]

If carring the item just for the heck of it because you like the item for it's conversation piece, or whatever reason other than to purposely do harm to someone by or from performing a criminal act, then it is not illegal anymore from what I am reading and hearing. Even to carry it as a tool of self defense is okay .....

§ 2923.24. Possessing criminal tools.

(A) No person shall possess or have under the person's control any substance, device, instrument, or article, with purpose to use it criminally.

not being a criminal under these circumstances mentioned above!

 

[tonyccw]

Does anybody elese here find this offensive? I mean using them to defene=criminal intent? Come on, when does defense become criminal intent.
Paul

Even to carry it as a tool of self defense is okay .....

not being a criminal under these circumstances mentioned above!

I don't make the rules, just letting people know that there are some real liberal interpertations of the rules out there. But to answer your question, regardless of what your intent is, carrying a device for the sole purpose of inflicting injury to another person, even in the act of self defense, is criminal intent for the purpose of assault, in the eyes of NYC LEO's. It's the rational for the outlawing of martial arts weapons (nunchucks, tonfas, kobutons etc), billy clubs, and other non-lethal "self defence" devices.

Your situation, as compared to where you live, may be entirely different.

My understanding of the laws of NYC are as explained to me by my lawyer and by my many NYPD, and ADA friends. I suggest you at least get a second opinion/interpertation from an officer of the court before you proceed. In this situation, if you are wrong with the interpertation, the consequences can be pretty severe.

 

[Mark W Douglas]

still on the look out for a carry pouch for the legal knuckles

 

[Mark W Douglas]

Well, I guess I stand partially corrected. Talk to a lawyer about this and he pointed out this Ohio Revised Code:

§ 2923.12. Carrying concealed weapons.


(A) No person shall knowingly carry or have, concealed on the person's person or concealed ready at hand, any of the following:


(1) A deadly weapon other than a handgun;


(2) A handgun other than a dangerous ordnance;


(3) A dangerous ordnance.


(B) No person who has been issued a license or temporary emergency license to carry a concealed handgun under section 2923.125 [2923.12.5] or 2923.1213 [2923.12.13] of the Revised Code or a license to carry a concealed hangun that was issued by another state with which the attorney general has entered into a reciprocity agreement under section 109.69 of the Revised Code, who is stopped for a law enforcement purpose, and who is carrying a concealed handgun shall fail to promptly inform any law enforcement officer who approaches the person after the person has been stopped that the person has been issued a license or temporary emergency license to carry a concealed handgun and that the person then is carrying a concealed handgun.


(C) (1) This section does not apply to officers, agents, or employees of this or any other state or the United States, or to law enforcement officers, authorized to carry concealed weapons or dangerous ordnance and acting within the scope of their duties.


(2) Division (A)(2) of this section does not apply to any of the following:



(a) An officer, agent, or employee of this or any other state or the United States, or a law enforcement officer, who is authorized to carry a handgun and acting within the scope of the officer's, agent's, or employee's duties;


(b) A person who, at the time of the alleged carrying or possession of a handgun, is carrying a valid license or temporary emergency license to carry a concealed handgun issued to the person under section 2923.125 [2023.12.5] or 2923.1213 [2923.12.13] of the Revised Code or a license to carry a concealed handgun that was issued by another state with which the attorney general has entered into a reciprocity agreement under section 109.69 of the Revised Code, unless the person knowingly is in a place described in division (B) of section 2923.126 [2923.12.6] of the Revised Code.


(D) It is an affirmative defense to a charge under division (A)(1) of this section of carrying or having control of a weapon other than a handgun and other than a dangerous ordnance that the actor was not otherwise prohibited by law from having the weapon and that any of the following applies :


(1) The weapon was carried or kept ready at hand by the actor for defensive purposes while the actor was engaged in or was going to or from the actor's lawful business or occupation, which business or occupation was of a character or was necessarily carried on in a manner or at a time or place as to render the actor particularly susceptible to criminal attack, such as would justify a prudent person in going armed.


(2) The weapon was carried or kept ready at hand by the actor for defensive purposes while the actor was engaged in a lawful activity and had reasonable cause to fear a criminal attack upon the actor, a member of the actor's family, or the actor's home, such as would justify a prudent person in going armed.


(3) The weapon was carried or kept ready at hand by the actor for any lawful purpose and while in the actor's own home.


(4) The weapon was being transported in a motor vehicle for any lawful purpose, was not on the actor's person, and, if the weapon was a firearm, was carried in compliance with the applicable requirements of division (C) of section 2923.16 of the Revised Code.


(E) It is an affirmative defense to a charge under division (A) of this section of carrying or having control of a handgun other than a dangerous ordnance that the actor was not otherwise prohibited by law from having the handgun and that the handgun was carried or kept ready at hand by the actor for any lawful purpose and while in the actor's own home, provided that this affirmative defense is not available unless the actor, prior to arriving at the actor's own home, did not transport or possess the handgun in a motor vehicle in a manner prohibited by division (B) or (C) of section 2923.16 of the Revised Code while the motor vehicle was being operated on a street, highway, or other public or private property used by the public for vehicular traffic.


(F) No person who is charged with a violation of this section shall be required to obtain a license or temporary emergency license to carry a concealed handgun under section 2923.125 [2923.12.5] or 2923.1213 [2923.12.13] of the Revised Code as a condition for the dismissal of the charge.


(G) (1) Whoever violates this section is guilty of carrying concealed weapons. Except as otherwise provided in this division or division (G)(2) of this section, carrying concealed weapons in violation of division (A) of this section is a misdemeanor of the first degree. Except as otherwise provided in this division or division (G)(2) of this section, if the offender previously has been convicted of a violation of this section or of any offense of violence, if the weapon involved is a firearm that is either loaded or for which the offender has ammunition ready at hand, or if the weapon involved is dangerous ordnance, carrying concealed weapons in violation of division (A) of this section is a felony of the fourth degree. Except as otherwise provided in division (G)(2) of this section, if the weapon involved is a firearm and the violation of this section is committed at premises for which a D permit has been issued under Chapter 4303. of the Revised Code or if the offense is committed aboard an aircraft, or with purpose to carry a concealed weapon aboard an aircraft, regardless of the weapon involved, carrying concealed weapons in violation of division (A) of this section is a felony of the third degree.


(2) If a person being arrested for a violation of division (A)(2) of this section promptly produces a valid license or temporary emergency license to carry a concealed handgun issued under section 2923.125 [2923.12.5] or 2923.1213 [2923.12.13] of the Revised Code or a license to carry a concealed handgun that was issued by another state with which the attorney general has entered into a reciprocity agreement under section 109.69 of the Revised Code, and if at the time of the violation the person was not knowingly in a place described in division (B) of section 2923.126 [2923.12.6] of the Revised Code, the officer shall not arrest the person for a violation of that division. If the person is not able to promptly produce any of those types of license and if the person is not in a place described in that section, the officer may arrest the person for a violation of that division, and the offender shall be punished as follows:


(a) The offender shall be guilty of a minor misdemeanor if both of the following apply:


(i) Within ten days after the arrest, the offender presents a license or temporary emergency license to carry a concealed handgun issued under section 2923.125 [2923.12.5] or 2923.1213 [2923.12.13] of the Revised Code or a license to carry a concealed handgun that was issued by another state with which the attorney general has entered into a reciprocity agreement under section 109.69 of the Revised Code, which license was valid at the time of the arrest to the law enforcement agency that employs the arresting officer.


(ii) At the time of the arrest, the offender was not knowingly in a place described in division (B) of section 2923.126 [2923.12.6] of the Revised Code.


(b) The offender shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and shall be fined five hundred dollars if all of the following apply:


(i) The offender previously had been issued a license to carry a concealed handgun under section 2923.125 [2923.12.5] of the Revised Code or a license to carry a concealed handgun that was issued by another state with which the attorney general has entered into a reciprocity agreement under section 109.69 of the Revised Code and that was similar in nature to a license issued under section 2923.125 [2923.12.5] of the Revised Code, and that license expired within the two years immediately preceding the arrest.


(ii) Within forty-five days after the arrest, the offender presents any type of license identified in division (G)(2)(a)(i) of this section to the law enforcement agency that employed the arresting officer, and the offender waives in writing the offender's right to a speedy trial on the charge of the violation that is provided in section 2945.71 of the Revised Code.


(iii) At the time of the commission of the offense, the offender was not knowingly in a place described in division (B) of section 2923.126 [2923.12.6] of the Revised Code.


(c) If neither division (G)(2)(a) nor (b) of this section applies, the offender shall be punished under division (G)(1) of this section.


(3) Carrying concealed weapons in violation of division (B) of this section is a misdemeanor of the fourth degree.


(H) If a law enforcement officer stops a person to question the person regarding a possible violation of this section, for a traffic stop, or for any other law enforcement purpose, if the person surrenders a firearm to the officer, either voluntarily or pursuant to a request or demand of the officer, and if the officer does not charge the person with a violation of this section or arrest the person for any offense, the person is not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing the firearm, and the firearm is not contraband, the officer shall return the firearm to the person at the termination of the stop.

HISTORY: 134 v H 511 (Eff 1-1-74); 135 v H 716 (Eff 1-1-74); 141 v H 51 (Eff 7-30-86); 146 v S 2. Eff 7-1-96; 150 v H 12, § 1, eff. 4-8-04.

According to this I would surmise that the new Ohio concealed carry weapon law only pertains to firearms because you would need a permit to carry one. Other weapons there are no permits.

See the blue text above, It may still be legal in these cases.

If in the case you are not in accordance with any of the above, if you were to have a pair of brass knuckles with you, make sure they are not concealed and you never referred to them as brass knuckles, but rather a paperweight or a nostalgic piece. IF you are not doing anything illegal with them or not doing any other illegal crime, more than likely nothing would be said or done about it by a LEO. 99% of the time a LEO is not going to frisk you if you aren't doing anything wrong. The attorney and my LEO friend told me this. Not saying though that they can't take them from you or charge you with possession of a weapon if found on you if not in accordance with the above exceptions, but highly unlikely if you are a law bidding citizen and have no past record.

Edited to add:

Check this portion out closely.
(2) The weapon was carried or kept ready at hand by the actor for defensive purposes while the actor was engaged in a lawful activity and had reasonable cause to fear a criminal attack upon the actor, a member of the actor's family, or the actor's home, such as would justify a prudent person in going armed.
Do you wear alot of expensive jewelry or have and expensive car?

 

[tonyccw]

Well, I guess I stand partially corrected. Talk to a lawyer about this and he pointed out this Ohio Revised Code:

Not saying though that they can't take them from you or charge you with possession of a weapon if found on you if not in accordance with the above exceptions, but highly unlikely if you are a law bidding citizen and have no past record.

Thanks for going for the second opinion. So now that we have a better understanding of the rules regarding carrying, do you still want a pouch? It would violate this statement:

If you were to have a pair of brass knuckles with you, make sure they are not concealed and you never referred to them as brass knuckles,....

Which leads me to believe that the paperweight needs to readily visible, and not entirely enclosed in a pouch or carrying case.

Check this portion out closely.
(2) The weapon was carried or kept ready at hand by the actor for defensive purposes while the actor was engaged in a lawful activity and had reasonable cause to fear a criminal attack upon the actor, a member of the actor's family, or the actor's home, such as would justify a prudent person in going armed.
Do you wear alot of expensive jewelry or have and expensive car?

Lucky you. I wear a high end watch and drive a Mercedes, but I don't get to apply Ohio's rules to NYC...

 

[Mark W Douglas]

(2) The weapon was carried or kept ready at hand by the actor for defensive purposes while the actor was engaged in a lawful activity and had reasonable cause to fear a criminal attack upon the actor, a member of the actor's family, or the actor's home, such as would justify a prudent person in going armed.

Under this article, yes a pouch would be okay for these and you would not be illegal.

If not found under this article, a first time offender would be charged a misdameanor which is a small fine and a slap on the hand, usually.