So About Those Carbon Steels...

Eli Chaps

Eli Chaps

Joined
Apr 20, 2018
Messages
4,458
Hello Knife Nuts,

You all were very patient with me on my slip joint conundrum so I'm once again going to put it to the test. :D

Now, I know carbon steel blades have survived for generations. I get that. But, are they fussy?

I like to use my knives not fret over them. It might be that I slice an orange in half and the best the blade gets at the time is a swipe across the front of my paint leg.

I realize they aren't going to rust before my eyes under normal circumstances but I'm just not sure how sensitive they really are. I also understand my environment, usage, etc. is a factor so just asking an "in general" type question. I also understand the patina process. Do you oil them often?

GEC has some gorgeous offerings but I've been reluctant based on the 1095.

Once I again I ask, am I just being stupid?

Thanks in advance. :)
 
Once you get a decent patina, then the "wipe on the jeans" thing works fine. If water is available, then a rinse and wipe is better.Just a little common sense in taking care of carbon steel works fine.
I am definitely biased toward carbon steel but I'm sure you'll get some other well based opinions.
I really like the edge it takes and ease of sharpening. I usually oil mine just when I sharpen them. --KV
 
If you want to avoid a patina, then yeah, you need to take a little extra care. Drop of mineral oil in the joint, and spread any excess along the blade (and backsprings for GEC) and then wipe it, every couple of weeks. You can use a metal polish if needed (Simichrome, Wenol, etc) on shiny blades to remove the patina if it forms and you don't like it.

If you are OK with the patina forming, then just the oil every so often, mainly after washing them (assuming you don't want that sticky orange residue on your blade).

I used to regularly carry a Case CV knife and to be honest, unless I cut up fruit, it really didn't develop much of a patina. I have a GEC #12 Powderhorn Jack that doesn't have any more patina than when I got it, but I never use it for food.
 
The joy of well heat-treated 1095 steel is in the using of it. They not only take a terrific edge, but they feel great going over the stones. Stainless steels, because of the chromium in them, feel skatey or gummy on the stones, depending on hardness, and tend toward wire edges. But good carbon steel grates across the stone with a pleasant, crisp coarseness that's hard to describe but easy to feel. And it gets very, very sharp. Keeping the blade dry is more important than keeping it oiled, and a light stropping on even cardboard will keep it sharp a long time. Get one and plunge right in . . . you won't be disappointed.
 
No right or wrong answer here, just preference.

Having said that, carbon can be divisive amongst enthusiasts ;):D There is a school of thought that likes to believe that carbon is the 'real' steel for Traditionals and suffers from selective memory about stainless and its edge holding ;)

Others just like to build up patina as a beautiful contrast, this is understandable but it does take some doing. Some knives get really ugly streaky rust-sorry patina and I usually polish it off and start again, this too can be rewarding. The more often you use and cary a carbon knife the better it looks. Don't use it for a while and it can look leaden or lacklustre and if not protected rust or pitting can get underway.

I use my knives to prepare foods, cheese, sausage, fruits in particular and I certainly prefer stainless for this, it's cleaner, hygienic and does not impart metallic taint on foods. When I use carbon knives to cut citrus it can give a great patina if you wash to blade under very hot water and simply dry it on a cloth. Drying is key. Most people put a bit of mineral oil on the blade from time to time to keep rust at bay but like I wrote earlier, a carbon blade in day in day out use looks good and will not show rusting unless left wet.

Most of my Traditional American knives are carbon, not from my choice but what's available. Since Queen Cutlery imploded we don't have D2 on common offer and that's a pity but that too patinas with citrus but it won't really rust and it doesn't impart flavours. I like Sandvik, the Japanese stainless steels, 154cm, and the Lionsteel version, in fact most stainless steels;) The more modern ones stay sharp-although pocket knife tasks tend not to be daunting-far better than carbon which needs frequent stropping. Carbon has survived for many many reasons, not least because it's liked:D But then, it's very cheap to produce, easy on tooling and usually easy to edge.

But man cannot cut by carbon alone:D
 
Well there is a false dichotomy here, which is solved by the fact that you can carry more than one pocketknife. :)

There was a time when I had more leeway as to what cutting implements I could have with me in my daily pursuits. I routinely kept a Case Slimline Trapper (stainless) in my bag, and a Case Small Texas Jack (CV) in my pocket. The Jack got used for everything but food. The Slimline trapper was my designated food knife. Use it, wash with soapy water, rinse, dry with paper towel, back in the bag it went.

Best of both worlds that way.
 
Whenever a discussion like this comes up, I am reminded of the words my dad told me the day he gave me my first knife, "You want high carbon steel, it takes a good edge and will sharpen easily and finely. Stay away from that stainless junk, it is too soft and is near impossible to sharpen".

Now, that was over 25 years ago and my dad was a product of the '40s so that might give you some context as to what his line of thinking was. Funny how something like that will stick with you...

Though I do tend to gravitate towards 1095 and other equivalents, I know enough about steels these days to know that you can get some very high quality stainless. 1095 though, can be a tough, hard working steel that is easy to sharpen in the field and will take a nice keen edge. If you keep it clean, dry, and well oiled, it will serve you well for a lifetime and then some. I tend to give my users a good rinse when using for food, followed by a dry towel. At the end of the day, I wipe them down with an oily rag before returning to my knife case.

Climate can play a big factor in the impact on the knives you carry and sometimes all of the oiling and drying in the world will not save your knife from spots and pitting. This is where a quality stainless can really shine. I just received my first stainless GEC today and I am looking forward to seeing how their 440 measures up to their 1095. Stainless for GEC is a bit few and far between but they can be found.
 
Besides oiling, if you want to protect 1095, it can also be blued (how they keep gun barrels from rusting).
I have blued two of my 1095 blades and like the result.
You may not like the fact that a blued blade will no longer be shiny chrome, but with the right handle configuration it can look really nice.

full
 
Sweatiness and climate are definitely a factor. I’m a little festidious with my knives except for my GEC bullnose. I oil it every couple weeks and wipe off and apple juice.

If you’re cutting food and you have a heavy patina, you will taste some iron.
 
Traditional blades in carbon steel sharpen easy and they look really nice with patina.
Many stainless sharpen just as easy, but patina just looks so good in my opinion.
I will have to agree with others that after patina forms then a basic wipe off can be sufficient.
I do maker sure to use some water though because carbon steel or not fruits leave blades sticky and I don't like that.
 
I was looking to see, generally, where you live. If you are around lots of humidity or salt air then you may get a little frustrated. I'm out in Colorado, basically high desert, and I have many plain high carbon folders and like and enjoy using them. I often use them on food and have some pretty pronounced patina on them but zero rust.
I never oil the blades; just the pivots. They might look prettier if I did.
I say get at least one nice GEC or what ever you like and just use it and find out for yourself how it works for you where you live.
 
Okay I'm the first to admit that I know very little about steel, it's composition and what that means to it's performance and so on. I do understand heat treat and it's importance and also I have however been using, sharpening and maintaining knives a long time in both carbon and stainless. I have also read these type threads both here and other forums I participate on and they seem to always evolve around patina and preferences of the individual as opposed to a definitive, fact based reason why one is superior to the other which leads me to believe most folks don't really know if one is actually better than the other I don't that's for sure. What I do know is that I've never worn out a SS or Carbon blade from having to sharpen it too often because of poor edge retention. I don't like patina so I spend a bit more maintenance time on carbon. I've never met a blade on a decent knife that wouldn't take a sharp edge some may require more effort to get it sharp as example I have a Blur with an Elmax blade I must have hit with 500 strokes per side to get it sharp.
So Eli Chaps Eli Chaps as to the GEC 1095 IMO it's a very fine steel but if it's a user and you don't like patina then it's going to take a bit of extra care They make a product called Tuf Cloth that is a cloth that is impregnated with a rust inhibitor that will fight patina you can carry with you for less than $10 and wipe your knife as needed.
 
If you are using it at all a little "discoloration" is only an issue if you yourself (and all your friends) are exceptionally shiny and pretty. :rolleyes: Otherwise it becomes one of your user friends and will last a lifetime without complaining. Keep it dry as you can before you stash it away. Enjoy the knife and more so with good carbon steel that shows you care. :thumbsup:

Ray - been used and looks it, but still loved :D
 
I was having pizza with my kids while bottle feeding my infant and using a GEC in 1095 to cut the pizza one handed for my 2 and 4 year olds. Knife was put on the table and I forgot to wipe off the grease and tomato sauce until after we finished and cleaned up maybe 20 minutes later. Wiped it well on a napkin, no rust blooms and no problems, though the patina did change some.
Once it gets a little grey from use, it won't "react" as much and becomes easier to maintain.
And carbon steel with natural scale material like bone or stag or wood just takes on a 'gravitas' that I personally feel stainless can't achieve.
 
As I said, I don't mind a patina.

And I don't mind some upkeep. I often use "black" steel and cast iron in my cooking. In fact, tonight I was doing a little seasoning upkeep on my Matfer 12" after cooking dinner. But that's something I do basically right after use.

With a pocket knife it might be a while before I get to it. :)
 
I feel that traditional pocket knives would benefit from blades made of modern stainless steel. I'm no steel nerd, but choosing between surgical stainless and carbon steel...really? Those of you who like your patina could still have it , I'd just like to have one more option. I'd buy a Copperlock in 154CM in an instant.
 
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