Spyderco Para-Military vs. Tenacious

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mdarby

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I was thinking for my next purchase of buying either a Spyderco Kopa with CF scales (which I could conceivably carry to work at my office) or a Spyderco Para Military, which I couldn't, but which attracted me for it's great reviews and because I wanted to check out the lock.

I visited the only local store that carried the PM, but found out they recently stopped buying it. The sales person suggested instead a Tenacious. He said it was quite similar. In checking out the specs, they look similar. I am aware that the Tenacious is made in China, not S30V and has a liner lock, which would defeat the purpose somewhat. Are there other important differences which justify the price? The PM handle / blade cutout seemed to permit more grip area on the handle / blade. I've read that the compression lock is a more complex lock and thus has higher labor costs, which makes sense.

If anybody has a side-by-side picture or other impressions that would be great. Thanks!
 
I don't own a PM, but I do have a Tenacious. I think the biggest differences you'll see will be in steel performance and in overall quality of the knife. The chinese steel used in the Tenacious won't hold an edge as long as the PM's s30v, but it will be easier to sharpen. The overall fit, finish, and quality of the Tenacious won't be as good, either. Bottom line is this: You get what you pay for. If you want a more economical knife that will still cut well and is designed extremely well, go for the Tenacious. If you want a higher quality, more expensive knife, go for the PM. But don't look for the one to replace the other, as they are different knives entirely.
 
mdarby said:
I've read that the compression lock is a more complex lock and thus has higher labor costs, which makes sense.
Click to expand...

I highly doubt that. The compression lock is basically just a liner lock on the back (it's a bit more complex than that, but for all intents and purposes, it's the same). It is, however, a rock solid lock.

I don't have a Tenacious, but I may pick one up in the future just because of the hype. It looks like a good knife with a great blade shape.

No side by side shots, I'm sure someone will come along soon with one, but here's my Para just to push you a little further in that direction... ;)

Para.jpg


Great knife.
 
I am on my 2nd Paramiitary. I LOVE THIS KNIFE. It is my go to knife even over my $400-$500 folders.
 
Don't have a Tenacious myself and do not know the quality of them. However, "Made in China" is a dealbreaker for me.
 
The tenacious is a good knife, but c'mon, the para beats it all day..in my opinion at least...
 
I have both of them, and they are both good knives for the money. The Tenacious is a good knife for $35, but no way is it the same quality as the Para.
 
Para is an excellent folder, but I think Tenac is also a great folder even though they do not belong in the same class. Tenac is very easy to sharpen because of the softer steel, and it has wider point (I like wider point for my beater). Ergo on the Tenac is also another great point. It is made in China, but it definitely doesn't show. Fit and finish is very good (although not excellent), and it offers a big belly suitable for skinning games.

My suggestion is to get both. Tenac is around $30, so it won't really hurt your wallet. Beside, you can always sell it if you don't like it.
 
I have owned both. Kept the Para.

The Paramilitary:

  1. Is lighter
  2. Has better steel
  3. Has at least two steel choices - maybe more
  4. Cuts better
  5. Is made in the USA
  6. Opens and closes easier
  7. Has a unique lock
  8. Comes in different colors
  9. Looks better (in my opinion)
  10. Has a big handle in relation to its blade - some people like this, some don't

The Tenacious:

  1. Is cheaper
  2. Comes in a combo edge version (I think the Para is full PE or SE only)
  3. Is heavier
  4. Has inferior steel
  5. Has a thicker blade with thicker liners and is presumably stronger
  6. Is made in China
  7. Has a slightly stiff liner lock
  8. Comes in black only
 
It has been said in one form or another, but I will summarize. The Para is a superior knife to the Tenacious if you value the features over the cost difference.

For me it was a question of duty cycle. I buy an EDC knife with the mindset that I will never replace it (I always do, but you get the point). If you are going to use this knife for a duty that will likely result in loss, perhaps the less expensive option gains an edge...otherwise, I know I would always kick myself for not buying the better knife in the first place...and end up buying it too.

I suspect the dealer was trying to sell what he had, and many dealers stock what they can sell (in these economics). I do not fault him, just as I would not fault him for trying to step you the other way (from a Tenac. to a PM).
 
I own a Persistence, a smaller version of the Tenacious, and like it for what it is - an economical beater knife. It feels good in hand and is cheap, so you can use it hard and not feel bad. That said, the steel is a bit annoying for me. It loses an edge very fast and I'm not a guy who likes to sharpen his knives all the time.

My experience with CPM S30V has been fantastic. It holds a very sharp edge for a long time and is not that difficult to keep sharp. It really has me spoiled. :p

If you want a knife in that size, save up and get the Para. Once you have it in hand and use it, you'll know what all the hype is about. If you get the Tenacious, you'll still be thinking about the Para. ;)

EDIT

Be advised that a Para 2 is coming sometime in 2010. There will be a series of refinements to the design. There is no release date yet, so it is likely that we have to wait.
 
Thanks for all the feedback. If a Para Military II is coming out next year, I think I'll jump on the Tenacious now and then purchase purchase either a current or new-model PM once they arrive. I do like the long handle to blade of the PM, am interested to try the compression lock, and may try the digital camo scales just so I have something other than black.

One final clarification: beyond the features people have mentioned (better steel, place of manufacture, weight, etc.) there are consistent comments on "quality" and "fit and finish." How exactly would one perceive that? I ask because of the 15 or so <$150 knives I have (mostly Benchmade, Kershaw and Spyderco) I don't recall any noticeable quality issues. (Exceptions: Gerber Paraframe and Benchmade Mini Pika, both of which I really dislike, are almost impossible to open one-handed, etc.) None of my knives have come with off-center blades, dull blades, blade wiggle, etc. My three Natives, for example, have rock-solid lockup.

So I am curious what kind of things more experienced knife collectors are seeing.

Thanks again for all the responses, they've helped me to decide to buy both but in the right order and timing.
 
Fit and finish refers to many subtle differences in a knife. Often these differences arent that noticble in function but are seen in a close expection of the knife. A few example:
- The knife doesnt have any welding marks or "dings" from molds etc. They may use higher quality materials for things such as the washers.
- The screws may be nicer or the backspacer of higher quality
-Finish on the blade is very consistent and edge very sharp--good grind
- The knife just doesnt feel cheap--and yes there are folders out there that I find feel cheap even though they are expensive. (cough coldsteel cough)
-Lockup is solid and stays solid for years of work
- Blade is centered--although many high end folders arent always perfect but i find after 300 or more they tend to be.

Im sure there are many other things, but as you become familiar with high end knives I find I can really see a difference.

As for the original para mil question I think it will winds hands down over the ten but it is much more expensive. Different knife for different people. If on a very tight budget and you just need a working knife, I think the ten works great. If your looking for a a knife to be proud of and really want a knife that will be your companion for years to come, I think the para is the way to go. I have my para sitting beside me as I type this and I can tell you that I love this knife. It really is a great tool with a lot of character.
 
The Tenacious is a much better value for the money. A brand new Para would run you a conservative $125. That's three (3) Tenacious(s) and enough money left over for a decent dinner.

That being said, I prefer the Para. Lighter, larger handle (in relation to blade size, as mentioned some like this others don't), better clip, better steel, and Military style blade.
 
Paramilitary 2 - Implementation of a new Bushing Pivot System generates fluid action and more consistent manufacturing tolerances
 
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