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Survive! Knives Forum Closed - What Changed?

Discussion in 'FEEDBACK: The Good, The Bad, The Ugly!' started by ncrockclimb, Aug 4, 2018.

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  1. Casinostocks

    Casinostocks Factotum Platinum Member

    Mar 20, 2016
    Oh KELAMA, you broke my heart homie. We're only like what, 10 minutes away from each other and I was going to come to Ponto Beach to watch you surf. Sniff!

    BTW, Meridian ID is down south in the Valley. Perhaps your friend has a 4000+ acre ranch there, in case you really wanted to visit the current Survive!

    Just a heads up, lil buddy.
    CataD and Insipid Moniker like this.
  2. trevitrace

    trevitrace Gold Member Gold Member

    Jul 21, 2013


    Jun 28, 2013
    Excellent perspective! :thumbsup::thumbsup:

    I sure wish I could buy you a beer right now, SS! :D It's been a long, hot, hard week of work here in SoCal...

    just got home to I nice cold IPA...& these posts of yours capped off a perfect, productive week. Thanks for the big laugh, brother!
    NCCNC likes this.
  4. Casinostocks

    Casinostocks Factotum Platinum Member

    Mar 20, 2016
    ^ hey! What about that beer, grub and "Obama" fries at some joint you had named in Carlsbad, which you had promised me when you had invited me to meet up with so that you could see my then owned GSOs, like 5.1 / 4.7 / 10 plus some of the Carothers??? While I'm at it, you seem to owe lots of folks on here some crisp $100 bills.

    Apologies to the regulars for the OT, but this guy is truly a "special" one ;)
    craytab, CataD and Insipid Moniker like this.
  5. Foghorn Leghorn Fan

    Foghorn Leghorn Fan Platinum Member Platinum Member

    Jul 27, 2011
    A thread where both Survive! and Kelama are being taken to task, the beauty of this is beyond words.
  6. bhyde

    bhyde UNNECESSARY EVIL Staff Member Super Mod Moderator Platinum Member

    Mar 19, 2002
    @KELAMA @Skystorm @shinyedges @grogimus

    Remember that rule where we discuss the topic and not each other? Heed the rule..

    @KELAMA - Your posts were nothing more than the praising of bad behavior in the previous sentence.
    Cut the shit and knock it off. Stick to the topic and not each other..party favors to follow to those that don't heed the rule.
  7. Thomas Linton

    Thomas Linton

    Jun 16, 2003
    Not "interpreting," although I see your point. The FTC made the rule by delegated authority from Congress. Their words, for better or worse, are the law.

    Did S!K automatically refund all the money on all the late orders within thirty days or less except where the customer agreed to waive his right to such a refund?

    As a three-time customer, I know they did not.
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
    L.H.S and bonky like this.
  8. ncrockclimb


    Nov 20, 2014
    That is the most concise and accurate summary I have seen.
    craytab likes this.
  9. Thomas Linton

    Thomas Linton

    Jun 16, 2003
    "By law, you must have a reasonable basis for stating that a product can be shipped within a certain time. If your advertising doesn't clearly and prominently state the shipment period, you must have a reasonable basis for believing that you can ship within 30 days.

    If you can't ship within the promised time (or within 30 days if you made no promise), you must notify the customer of the delay, provide a revised shipment date and explain his right to cancel and get a full and prompt refund.

    For definite delays of up to 30 days, you may treat the customer's silence as agreeing to the delay. But for longer or indefinite delays - and second and subsequent delays - you must get the customer's written, electronic or verbal consent to the delay. If the customer doesn't give you his okay, you must promptly refund all the money the customer paid you without being asked by the customer.

    Finally, you have the right to cancel orders that you can't fill in a timely manner, but you must promptly notify the customer of your decision and make a prompt refund."

    Federal Trade Commission. 08/11/2018
  10. shinyedges

    shinyedges Unfaltering Love & Undeviating Will Platinum Member

    Jun 5, 2012
    I apologize, I should know better :oops:
    bhyde likes this.
  11. stonesell

    stonesell Gold Member Gold Member

    Feb 20, 2009
    I like your knowledge of the law, and pertinent helpful postings; it gives us some logic to follow.
    My take on those two is not based solely on logic.
    I see them as “confidence operators”, they can get away with things that most people could not, and then actually turn it around so that people like and support them, because they look like the victims.
    They just make up their own laws, and use their personalities and people control skills, to cover their tracks.
  12. brute steel

    brute steel

    Jan 27, 2018
    I Dm'd Millit in IG. He's frustrated that he's name is attached with the failures of this company. However, he will help Guy out until all the orders the fulfilled, and wants to part of it after. He's looking at 12 mos. from now.

    This is clearly a writing on the wall nearing the end S!K
    buckfynn and Quiet like this.
  13. ncrockclimb


    Nov 20, 2014
    Without a screenshot of the conversation (and Millit consenting to you posting it here), your comments are very unbelievable.
  14. ndmiller

    ndmiller Platinum Member Platinum Member

    Nov 30, 2015
    Out of curiosity has anyone file a complaint with the FTC? I'll be honest, not real versed in consumer protection law except for Lemon with vehicles.

    While the law is nice to know, with/without that knowledge of FTC protection, giving Survive or any company money for years without a delivered product is not responsible consumer behavior. People have to take some responsibility with their money when giving it out for a product not delivered. I've joined some bad kickstarters/indigogo's but even they weren't years late and I asked for a refund after 90 days past due. I bet some would have been angry to all get announced refunds after Survives relatively "indefinite delays", not much would have pleased the angry mob after more than a year of waiting. I generally think some wanted their knives and still do which is why Survive has any outstanding orders at all. I also think some of the anger about Survive is their unwillingness to listen to the "expert" internet advice/solutions given by members here over the past few years.

    Personally I was guessing double that (~2 years), although 12 months of backlog, just shy of a year of stopping taking orders isn't chump change demand (~500-1000 knives?) I do hope when the backlog is over there is still an operating version of Survive!. If there is, obviously I wouldn't buy knives not ready for immediate ship.
    Casinostocks likes this.
  15. shinyedges

    shinyedges Unfaltering Love & Undeviating Will Platinum Member

    Jun 5, 2012
    Survive is history, here. Booted. Shown the door whether you like it or not. Just thought I'd let you know ;)
    bonky likes this.
  16. Casinostocks

    Casinostocks Factotum Platinum Member

    Mar 20, 2016
    Their subforum has been archived, banished, booted, history or whatever term you, me, others want to use. However, the name brand is not history yet so respectfully speaking (I mean it sincerely as I've decided to set aside this BS and nonsensical beef with you and craytab) what is the point of repeating what you keep repeating? Honestly it doesn't serve any purpose if meant to dampen dissenting opinion, but that's just my opinion.

    Survive! as a brand is not completely history as long as their products get bought / sold / traded on the Exchanges in here and as long as people have a chance to come in the GB&U to report back. The ultimate decision about making them totally history on this Site and to purge any mention of them beyond is for the Site Owner to decree them completely DOA and to direct the Supers to close down any related threads, an event which I do not see forthcoming any time soon. I think that it's a great thing that people cam discuss their opinions whether for / against controversial Cos such as Survive! / BRKT / Strider and handful of others which gained notoriety. It speaks volumes about how this Site is being operated not impeding useful discussion of some knifemakers and their products, albeit ugly ones on either or both fronts.
    Phill50 and CataD like this.
  17. shinyedges

    shinyedges Unfaltering Love & Undeviating Will Platinum Member

    Jun 5, 2012
    Whatever, enjoy their archives :cool:.
  18. Casinostocks

    Casinostocks Factotum Platinum Member

    Mar 20, 2016
    Eh, the victory lap joy subsides at some point too :p
    Barrettboy likes this.
  19. danbot

    danbot Gold Member Gold Member

    Oct 31, 2009
    No offence intended here, but I want to use your post because it's a perfect example of why the Survive! Forum had to go.
    You state that they "came out with" the SK line. All they did was announce a new knife line (as it turns out) a year before it's even (maybe) in the pipeline, But people talk about it like it's a reality. They don't exist!
    They are too good at fooling people.
    Had to go.
  20. Insipid Moniker

    Insipid Moniker Gold Member Gold Member

    Feb 28, 2011
    I'm honestly not entirely sure where you're going with this. No matter what degree of responsibility you think consumers bear, it doesn't absolve Survive of acting illegally and unethically.

    There's also the simple fact that many of those customers who have suffered the most began this ordeal before Survive had shown any particular evidence of dealing in bad faith. Maybe they all should have requested refunds quickly after deadlines came and went, but people in general are very susceptible to the sunk costs fallacy something which, whether intentionally or unintentionally, the situation with Survive has preyed on.
    moshow9, Quiet, danbot and 1 other person like this.
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