Tapping Titanium

[SHARP1983]

I'm needing to tap a thin piece of titanium and not sure what type of tap I will need. The size is a 2-56 and it's a through hole less than a 1/8 in deep. Hole is already partially taped but I need to go completely through. Any suggestions on specific taps?

 

[DavidABQ]

I would post this in the knifemakers forum here at Bladeforums.

 

[Wowbagger]

I'm needing to tap a thin piece of titanium and not sure what type of tap I will need. The size is a 2-56 and it's a through hole less than a 1/8 in deep. Hole is already partially taped but I need to go completely through. Any suggestions on specific taps?

get what is called a taper tap (as aposed to a starting tap or a bottoming tap; though if you don't take the knife apart the bottoming tap may be what you need). Think it out or cut the starting shorter; Dremel with abrasive cutoff wheel is your friend).

Do not get cobalt or hard carbide; plain HSS is fine. lots of lube. Turn in a little' until you get some resistance then back off half turn to beak chip off.
Ti is no big deal at slow speed with patience, and lube.
Slicky makes every little thing go better .

 

[Wowbagger]

I would post this in the knifemakers forum here at Bladeforums.

eeeeyeah . . .
unless you 'bin written up in a magazine don't get your hopes up.
I'm little like that in my main gig.
I can understand an respect that; pay some dues and all

 

[Wowbagger]

2-56

Little known fact :
= same exact thread in old style bicycle spoke nipples.
Tap your nipples today friends.
PS: that would be 2mm x 56 threads per inch ; screwie combo I know. YMMV
pun ? what pun ?

 

[SHARP1983]

get what is called a taper tap (as aposed to a starting tap or a bottoming tap; though if you don't take the knife apart the bottoming tap may be what you need). Think it out or cut the starting shorter; Dremel with abrasive cutoff wheel is your friend).

Do not get cobalt or hard carbide; plain HSS is fine. lots of lube. Turn in a little' until you get some resistance then back off half turn to beak chip off.
Ti is no big deal at slow speed with patience, and lube.
Slicky makes every little thing go better .

Appreciate the help. I had already ordered a tap specifically for Titanium so we shall see. I'll definitely take the knife apart and use plenty of lube. I'll grab some tap magic or use the ol PB Blast.

 

[Wowbagger]

tap magic

I see by your outfit that you are a cowboy.
Good stuff.

 

[J. Doyle]

eeeeyeah . . .
unless you 'bin written up in a magazine don't get your hopes up.
I'm little like that in my main gig.
I can understand an respect that; pay some dues and all

What does this even mean?

Are you saying that unless you're a famous knifemaker, (written about in magazines) they won't help you in the Shop Talk forum?

 

[navman]

yeah...that statement is nowhere near accurate. I am a nobody and have never had anything professionally photo'd let alone written about, and the folks on BF in Shop talk have been immensely supportive and helpful.

WRT tapping Titanium, taper, thread forming tap is what you want, use a quality cutting fluid, even on thin pieces, Titanium gets very grippy with taps. If you do break a tap, mix 50/50 white vinegar and Ferric Chloride etchant and submerge the piece over night. the solution will dissolve the tap without damaging the threads in the titanium.

 

[Diemaker]

You got a tap that is specifically for titanium which is the first step. I expect you will need a cut tap instead of a form tap but the only way to be sure is to accurately measure the untapped hole. If you get this wrong you either end up with broken taps or no threads. If you just need the uncut threads cleared out for a longer screw you can't go wrong with a cut tap. Hopefully it is either a taper or plug spiral POINT 3 flute tap, 4 is too fragile, 2 is not good for hand tapping and spiral FLUTE are much weaker. Use a good tapping lube and try to do it in one pass, backing the tap out to break the chips risks chipping a cutting edge so it is best to minimize doing so. Since saying titanium is about like saying steel how easy it will be depends on what titanium but since you are just finishing a threaded hole most of the work has already been done.

 

[Wowbagger]

What does this even mean?

Are you saying that unless you're a famous knifemaker, (written about in magazines) they won't help you in the Shop Talk forum?

I have been here a long time and many, many years ago all I said was a little post to say I thought I had found a sub forum I could really appreciate and enjoy. Kind of a hi I'm new kind of post.
There was certainly no encouragement to hang around; and I would have been instrumental in helping with a welding / modding / repair issue of some sort as I recall. Seems like I tried again by answering a question over there and there was no thankx etc., so I pulled out.
Are you saying you frequent the knife makers neighborhood, you are not a maker and it's all better now ?

 

[J. Doyle]

I have been here a long time and many, many years ago all I said was a little post to say I thought I had found a sub forum I could really appreciate and enjoy. Kind of a hi I'm new kind of post.
There was certainly no encouragement to hang around; and I would have been instrumental in helping with a welding / modding / repair issue of some sort as I recall. Seems like I tried again by answering a question over there and there was no thankx etc., so I pulled out.
Are you saying you frequent the knife makers neighborhood, you are not a maker and it's all better now ?

I'm saying I think you don't know what you're talking about on that topic.

That group in that forum is more than happy to answer questions....probably TOO much at times. Probably some answering that shouldn't be, but well meaning and attempting to be helpful.

 

[UncleBoots]

There was certainly no encouragement to hang around; and I would have been instrumental in helping with a welding / modding / repair issue of some sort as I recall. Seems like I tried again by answering a question over there and there was no thankx etc., so I pulled out.

I've participated in this and other forums. I've asked questions and answered questions.

At no time can I recall receiving "encouragement to hang around" or "thankx etc."

I didn't expect either of those. It never would have occurred to me to expect it.

As a result, I had very good experiences and came away happy.

 

[Wowbagger]

Dear mods : Once more, into the breach, then I'll stop contributing to this rabbit hole.

I'm saying I think you don't know what you're talking about on that topic.

I will admit that may be a fact in this case.

I've participated in this and other forums. I've asked questions and answered questions.

At no time can I recall receiving "encouragement to hang around" or "thankx etc."

Oh now, about every week I see a new comer to the Spyderco forum be greeted with a "welcome to the forum" on their first few posts, often on the first post and by Sal himself.
It even happens here from time to time.
you have never seen that ?

SHARP 1983 said : "Appreciate the help."

Uncle Boots :
You missed that did you?
I'm just saying old bean . . .

 

[Wowbagger]

You got a tap that is specifically for titanium which is the first step. I expect you will need a cut tap instead of a form tap but the only way to be sure is to accurately measure the untapped hole. If you get this wrong you either end up with broken taps or no threads. If you just need the uncut threads cleared out for a longer screw you can't go wrong with a cut tap. Hopefully it is either a taper or plug spiral POINT 3 flute tap, 4 is too fragile, 2 is not good for hand tapping and spiral FLUTE are much weaker. Use a good tapping lube and try to do it in one pass, backing the tap out to break the chips risks chipping a cutting edge so it is best to minimize doing so. Since saying titanium is about like saying steel how easy it will be depends on what titanium but since you are just finishing a threaded hole most of the work has already been done.

It seems I need to go back to school. Not backing off to break the chip that is usually spiralling larger and larger until the building resistance overcomes the torsional strength of the tap . . . has, in my expedience, caused the tap to snap off. Never seen a chipped tap while I am touching up the sharpness.

Not saying it doesn't happen.
'course I'm not going to touch up a tiny little tap like that.
Maybe the configuration of the specific tap SHARP1983 has is different than I'm familiar with.
what . . .

 

[Sharp & Fiery]

It seems I need to go back to school. Not backing off to break the chip that is usually spiralling larger and larger until the building resistance overcomes the torsional strength of the tap . . . has, in my expedience, caused the tap to snap off. Never seen a chipped tap while I am touching up the sharpness.

Not saying it doesn't happen.
'course I'm not going to touch up a tiny little tap like that.
Maybe the configuration of the specific tap SHARP1983 has is different than I'm familiar with.
what . . .

I know and work with a very good knifemaker who also taps all the way through in one shot. It does break fewer taps…especially if you have experience with tap speeds for different titanium grades.

Also, do a search on J. Doyle knives. John is one of the knifemakers who does contribute to the makers section and his work is what a lot of folks would love to be able to do.

Maybe it’s time to check that sub again, but if your looking to have your ego stroked…it may not be the place for you.

 

[Wowbagger]

I think we are over doing it here.
Think : home shop, low speed . . . and . . . relaaaaaxxxx.

For example I predrilled on the drillpress a plate of titanium, specifically :
Grade 2 Titanium Sheet, Unpolished (Mill) Finish, ASTM B265/ASME SB-265, 0.035" Thickness, 12" Width, 12" Length
then using a simple, spring loaded tap starting alignment accessory I started a starting tap (5mm x .8). Using the method I described above I cut threads about ten mm deep.

PS: I needed a base to attach my , then, new Wicked Edge knife sharpener to. Having no thick stone tile laying around but had this perfectly suited ti plate that I hadn't used (going to cut it up to make knife handles out of "someday" ) I pounced on that for my temporary base.

Two threaded holes, in titanium, no big deal . . . moving on.

Today I inspected my most used small taps, all HSS : 3mm x .5 three flute, 4MM X.7 four flute, 5mm x .8 four flute, which usually get used the most in :
Cromolly
Mild steel
6061 T6 Aluminum

With your warnings in mind I carefully inspected , with a 10x jeweler's visor, my taps on both sides of the flutes (thread cutting edge and chip breaking edge).
There was zero sign of chipping or deformation. Including the one I used in that ti plate.
These are well cared for / sharpened taps that are over twenty years old (maybe they don't make'em as good these days).

I'm just saying :
Home shop
Pre tapped thread clean up
Ti or not ti
DON'T PANIC

 

[Wowbagger]

I know and work with a very good knifemaker who also taps all the way through in one shot. It does break fewer taps…especially if you have experience with tap speeds for different titanium grades.

Also, do a search on J. Doyle knives. John is one of the knifemakers who does contribute to the makers section and his work is what a lot of folks would love to be able to do.

Maybe it’s time to check that sub again, but if your looking to have your ego stroked…it may not be the place for you.

Thank you for the education.

 

[Wowbagger]

Since saying titanium is about like saying steel how easy it will be depends on what titanium

Upon reflection I believe this is the most significant thing said in this thread.

 

[Diemaker]

Think of the cutting edge on the tap and how well supported it is driving forward into the material, then when you back it out how that edge doesn't have much support/ material behind the cutting edge at all when it pushes against the formed chip that is still stuck to the material. In real use they don't chip very often but it still is something to think about when using cut taps, especially by hand. Happily form taps don't have this issue as there are no chips being formed so nothing is in the way when they reverse.