The art of the palm swell (design question)

[N.W. Gean]

Hi all, I've been trying to design a new hunting pattern, as I realized my previous design was too large. I'm almost happy with the size and shape of this one, but the one thing I can't decide on is the palm swell. I see on a lot of knives that it would be closer to the ricasso, but mine is closer to the pommel. So far, the grip seems right on the template I made from mild steel, but it might be more biased in favor of gripping towards the pommel. I'm not sure where to go with it.

Ignore the pin holes, I was just messing around with those.

What do you think?

 

[Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith]

Many people make the swell too large and the handle too fat. Your swell looks about the right size, but the swell is about 1/4" too far back and the bottom profile is about 1/8" too fat. Tastes vary about how fat a handle should be, so YMMV. You could adjust the width and move the swell at teh same time on that blank.

A good way to figure handles out is take a piece of 1/4" wood and make a knife profile with the handle bottom cut in at least 1/4" too narrow. Make a basic handle on the wooden model with modeling clay/plasticine. Grip it as if you were holding it normally and give it a squeeze. See where the palm swell forms and how shallow it is.

 

[N.W. Gean]

Many people make the swell too large and the handle too fat. Your swell looks about the right size, but the swell is about 1/4" too far back and the bottom profile is about 1/8" too fat. Tastes vary about how fat a handle should be, so YMMV. You could adjust the width and move the swell at teh same time on that blank.

Thanks, Stacy! I think it looks a lot "faster" now. I didn't like how the pommel looked with the swell moved up, so I went for more of a beak style there. I'll have to try out some clay and wood to see if it feels right.

 

[tim37a]

I think the bottom profile is excellent except move the palm swell forward 1/4". Put the thong hole at the top of the back of the handle.

 

[Crag the Brewer]

I've got just comments, and questions as I'm still learning design.
I tend to make what (I think) works good, so knowing why Other people do things, and their reasons are important. I think, for everyone.....


1. What/where/why is your "palm swell"

If it's under the grip area, is that Really affecting the palm area?
I like my swell on the top of the spine, less pronounced underneath.

I'm not sure why most people do it like how you have it? Under the fingers

2. Why such a large sweeping radius for under your front finger?
Doesn't that push your hand up onto the blade edge?

I usually do .25-.375" radius


thanks for your comments/reasons

 

[N.W. Gean]

I've got just comments, and questions as I'm still learning design.
I tend to make what (I think) works good, so knowing why Other people do things, and their reasons are important. I think, for everyone.....


1. What/where/why is your "palm swell"

If it's under the grip area, is that Really affecting the palm area?
I like my swell on the top of the spine, less pronounced underneath.

I'm not sure why most people do it like how you have it? Under the fingers

2. Why such a large sweeping radius for under your front finger?
Doesn't that push your hand up onto the blade edge?

I usually do .25-.375" radius


thanks for your comments/reasons

1. Correct, it's the bump on the underside. Honestly, it's there because most hunting/bushcraft knives have it

2. That is a product of me designing the curves around the grinding wheels I have available (2" on the platen). But, both are larger radii than 2", so I can and did tighten it up for the revised design.

To me it actually allows a variety of different grip styles. The beak at the ricasso stops your fingers from hitting the cutting edge.

 

[Lorien]

for a hunting knife, I'd try and get the hand as far forward on the handle as possible. In the case with your design, with that in mind, I'd do two things;
-tighten the radius between the ricasso and handle
-move the swell forward

 

[Crag the Brewer]

1. Correct, it's the bump on the underside. Honestly, it's there because most hunting/bushcraft knives have it

2. That is a product of me designing the curves around the grinding wheels I have available (2" on the platen). But, both are larger radii than 2", so I can and did tighten it up for the revised design.

To me it actually allows a variety of different grip styles. The beak at the ricasso stops your fingers from hitting the cutting edge.

The way I do my smaller radius is to walk/track the belt off the platen.
Then I press my blank into it flexing the belt into a nice, kinda tighter radius. This is about 5/16" R


I don't use small diameter spindles.
I'm a former tool room machinest I Could make themr if I wanted, but This way works So Good .

I think I first saw it from Nick Wheeler?

Posting for New people who might not know about this technique

*Edit
If you zoom in, on the left side of the picture you can see my platen exposed. I have the belt maybe 3/8" over to the right, walked off.
-if I left the belt centered on the platen, I wouldn't get the nice radius.

 

[Lorien]

The way I do my smaller radius is to walk/track the belt off the platen.
Then I press my blank into it flexing the belt into a nice, kinda tighter radius. This is about 5/16" R


I don't use small diameter spindles.
I'm a former tool room machinest I Could make themr if I wanted, but This way works So Good .

I think I first saw it from Nick Wheeler?

Posting for New people who might not know about this technique

that's how I do it, I do all my profiling with the knife horizontal and use the edge of the belt a lot. Profiling is one of the few things I do that I rely on a work rest for

 

[tim37a]

I think the palm swell is on each side of the handle. That way, when you are holding the knife in a neutral grip (edge down, spine up), the palm swell of the handle is in the palm of the hand. At least that is the way I make them and the handle is very comfortable. It is not the bump on the bottom of the handle, as was stated in an earlier comment. I could be wrong but I don't think so.

 

[Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith]

You are correct. A palm swell is when the handle is fatter in the middle tan at the guard/ricasso or butt. It may be a subtle amount of swell, but it places more of the handle in contact with the hand in a standard grip. That is why I always put a small amount of downward curve to the handle, thus creating a slightly wider center.

I used to call the places on the bottom finger grooves or a finger bump, but everyone seems to call it a palm swell now. In truth, the top curve and bottom bump do make a palm swell.