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- Jun 3, 2010
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- 1,516
I only saw the movie once and don't have a photographic memory, not by a long short. That said I noticed the main character started a fire using a carbon steel implement, in that case a fork, dry grass and blackpowder. So that got me thinking.
1. Would that method actually work?
2. Is it historically plausible?
How to test it. I took just a carbon steel knife and black power into the woods with the intent of starting a fire. I assume a mountain man would find his own rocks and once the fire got started then add kindling and progressively larger wood. However I wanted to keep within the confines of the movie or at least how I remember it. So that meant no other tinder beyond dry grass and black powder to start the initial flames. All materials except for the carbon steel implament, in this case a knife and black powder would need to be foraged during the outing. I would use the simplest means to start the fire possible. No saw, axe or any other tool. No complex prep and the actual prep time would have to reflect the least amount of effort for the fastest results.
The Revenant firecraft challenge: Go into the woods with just a carbon steel implement and blackpowder, use only grass/powder as tinder to start the initial flames. Use fire prep to reflect a reduced physical capability and dire need. All items beyond the carbon steel and powder must be foraged during the outing.
It's a GO!
The methodology employed in the movie is traditional flint and steel which differs from the more modern ferro rod. I would need a rock in order to toss sparks from the carbon steel knife. Some rocks work and other don't. In general if the rock is hard and can take an edge it could produce sparks from carbon steel. Flint, chert and quartz comes to mind. For me often quartz is the easiest to find as it really stands out. I prefer to look in areas of drainage as often the dirt and leaves are washed away exposing the rocks.
Sure enough we are in luck.
Nice day. It was clear but never did seem to go above freezing.
Ordinary these beech leaves would attract my interest however the rules of The Revenant firecraft are that dry grass is to be used. Dry grass isn't my prefered tinder.
And yes no birch bark. Really! Darn.
There is it! The dry grass of Hollywood fame! Not all dry grass is exactly dry. I avoid the parts of the grass in contact with the ground or other plants such as the lower stems and roots. Naturally given the numerous strands it's hard to be perfect at it.
I am going to use these taller weeds for kindling if the grass takes flames.
Also will use other progressly larger fuels. Probably common knowledge at the time for those making a living in the woods. That said most people used flint and steel to start their fires back in the day. Maybe those in cities used brimstone matches but that process too employed flint and steel. All of the above is IMHO as no expert on the history. Wonderful day but still being February meant there was a chill in the air.
I would need to process that quartz using stone age technology and sloppily at that.
Some nice flakes with sharp edges. Quartz doesn't seem to hold an edge as long compared to flint or chert but for a short time it will toss some nice sparks from carbon steel.
Time to get the show on the road. Is there some fact behind Hollywood or just pure fiction? The carbon steel, black powder, rocks and grass are ready!
The simple fire fuel prep was done. No platform with raised back. No split wood or feathers. Could I have done this fire prep if attacked by bears, indians and hypothermia? I would probably just go belly up but it sure didn't take much time to prepare the fuel. Naturally I would need more to burn this fire all night but right now just going for sustaining flames as proof of concept. On a side note I am not disparaging split wood, shavings, feather sticks or any other methodology. As I don't recall the movie being clear about the prep going to use the simplest method as a base line.
Yes it works. In fact was more spectacular than I remember in the movie.
Conclusion:
Based on actually doing it my conclusion is yes. The method works. It is necessary to put the powder on a leaf or other surface as it drifts through the grass pile but it easily took a spark from a knife struck by a rock. Grass isn't my favorite tinder but after the initial flash of the powder it was easily blown into flames. Those flames then ignited progressively larger kindling. Though blackpowder was probably a valuable commodity when out in the mountains given the long history of it's use and even longer history of flint and steel it is IMHO entirely possible that sometime during those centuries someone could have been compelled to do this. It just seems plausible.
I am no expert on history but it does seem to me The Revenant firecraft is fact (in terms of actually working). Does this mean Hugh Glass used the same method shown in dire circumstance? I don't know. Here is a video showing the entire process including ignition. For those who don't have all day the actual fire starts around 10 minutes into the video.
[video=youtube;9JOuCW8bK3U]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JOuCW8bK3U[/video]
Thanks for looking.
addition:
Someone mentioned online in another forum that the knIfe I used in The Revenant firecraft challenge was special and he would have probably used "an ordinary carbon steel knife instead of a steel striker knife (for accuracy)" Ok that's an interesting point worth investigation. In the past I used Mora knives and other improvised strikers to ignite chaga, charcloth and natural charred materials so know they can ignite most flint and steel tinder despite not being dedicated strikers. Always keep in mind that I am a goofy goober so odds are anyone reading this could do the same or even better.
Mora knife, Pyrodex and rock.
Internet Mora, rock and powder challenge to verify internet curiously GO!
Yea it worked and did so in about the same time as initial field test. 5 seconds for the first video and 5 seconds on the second successful attempt in this video. Who would have imagined? Above is a scorched leaf from the second flash over. The video shows both. I have come to the crazy and unprecedented conclusion that gunpowder is indeed flammable and as such is easily ignited hence proof of concept of The Revenant firecraft....once again..... LOL!
[video=youtube;Z1WUpKmNOL0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1WUpKmNOL0[/video]
1. Would that method actually work?
2. Is it historically plausible?
How to test it. I took just a carbon steel knife and black power into the woods with the intent of starting a fire. I assume a mountain man would find his own rocks and once the fire got started then add kindling and progressively larger wood. However I wanted to keep within the confines of the movie or at least how I remember it. So that meant no other tinder beyond dry grass and black powder to start the initial flames. All materials except for the carbon steel implament, in this case a knife and black powder would need to be foraged during the outing. I would use the simplest means to start the fire possible. No saw, axe or any other tool. No complex prep and the actual prep time would have to reflect the least amount of effort for the fastest results.
The Revenant firecraft challenge: Go into the woods with just a carbon steel implement and blackpowder, use only grass/powder as tinder to start the initial flames. Use fire prep to reflect a reduced physical capability and dire need. All items beyond the carbon steel and powder must be foraged during the outing.
It's a GO!
The methodology employed in the movie is traditional flint and steel which differs from the more modern ferro rod. I would need a rock in order to toss sparks from the carbon steel knife. Some rocks work and other don't. In general if the rock is hard and can take an edge it could produce sparks from carbon steel. Flint, chert and quartz comes to mind. For me often quartz is the easiest to find as it really stands out. I prefer to look in areas of drainage as often the dirt and leaves are washed away exposing the rocks.
Sure enough we are in luck.
Nice day. It was clear but never did seem to go above freezing.
Ordinary these beech leaves would attract my interest however the rules of The Revenant firecraft are that dry grass is to be used. Dry grass isn't my prefered tinder.
And yes no birch bark. Really! Darn.
There is it! The dry grass of Hollywood fame! Not all dry grass is exactly dry. I avoid the parts of the grass in contact with the ground or other plants such as the lower stems and roots. Naturally given the numerous strands it's hard to be perfect at it.
I am going to use these taller weeds for kindling if the grass takes flames.
Also will use other progressly larger fuels. Probably common knowledge at the time for those making a living in the woods. That said most people used flint and steel to start their fires back in the day. Maybe those in cities used brimstone matches but that process too employed flint and steel. All of the above is IMHO as no expert on the history. Wonderful day but still being February meant there was a chill in the air.
I would need to process that quartz using stone age technology and sloppily at that.
Some nice flakes with sharp edges. Quartz doesn't seem to hold an edge as long compared to flint or chert but for a short time it will toss some nice sparks from carbon steel.
Time to get the show on the road. Is there some fact behind Hollywood or just pure fiction? The carbon steel, black powder, rocks and grass are ready!
The simple fire fuel prep was done. No platform with raised back. No split wood or feathers. Could I have done this fire prep if attacked by bears, indians and hypothermia? I would probably just go belly up but it sure didn't take much time to prepare the fuel. Naturally I would need more to burn this fire all night but right now just going for sustaining flames as proof of concept. On a side note I am not disparaging split wood, shavings, feather sticks or any other methodology. As I don't recall the movie being clear about the prep going to use the simplest method as a base line.
Yes it works. In fact was more spectacular than I remember in the movie.
Conclusion:
Based on actually doing it my conclusion is yes. The method works. It is necessary to put the powder on a leaf or other surface as it drifts through the grass pile but it easily took a spark from a knife struck by a rock. Grass isn't my favorite tinder but after the initial flash of the powder it was easily blown into flames. Those flames then ignited progressively larger kindling. Though blackpowder was probably a valuable commodity when out in the mountains given the long history of it's use and even longer history of flint and steel it is IMHO entirely possible that sometime during those centuries someone could have been compelled to do this. It just seems plausible.
I am no expert on history but it does seem to me The Revenant firecraft is fact (in terms of actually working). Does this mean Hugh Glass used the same method shown in dire circumstance? I don't know. Here is a video showing the entire process including ignition. For those who don't have all day the actual fire starts around 10 minutes into the video.
[video=youtube;9JOuCW8bK3U]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JOuCW8bK3U[/video]
Thanks for looking.
addition:
Someone mentioned online in another forum that the knIfe I used in The Revenant firecraft challenge was special and he would have probably used "an ordinary carbon steel knife instead of a steel striker knife (for accuracy)" Ok that's an interesting point worth investigation. In the past I used Mora knives and other improvised strikers to ignite chaga, charcloth and natural charred materials so know they can ignite most flint and steel tinder despite not being dedicated strikers. Always keep in mind that I am a goofy goober so odds are anyone reading this could do the same or even better.
Mora knife, Pyrodex and rock.
Internet Mora, rock and powder challenge to verify internet curiously GO!
Yea it worked and did so in about the same time as initial field test. 5 seconds for the first video and 5 seconds on the second successful attempt in this video. Who would have imagined? Above is a scorched leaf from the second flash over. The video shows both. I have come to the crazy and unprecedented conclusion that gunpowder is indeed flammable and as such is easily ignited hence proof of concept of The Revenant firecraft....once again..... LOL!
[video=youtube;Z1WUpKmNOL0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1WUpKmNOL0[/video]
