That’s a hoot. Only a knife dealer would say that.
Do you go out of your way to insult the majority of people you come across, or does it just come natural to you?
One day you’ll surprise me and add something worthwhile to a conversation on BF.
That’s a hoot. Only a knife dealer would say that.
It seems to burn you when someone with vastly greater historical knowledge than you shares it. Say, you could always try that thing you do where you spew an erroneous opinion as fact again. It's always fun to shut that noise down.That’s a hoot. Only a knife dealer would say that.
Or just paraphrase other folks quotes to alter the content or intent. I like that a lot!!It seems to burn you when someone with vastly greater historical knowledge than you shares it. Say, you could always try that thing you do where you spew an erroneous opinion as fact again. It's always fun to shut that noise down.
There are a lot of things being stated as if they were historically accurate - that require us to ignore most data points. Sure, if you pay $500 for a knife you could have purchased for $100 shortly prior, you are behind the curve. If you pay $99 for a knife you could have purchased elsewhere (or abstained) for $69; you are a bit behind the curve. But over the past 40 years I don't see quality knives being any worse an investment than land, cattle, gold, etc. if you weren't cautious when you bought. Now, if you want to cut out one moment in time to base your entire argument - ok. But then you also have to talk about oil prices going below zero; the crashing cattle market for our American ranchers; gold doubling inside a five year period; etc. etc. Typically I don't see any release prices on quality American traditional knives decreasing over any significant period of time.
We are all welcome to our opinion, but we are not afforded the same to facts. This is a place for great discussion and reason; but please don't be offended if others don't take what they recognize to be purely opinion posted time and time again as a truth. Especially when the truth is already known by most. Just because we don't understand the reasoning for decisions/policies of others, does not mean there is not valid reasoning - it only means we don't understand it.
We've been seeing this more and more. Several authorized GEC dealers have recently been raising their prices above the minimum set by Great Eastern Cutlery.
For example, the recent thread brought attention to Triplexxxcutlery posting knives on ebay for double the minimum price set by GEC. Now non-ebay dealers are getting into the mix.
GPKnives is currently selling the GEC #19 Little Rattler in Micarta for $99.95 and Gunstock Jack is selling it for $89. DLT and KnivesShipFree choose to sell these knives at the minimum price of $69.90. That's a markup of $30 for GPK and $20 for Gunstock Jack above the standard markup. It was the same thing with the GEC #74. Both Gunstock Jack and GPK were selling the #74 for $20 - $40 more than I paid at KSF.
Thoughts?
Personally, I'm a bit torn. On one hand, when the dealer sets a higher price it leaves less profit for scalpers which makes them less likely to buy them to resell... And if someone is going to make a little extra money off of the sell, I would prefer it to be the dealer who put in the work, rather than a reseller who snapped a couple pictures and posted the knife on a forum/ebay.
On the other hand, paying 40% above GEC's minimum price leaves a bad taste in my mouth... Especially when other dealers like DLT and KSF
For most posters on BF knives are a hobby. For dealers they are a business.
Businesses are "for-profit" enterprises. They all have people who are dependent on them remaining solvent.
I don't know any successful businesses who won't increase the price of an object if there are customers who are willing to pay the higher price. This is particularly true in this time of the covid, especially for outfits who have brick and mortar operations. GP Knives has a brick and mortar operation. Most of the other outfits you mentioned are web based only and have a correspondingly lower overhead. If an outfit prices themselves out of the market, they will likely lower the price.
As for us, much like marital bliss, the key to happiness is to figure out what you want and how much you are willing to give to get that before you start. Which is to say, if the knives are too expensive, don't buy them.
Right, the person with serious skin in the game. I think you were trying to disagree with what he said but ultimately your snarky rude response is right in line with why he knows so much. Now, if we are talking the guy a while back who posted about buying all those hinderers at peak bubble prices and is now looking to unload them but wonders why he can't recoup anywhere close to his investment, those are times when knives as an investment are a poor choice. But we aren't talking about that, are we...That’s a hoot. Only a knife dealer would say that.
Have to disagree with you there. To me, investment is something that is done over time and something that is invested in typically has significant intrinsic value, i.e. Land, bonds, mutual funds et al. (Yes it can be argued that of those three only land has any actual intrinsic value) So called short term investing is really just speculation i.e making a bet that the market will move a certain way leading to short term profits. Although knives do have some small amount of intrinsic value as a tool they have historically have proven with a few exceptions to be speculative propositions rather than true investments. Hinderer that I mentioned is a great example. People went nuts due to the perceived scarcity. Eventually supply went up, scarcity vanished and with it much of the value. I expect the same will happen here.
Seems like you are cherry picking and sharing your opinion as fact to further your own agenda. Not quality mind support there bud
Knives as an investment is a bad idea. The collector market is just too volatile. Just look at all those Camillus-made Remingtons selling for less than original price.
However, when a collectible becomes hot, those who sell collectibles get rich. The smart sellers take that money and invest it elsewhere, just like professional gamblers.
Actually buying any collectible as an investment is a bad idea. If you don't know why, you shouldn't be investing, give it to someone else to invest for you.
I really don't think you had to disagree - I think we are saying near the same thing. My point was that there is a good time to buy and a bad time to buy - and both are only realized in hindsight and over some amount of time the difference erased
In general I agree. That said, the discussion we are having and the quote you are ranting about is not relevant to the point you are making. Just like any investment, buying without cation can make the investment poor. That was the point being made in the quote you conveniently ignored. Stop cherry picking to make a point no one but you is discussing.Knives as an investment is a bad idea. The collector market is just too volatile. Just look at all those Camillus-made Remingtons selling for less than original price.
However, when a collectible becomes hot, those who sell collectibles get rich. The smart sellers take that money and invest it elsewhere, just like professional gamblers.
Actually buying any collectible as an investment is a bad idea. If you don't know why, you shouldn't be investing, give it to someone else to invest for you.
The dealer prices we see result mostly from marketing decisions, not supply and demand.
Curious, when you say you see 20+ ip addresses refreshing your Early Reserve page.. do you mean like bot(s)?I think the sampling size has skewed the opinion. The dealers deciding to increase prices or go direct to eBay, etc. is in direct correlation to the recent market pricing of GEC knives. And those market prices are directly in correlation to the fact that there are way more people wanting them, than knives produced. Now the fact that that has carried over to a pattern that is not in extreme demand, and produced in significantly higher numbers than recent production runs, is simply just that - a spill-over. You will see the genuine supply/demand market at work again with the #47 Viper, which is a known commodity.
But trying to match a variant pricing schema on one dealers site for a product that has already been purchased by a majority of those desiring it in earnest, is a bit problematic in drawing significant "marketing" conclusions. For example, I see 20+ ip addresses refreshing my Early Reserve page ever since GEC announced the run. I could increase the estimated price to $200 and would still allocate them all in under one minute. My "marketing" decision is to sell GEC knives as I always have - but it would make very little difference to the immediate allocation. Because for my 10(made up) Ironwood #47's there are 200 people wanting to reserve one. Maybe I lose 100 people that are aggravated at the price; but that still leaves me 1000% oversubscribed.
The best way to get rid of the bots is to require people to do those reCAPTCHA picture puzzles at checkout. That would prevent the bots from being able to make purchases.
Curious, when you say you see 20+ ip addresses refreshing your Early Reserve page.. do you mean like bot(s)?
The best way to get rid of the bots is to require people to do those reCAPTCHA picture puzzles at checkout. That would prevent the bots from being able to make purchases.
If you raised your advertised prices “too high”, I imagine GEC might have a word in your ear. Your price reflects your judgement of the trade-off between short-term gain and long-term sustainability. Some dealers want the last dollar* before the flipper gets his. In your case, your willing to bet on your customers. That’s all I meant by “marketing”.I could increase the estimated price to $200 and would still allocate them all in under one minute.