Turning Green Wood into dry handles...

EngrSorenson

EngrSorenson

Noticed by Senpai
Platinum Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2019
Messages
14,655
I bought the parts to make my first Puukko. ... I guess "make my first puukko handle" is more accurate.

About a weekago I came across some downed and cut river birch on a hike, so I brought it home.
It was still very green, and had some subtle spalting and some bug holes in it, but I shaved off the bark, and cut and split it.
I put it in the oven for 170 degrees for 10 hours, and 220 degrees for 2 hours to dry it- slight checking developed, but it was for the most part okay.
Looked pretty dry, but as I was hewing it into 3 (6"x1.5"x.75") quarter sawn blanks last night, I noticed the inside was still moist, which surprised me for how long I cooked it.

I made three blanks and tossed them back in the oven for another hour @ 220 and some checking developed (which may or may not doom the blanks).
now I'm losing faith in how dry the pieces actually are. I don't yet have a meter, and if I'd been smart, I would have weighed the pieces when I first cooked them.

I figured River Birch handles would be really neat: it comes from local woods I grew up in, and it's a tree variety that grows well in the swamp lands all around me.
It also happens to be a variety of birch, birch being a traditional Puukko handle material.

As it stands now, I'm considering abandoning the birch all together and going for a piece of claro walnut I bought in a store.

Anyone have any luck with speeding up the wood drying process? Recommendations?
I'm mostly just grouchy I spent so much time making blanks with lack luster results.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
As with drinking a good scotch, making love, or putting a good finish on a knife handle - taking your time and not rushing things always gives the best result.
Click to expand...
yeah, agreed- and I was hoping you'd respond, perhaps I'll scratch the itch to make one using readily available materials.
I just have two things I want that are at odds with one another, so I guess I just gotta sort myself out.
 
You can build a drying cabinet powered by a 75watt light bulb and dry it faster, but any faster than that is almost sure to have problems. I tried a commercial dehydrator used to dry cannabis and it was too fast for green wood. It works great for lowering the moisture content a few % before sending out for stabilizing.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
You can build a drying cabinet powered by a 75watt light bulb and dry it faster, but any faster than that is almost sure to have problems. I tried a commercial dehydrator used to dry cannabis and it was too fast for green wood. It works great for lowering the moisture content a few % before sending out for stabilizing.
Click to expand...
sounds like you have a stack of drying wood somewhere, then.
 
My green wood dries in a shed for a year or more depending on size. Then it goes in a little solar kiln I built, with a thermostatically controlled box fan to provide ventilation when the temp rises above 100F. Before I send wood out for stabilization I cut into 2x2x12" blocks and bake at 180F till weight loss stops. Vacuum seal and mail to the stabilizer.
 
Not that it matters the on how to dry, but it sounds like his wood isn'ty "green" but "wet" - he did say it was spalting?
 
Ken H> said:
Not that it matters the on how to dry, but it sounds like his wood isn'ty "green" but "wet" - he did say it was spalting?
Click to expand...
Correct- where it was lying on the ground. I suspect the wood is both green and continuously subjected to damp conditions.
 
On there topic of harvesting wood, sealing the ends is very important, there are lots of products that work, from wood glue to wax to latex paint.

The important thing to do is seal the ends so it doesn't check or crack.

You want to do this as soon as humanly possible after you chop it down. Wood loses water insanely fast after it's been cut.

Once you get it sealed, then think about splitting it and removing the bark. The smaller the piece
,the faster it will dry and the faster it dries the more it'll warp.

The last thing I have to say on the topic is that it matters how you stack the wood to dry it.
One good way it's to make a lattice out of it. Think tic-tac-toe as seen from above. On the very bottom layer where it'll be in contact with the ground put down something non-absorbent like two pieces of PVC pipe, then start your stack.

Each piece should have an inch or so between them so the air will have space to move, stack the next layer perpendicular.

The best way to track moisture level is by weight, measure it when you start drying, then once a week or so till it stops loosing weight, then once every two weeks, then once a month. After a couple months of not losing weight, your probably at atmospheric equilibrium and it won't lose any more weight without forcing it out with heat and air movement.

A good rule of thumb on how to estimate drying time is about an inch per year. So your two inch thick slab will take about a year to dry (an inch from each side).

Ok that's about all I've got on wood drying!

Go forth and dry your wood!
 
A.McPherson said:
A good rule of thumb on how to estimate drying time is about an inch per year. So your two inch thick slab will take about a year to dry (an inch from each side).
Click to expand...
That inch/yr is what I always heard, but never thought about the "inch from each side". Good thinking there.
 
I was talking with a woodworker in my area and he said he has boiled wood in a 20 gallon pot to expedite the drying process. He seemed convinced and I guess logically it would/could work.
 
Wood turners have a very different idea of how dry they want wood. They actually like it wet. They soak the blocks in PEG so they never really dry out.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
Wood turners have a very different idea of how dry they want wood. They actually like it wet. They soak the blocks in PEG so they never really dry out.
Click to expand...
As a wood turner I will turn things using green wood, but there’s always stability concerns. I prefer dry wood, as it makes for tight joints in boxes and baby rattles. This is the first I’ve heard of soaking wood to keep things from ever drying.
 
Ken H> said:
That inch/yr is what I always heard, but never thought about the "inch from each side". Good thinking there.
Click to expand...
I had heard the inch per year, as well, but I understand it to be 1 inch in nominal thickness of the thinnest dimension, such that 1 inch stock thickness will dry in 1 year.
 
I exaggerated in saying "never dry".

I was referring to PEG solution and a similar product sold as pentacryl. When fresh cut green wood was placed in the solution it penetrates very fast and lowers surface tension in the cell walls and allows the water to come out and be replaced by the PEG. It is called stabilization by woodturners, but their term is different than what we mean when we talk about stabilizing wood with resins. They are talking about splitting and warping of green wood.
I think every long time woodturner has done a lovely bowl or vase and in a few weeks it is an oval and bent bowl or the vase has a big split down the side.

I used to keep the PEG solution in a 5-gallon pail and soak rough turned green wood blanks for bowl and vase turning. After a week to a month you took the block out and washed it off, let it drain/dry for a day or so, and turned away. The wood almost never would split or warp. It also cut very nice curls with sharp tools. Carvers did the same soak for hand carving green wood. I never tried that since I carved fully dried wood.

The way I understand it is that the PEG replaces the water in the wood cells. With no water in the wood is in one sense of the term DRY. The PEG stays in the wood for a long time and slowly dries (I guess), so the wood becomes stable and didn't split/warp in drying. The wood may eventually dry completely (again, I'm guessing), but while turning it was like working green wood. We did this with fresh cut holly, dogwood, oak, cedar, locust, and birch (plus many others).

I always used "inch per year" rule to mean the entire thickness of a plank, log, or block. 4" thick plank dried 4 years or more. I never used a moisture meter until I started dealing with knife handle wood.
I painted the end grain and any branch cuts with white latex housepaint and set it up in the loft for that long. (TIP: When the paint is dry, use a marker to write the wood type and the harvest date on it! You will rarely remember ten years later.) After the drying time was up, I cut off the pained ends, cut up the wood, and set aside for another year of rest. Then I cut to the size desired and set aside for three to six months. I still have wood I harvested 40 years ago in the log state, and blocks and boards of exotic woods that have rested for decades. My firm belief is that nothing good comes from rushing the drying of high-grade woods.

Funny thing is that I don't have my old big lathe anymore. I left it at my old shop for my son-in-law, but he never used it. I think he chucked it or gave it away. I did have access to a great woodshop, but my friend Phill died last year. I have another friend with a full shop who says I am welcome to turn anything I want in his shop. Haven't needed to since my Carbatec does most size turnings just fine with a swing of 10" or so".
 
EngrSorenson said:
I had heard the inch per year, as well, but I understand it to be 1 inch in nominal thickness of the thinnest dimension, such that 1 inch stock thickness will dry in 1 year.
Click to expand...
That's in line with what my understanding was - 1" board in 1 yr, 2" board in 2 yr, etc. Allow me to say I do NOT have experience or personal knowledge.
 
Last edited:
Fair enough... I can't say that I really follow that "rule" I just weigh it, then use a moisture meter to make sure it's dry enough to send of for stabilization. (Or making into bow staves). I also live in the desert so drying here happens pretty fast no matter what you do.

I mean it was "super humid" (52%) and "cold" (65°f) here today. It's usually in the low teens humidity wise and closer to 90f...
 
Last edited:
V85wH64.jpg
 
Vacuum will speed up the drying process as it lowers the boiling point of water.

A brewers type heating pad will also help with the vacuum drying.

Scales in Australia are a limited supply, there is a part time stabaliser in WA who sells to selected outlets, makes DIY options more attractive than it should be.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top