Victorinox 'Delémont' series quality vs 'original' Victorinox quality

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Fass

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I was browsing the Victorinox website this evening and the 'Delémont' series caught my eye. As most of you will know, these are rebranded Wenger models now made by Victornox (in Delémont??).
I lot of the knives have the same toolsets as compareable 'original' Victorinox models. Is anyone familiar with this line? Is the quality the same? I did notice that most sell for a little higher price than 'original' Victorinox models.
 
I have only a Rangergrip Hunter, it looks great, most large Victorinox SAKs with cellidor scales look plain in comparison.
I know scissors are considered by many to be a more robust design and improved ergonomics also rings a bell.
I think the magnifying glass is also nicer.
 
Fass said:
I was browsing the Victorinox website this evening and the 'Delémont' series caught my eye. As most of you will know, these are rebranded Wenger models now made by Victornox (in Delémont??).
I lot of the knives have the same toolsets as compareable 'original' Victorinox models. Is anyone familiar with this line? Is the quality the same? I did notice that most sell for a little higher price than 'original' Victorinox models.
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I think many SAK enthusiasts probably would have used or collected Wenger/Delemont tools one way or another.

In terms of quality, I think it is one of the few brands that has comparable QC to Victorinox, which is great. Individual tool designs are often different, and some of the tools placement could be less than optimal, but overall, it surely offers something different from Victorinox and worth looking into.
 
In my opinion the quality of Delemonte line is equal to, or better than, the other Victorinox knives. When Victorinox took over, they dropped the Wegner style can opener and replaced it with the Victorinox one. An improvement in my opinion. The Delemonte line has some knives with a locking main blade. I'm not sure how useful that is considering the location of the release. It seems like it would be easy, to accidentally unlock the blade, when using the knife. In my opinion the the Victorinox can opener is superior to the old Wegner can opener. The Wegner scissors are superior to the Victorinox style. The Delemonte knives get the best on both.


O.B
 
Old Biker said:
In my opinion the quality of Delemonte line is equal to, or better than, the other Victorinox knives. When Victorinox took over, they dropped the Wegner style can opener and replaced it with the Victorinox one. An improvement in my opinion. The Delemonte line has some knives with a locking main blade. I'm not sure how useful that is considering the location of the release. It seems like it would be easy, to accidentally unlock the blade, when using the knife. In my opinion the the Victorinox can opener is superior to the old Wegner can opener. The Wegner scissors are superior to the Victorinox style. The Delemonte knives get the best on both.


O.B
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I actually hold a different opinion on Wenger products. If Victorinox get a 100% score, I'd probably give Wenger a 90-95%.

The lockable blade on Wenger/Delemont models always have a very noticeable up and down play that bugs me(I'm sure it doesn't affect how it functions as a lock) and it is almost never seen on any recent Victorinox offerings.

The Victorinox scissors are far more precise and easier to use than Wenger/Delemont scissors, which basically is a small shear(maybe it is meant for really heavy duty cutting).

Old Wenger can opener works beautifully for can opening, but the drawback is it lacks the small flathead from a Victorinox can opener(which in reality, works great as an impromptu phillips driver).
 
Fass said:
I was browsing the Victorinox website this evening and the 'Delémont' series caught my eye. As most of you will know, these are rebranded Wenger models now made by Victornox (in Delémont??).
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Victorinox is based in Ibach, Canton Schwyz, which is 90% German-speaking. Wenger was based in Delémont, Canton Jura, which is 85% French-speaking. German-speakers run Switzerland but legally everyone is equal, and Switzerland's army knife contract was always split between Victorinox and Wenger. That's Swiss canton politics. Both companies were hammered by the 2001 air travel nightmare we are living with today, and in 2005 the Swiss government allowed Victorinox to buy Wenger, the weaker company. Victorinox's corporate objective has been to not lay off any workers in Delémont.

Wenger's knife catalog was pruned and the re-branded survivors had some basic tools replaced by Victorinox equivalents: tweezers, toothpick, awl, can opener, combo tool, 85mm wood saw.

The merged company was hammered again by the 2007-2008 financial crisis, and in 2013 Victorinox dropped all Wenger models which duplicated its own product line: for example, Wenger's old Swiss Army contract knife. The Wenger survivors are the Delémont Collection.

Wenger made lots of weird specialized knives and tools which are now extinct. I think my favorite specialized tool was their Toilet Paper Dispenser key. It came in handy during the toilet paper shortage.
 
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I have collected SAKs for years; Vics and Wengers - personally I don't like the Delemont line. The scale design is very uncomfortable and limits how the knife can be held or used. Just my opinion. I only have one to base by judgement on and now never carry it. Give me nice flat Cellidor or Alox any day.

A toilet paper dispenser key??? !!! Surely you jest.
 
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Piso Mojado said:
Victorinox is based in Ibach, Canton Schwzy, which is 90% German-speaking. Wenger was based in Delémont, Canton Jura, which is 85% French-speaking. German-speakers run Switzerland but legally everyone is equal, and Switzerland's army knife contract was always split between Victorinox and Wenger. That's Swiss canton politics. Both companies were hammered by the 2001 air travel nightmare we are living with today, and in 2005 the Swiss government allowed Victorinox to buy Wenger, the weaker company. Victorinox's corporate objective has been to not lay off any workers in Delémont.

Wenger's knife catalog was pruned and the re-branded survivors had some basic tools replaced by Victorinox equivalents: tweezers, toothpick, awl, can opener, combo tool.

The merged company was hammered again by the 2007-2008 financial crisis, and in 2013 Victorinox dropped all Wenger models which duplicated its own product line: for example, Wenger's old Swiss Army contract knife. The Wenger survivors are the Delémont Collection.

Wenger made lots of weird specialized knives and tools which are now extinct. I think my favorite specialized tool was their Toilet Paper Dispenser key. It came in handy during the toilet paper shortage.
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Fass-Thanks for that information. It seems thorough and definitive. Can you suggest a source for viewing the old Wenger lineup?
 
Rich S said:
A toilet paper dispenser key??? !!! Surely you jest.
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The SAKwiki tool list page lists this under Specialist Tools Unique to Wenger, with a link that goes to Swiss Army Knights for a history and photos of Wenger's "Toilet Paper SAK" and its unique tool:

https://www.swissarmyknights.com/articles/2007/344-collection-highlight-august-07

Wenger made 400–500 of these SAKs for Hygolet, a Swiss business in German-speaking Wetzikon, Canton Zürich, founded in 1978 to manufacture a patented sanitary toilet seat for public washrooms. The 85mm Hygolet SAK had Cellidor scales in sanitary white and a knife blade, nail file/cleaner, screwdriver/cap lifter, corkscrew, and an industry-standard key to open locked dispensers for those giant 1,000 foot toilet paper rolls you see in public washrooms.
 
Thanks for the link. I guess Wenger and Vic will make just about anything if the price is right. :)
 
To preface my comment, it is entirely based on my opinion and personal perception and is in NO way based on any objective quality I can explain. That said, I have always loved Victorinox knives more than Wengers. Wengers always felt juuuuust a little more cheaply made to me, so I've never been interested in collecting them. Plus, once I discovered ALOX, my SAK collecting was never the same. I think I've got one or two Wengers, whereas I've got something like almost 20 Victorinox knives (and am browsing around at more lately).
 
Rich S said:
Thanks for the link. I guess Wenger and Vic will make just about anything if the price is right. :)
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I suspect that Wenger's plethora of highly specialized knives was part of its failure as a knife manufacturer. They had no less than three knives for emergency bicycle repair, but my favorite was their watchmaker's knife, the Minathor. According to SAKwiki, Minathor is a contraction of mini altelier du horloger or "small watch factory." I think it is a portmanteau of MIcro and Nano Technologies (there is a MINaT trade show in Stuttgart). Someone must have told Wenger that ME NAT WHORE didn't sound good in English, because they called it Micro Tool Chest in the English-speaking world.

https://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Minathor

I own the "Daily" version with Cellidor scales. There was a deluxe $300 "Club" version with fancy leather scales and cases by Schweizer & Schoepf in red (Lizard), blue (Caribou), green (Shark), and tan (Crocodile).

show_image.php


show_image.php


Business is war and this is not the road that leads to victory.
 
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In case you find a used Wenger Micro Tool Chest 16109 (the "Daily" version with Cellidor scales), most of its micro-tools were Bergeon parts from their very expensive Watchmaker's Service Tool Kits, and those parts can be ordered from internet dealers in watchmaker and jeweler supplies if you know the Bergeon part numbers. Unlike the Service Tool Kits, Bergeon's individual tools and screwdriver bits are reasonably priced considering what you're getting. The SAKwiki page on Wenger's Minathor has a teardown diagram, a multi-lingual Bergeon part list for the standard tools and parts, and descriptions of the four extra screwdriver bits in the Wenger Complement Set.

The Minathor/Micro Tool Chest was used by service technicians repairing micro-electronic devices and mnblade said it looked like it would be handy for harmonica customizers.
 
Piso Mojado said:
I suspect that Wenger's plethora of highly specialized knives was part of its failure as a knife manufacturer. They had no less than three knives for emergency bicycle repair, but my favorite was their watchmaker's knife, the Minathor. According to SAKwiki, Minathor is a contraction of mini altelier du horloger or "small watch factory." I think it is a portmanteau of MIcro and Nano Technologies (there is a MINaT trade show in Stuttgart). Someone must have told Wenger that ME NAT WHORE didn't sound good in English, because they called it Micro Tool Chest in the English-speaking world.

https://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Minathor

I own the "Daily" version with Cellidor scales. There was a deluxe $300 "Club" version with fancy leather scales and cases by Schweizer & Schoepf in red (Lizard), blue (Caribou), green (Shark), and tan (Crocodile).

show_image.php


show_image.php


Business is war and this is not the road that leads to victory.
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Hohooooo, those aren't $300 anymore. Ooof!! The 'Bay has a few.
 
I like Wenger and Victorinox about equally.
So far I only have a couple of the Vic Delémont knives and they seem just fine.
51A5E2B5-C15D-4403-8E8F-1927FE196B94.jpeg
Here is an old Wenger Ranger and a new Vic Ranger Grip.
The Wenger has pull slider on other side and the Vic has the cross button which is so awesome.

I only have one single blade Wenger Ranger with the cross button and you hardly ever see them come up for sale anymore.
It is great that Victorinox continues with this model.
 
Piso Mojado said:
In case you find a used Wenger Micro Tool Chest 16109 (the "Daily" version with Cellidor scales), most of its micro-tools were Bergeon parts from their very expensive Watchmaker's Service Tool Kits, and those parts can be ordered from internet dealers in watchmaker and jeweler supplies if you know the Bergeon part numbers. Unlike the Service Tool Kits, Bergeon's individual tools and screwdriver bits are reasonably priced considering what you're getting. The SAKwiki page on Wenger's Minathor has a teardown diagram, a multi-lingual Bergeon part list for the standard tools and parts, and descriptions of the four extra screwdriver bits in the Wenger Complement Set.

The Minathor/Micro Tool Chest was used by service technicians repairing micro-electronic devices and mnblade said it looked like it would be handy for harmonica customizers.
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Could that possibly be “Bargeon” , not “Bergeon”?
 
buckthorn said:
Could that possibly be “Bargeon” , not “Bergeon”?
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A joke? Sorry, I'm half awake . . . just woke up at my desk with computer still on. Time for bed.

Bergeon S.A. is a well-known Swiss manufacturer of watchmaking tools. Amazon has pages of their stuff and Chinese junk counterfeits. For anything more than a spring bar tool, check the internet dealers in jeweler and watchmaker tools (Otto Frei for example to get you started).
 
Piso Mojado said:
A joke? Sorry, I'm half awake . . . just woke up at my desk with computer still on. Time for bed.

Bergeon S.A. is a well-known Swiss manufacturer of watchmaking tools. Amazon has pages of their stuff and Chinese junk counterfeits. For anything more than a spring bar tool, check the internet dealers in jeweler and watchmaker tools (Otto Frei for example to get you started).
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It was a legitimate question and I just double-checked to see that I have a few moderate-to-decent quality Swiss Army-type knives that are definitiely spelled with an "a" as the second letter. (Bargeon). A quick search shows a couple for sale by a knife dealer.I may also have had (or still have) pen knives by Bargeon as well.Other sites list mostly stilleto shapes and automatics but I suspect the Bargeon company may be out of business. I'd seen "Bargeon" for so long that I did a double-take when I saw Bergeon and that's why I asked. Does anyone know of Bargeons that are not stilletos and currently available? Thanks.
 
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