Want to Make Decidedly Traditional Fixed Blades

David Mary

David Mary

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Good afternoon friends. I believe I have made some knives were accidentally traditional, but I am now looking to start making some decidedly traditional fixed blades, and was wondering, in the opinions of our Porch dwellers, can you name features and/or materials that disqualify a knife from being considered traditional?

For example, I am planning some EDC sized knives in 8670, and have sort of gathered the impression that if I finish them with say Micarta handles and brass pins, they would be considered traditional by many folks here. G10, and not so much. Stainless steel, though? What if I used AEB-L? Can it still be traditional? Or 440C? Is one stainless more traditional than the other, or can I make a MagnaCut knife with wood and brass handles that gets to qualify as traditional based on its looks rather than its alloy composition? Also I gather than some folks would consider a Micarta handled carbon steel knife traditional whether it is in a leather or Kydex sheath, but I think some others would disagree and say that the kydex sheath would negate the traditional status of the overall package.

So I know there will not be a fixed/standardized metric for what is and is not traditional, but would like to read thoughts and ideas on the question from as many as are willing to share. I will still make "modern" style knives as well, but just trying to get an idea of what I could call "traditional" without starting a controversy! Thank you!

David
 
In all seriousness though, if I recall correctly there's quite a lot of leeway in what qualifies as a traditional belt knife.
 
Hi David,

Steel choice is pretty irrelevant. There are plenty of knives made in higher end steels that would be considered plenty traditional. Since it has generally been concluded that folks "back in the day" were not perfectly privy to what was in the steel of their knives (outside of marketing buzz words, of course), we give a lot of leeway when it comes to steel choices. Actually, I don't think we fret at all about it. Lots of custom slip joint makers that are held in high regard around here use steels like CPM-154, AEB-L, A2, O1, and the like.

In short, I wouldn't get hung up on steel at all.

It's generally going to come down to your designs and the materials you use on your handles. Fancy orange/black G10? Probably not a safe choice. Micarta (in any color/form)? You'll be just fine. Extra points, of course, for using bone, antler, and wood though... I also wouldn't get hung up on designs unless it is something really over the top - we give a lot of grace towards traditional fixed blades. It could be a fine leather stacked Marbles offering or one of those plastic and pot metal "survival knives" from the 80's - there is a lot to work with out there.

I've seen some of your work so color me curious with regards to what you intend to turn out in this regard. I am looking forward to it.
 
black mamba said:
Recurves, tantos, glass breakers, etc. are considered non-traditional. Materials in general do NOT disqualify a knife being traditional, but the design features should be familiar to someone from 50+ years ago.
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My GEC 97 and my 2021 BF Forum knife both have recurves, and I've seen some older fixed blades that also had mild recurves but were very traditional, so I'm not sure I can agree with this. But if you said 'really agressive recurves are not traditional' then I'd agree with you 100%.
 
I think it's all about context. Any one of us, if presented with a recurved knife that looks like it belongs strapped to a mall ninja's back, would say, "Yeah, definitely not traditional". However, an example of a recurve that is undoubtedly steeped in tradition and highly appropriate for our forum here, is the kukri - which, arguably has one of the most recurved blades around.

I think I have shown this bowie off here in this sub before. Has the traditional look but it definitely has a recurve.

NR3hbpl.jpg
 
Tyson and Dylan have made great points, and I stand corrected. I was thinking of extreme recurves on modern multi-grinds, and I don't really consider a khukri a recurve, it's more of a thing unto itself, and is completely traditional.
These are just some of the most traditional fixed blades that I can think of:

HiCFkOR.jpg
 
I am tempted to say that no fixed blade is traditional unless it has a stacked leather handle, just so I can pressure you into making one 😁. But that wouldn't be fair.

I agree with posts above in thinking the traditional vs. non-traditional status really depends on the pattern and handle materials. I wonder if you'd be willing to post some sketches of what you have in mind?
 
Micarta is fine. It is after all just a trademark name for any number of reinforced thermoplastic laminates. This stuff has been used for close to 100 years for varying applications. Composite handles of many types have been produced over the years also, bakelite, galalith, celluloid etc. Modern day acrylics( as used by GEC for one) are great by the way.
Steel? 100 years ago, steel was shiny.....as long as it did the job nobody really worried about how much carbon or manganese or tungsten any particular alloy had. Most anything is fine.
 
I would say the best bet is to take heavy inspiration from classics, if you really want to go truly traditional I say look at the knives / knife types themselves and not just features and materials.


For example the knife in your profile picture isn't necessarily non traditional, but it's also not exactly what's going to pop into many people's minds when they think of a traditional belt knife or sheath knife.
A drop point blade with a curve to the spine of the entire knife just doesn't seem to be that common with the mostly north American and European knives that tend to be seen here.
I don't think it was till Imperials frontier line hit in the 70's that we saw factory produced knives with a whole spine drop like that in the US.


This is just a little food for thought if you're trying to go extra traditional here, there are less hard fast rules with belt knives.
 
David, I would start by looking at the Randall and Buck patterns especially with stacked leather. Scott Hanson is worth a look for a higher end custom example.
 
Welcome aboard!
Here's an excerpt from the guidelines posted above. This pretty much covers it. We're pretty loose on fixed blades, If you have specific questions, feel free to PM Frank, knarfeng knarfeng , or me.

Blues said:
A bit more detail:
If a regular knife user of the mid 1960's would find nothing out of the ordinary about the design, then it's traditional.

That means large Buck 110-ish lockbacks are in.

SAKs date to the late 1800's. If they are not one hand opening, they are in. (See comments on materials of construction.)

Modern locking mechanisms such as Walker liner locks, pocket clips, holes / studs to allow one hand opening are all out. (Traditional liner locks, such as the lock on a TL29, are in.) Add a clip to a stockman, and it needs to be posted elsewhere. By the same token, if it is traditional except for a clip and you remove the clip, feel free to post it here.

We tend to have some tolerance when it comes to fixed blades. But, new designs with features such as glass breakers, are not included in this forum.

We give leeway on materials of construction. So if you have a nice stockman with G10 covers, it's traditional enough for us. After all, plastics have been used on knife handles since the 1800's. Stainless steel has been used in cutlery since the 1920's, so stainless is considered traditional. And even though PM alloys are new developments, that fella in the mid-1960's would never know the difference if he were looking at the knife, so they are OK, too.
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I asked this question on the porch, David, a while ago (https://bladeforums.com/threads/what-is-a-traditional-fixed-blade.1811468/).

Now, the crowd over there is pretty tolerant, but here are my personal conclusions from that thread:

- no lanyard holes
- no fancy butts (for fighting, glass breakers, rings, etc.)
- no fancy "tactical" blade shapes, tantos, hawks, etc.
- in theory, all handle materials and steels are OK.
- Now, you have to think about potential customers (like me :) ):
---- so I suggest wood scales and full tang
---- one of the great classic steels, like AEB-L (> 60 year old?), A2 or similar. If it were me, I'd like at least a little bit of chrome and toughness :)

Cheers,

Roland.
 
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Danke42 said:
Make a Hudson Bay knife and make sure you do a nice sheath with it.
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and Wild Willie Wild Willie

a recent David Mary Camp knife is pretty close/almost to a Hudson Bay...... Or at least it should fit into the role of a traditional..... :D

What's happening in the David Mary Custom shop?

I just meant the designs seemed to test as Spyderco and Benchmade, at least originally. I don't know what they are up to now. I bought one once. Before my thinking was right about the situation. I modded it a bit, and it cuts really well. I have given it away to someone with the admonition...
www.bladeforums.com www.bladeforums.com
 
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