What makes a great kitchen knife

Justin Schmidt

Justin Schmidt

Joined
Feb 18, 2016
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I asked this over in the kitchen cutlery section but figured I'd ask here as well.
So I would like to try my hand at forging some kitchen knives. Was wondering what you experts look for in a good kitchen knife. Steel type, blade length, handle length, wa handle or full tang, heel height, spine thickness etc. I wanna make a great product but I don't know any chefs to bounce ideas off of.
Thanks in advance
 
Definitely some good information there. about what I was thinking in general design.
KMEkMWl.jpg
 
I was told that when you rock the blade from the tip to the heel you should feel a definite "stop" as you hit the heel. The radius of the curve of the blade should increase as you go from point to heel so that it almost looks straight from a profile view but as you look down the edge of the blade you should see a gradual curve.
 
I suck at drawing and am definitely better with a hammer and grinder than I am a pencil. So hopefully the real thing will be more refined
HMzSbd3.jpg
 
I have been asking about this for a year and I really think it depends on who you are making it for. There are some big differences in technique between pro and home chef. I have ok knife skills and am at least a enthusiast in the kitchen but have come to understand that some techniques require a lot more time using the blade. I'm going to say that if you cut less than 1/2 hour a day cutting German styling might be better.

That doesn't mean that people are wanting that kind of knife.
 
I'd like to try and stick to the Japanese type of knives. I'm just getting into cutlery so I'll definitely do some more research. But It makes sense that pro and home chefs prefer different styles
 
valknut said:
I suck at drawing and am definitely better with a hammer and grinder than I am a pencil. So hopefully the real thing will be more refined
HMzSbd3.jpg
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Too flat at the tip and too much curve near the heal.

I recommend that you contact a retailer of Japanese cutlery and have them send you the profile of a known quality knife.

The profile of a kitchen knife is more important than other types of knives.

Hoss
 
Don't reinvent the wheel. There is very little variation in profiles (outside special purpose blades) for good reason. Cheap Walmart kitchen knives often have perfect proportions and shapes they're just poorly executed in crap steel or too thick etc.
 
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Hey Justin,
You can google gyuto and grab some images. Shigefusa is hard to beat for classic profile, but there are others that are great.
Grab a profile image, then zoom in/out as needed until the image on the screen is the size as the knife stated in the pic. Then trace.

The design of a good gyuto isn't a destination at all, it's a journey, and likely you will chuckle at your first attempts if you continue down this road. ...at least I have :)
And then when you hit on something you really like, you will start to see many minor variations that will make differences in ways you will only understand over time and through lots of feedback.

Now you only have to work out a nice grind geometry. That's a year or more of study, just being able to execute on the potential variations of a large gyuto.
I hope I don't sound discouraging. It's quite a lot of work, but very interesting and rewarding too.
I would recommend against the k-tip. It can get crazy thin and fragile. Work up something in the 180 - 200 mm length to start.
Your learning curve will move faster if you start with shorter blades. 50 by 180 is a really good blade size.
 
valknut said:
I'd like to try and stick to the Japanese type of knives. I'm just getting into cutlery so I'll definitely do some more research. But It makes sense that pro and home chefs prefer different styles
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I didn't say that people prefer different knives but that they should use different knives :p. Most people won't get past rocking a blade. That said you don't have to have a huge amount of radius to practically rock a blade. Carrots and celery are going to be the big ones.
 
When I started making kitchen knives it was recommended to me that I read a book called "An Edge in the Kitchen." I didn't have a lot of experience with kitchen cutlery so this book was very informative so I recommend you check it out. In a condensed version, I like a 2" heel, .100" or less at the spine, 4.5-5" handle, the first 1/4 or so from heel to tip is flat and the tip rises roughly 1/3 of the overall height. Round the spine and fronts of the bolsters so it's comfortable when using a pinch grip.

There are lots of different preferences and styles but this is what I've settled on and seems to work best. Here is a pic of my gyuto style chef's knives. This one is 8". Hopefully this helps.
sJsadz4.jpg
 
google the old sabateir knives. You can do what you want with the spine and choil area but the edge profile is universally loved.
 
Most will tell you that a gyuto is just a Japanese version of a Sabatier. I would say that the gyuto is Japanese at the ends (heels and tip style) and French in the middle. The design combines the best of both IMO. What I discovered is that the shape of the gyuto that I bought as a pattern is almost infinitely scalable.
 
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beyond the profile concerns, my answer is - a thin hard and very sharp edge is what makes a great kitchen knife,
one that passes through food and doesn't feel like its breaking up the food as you use it.

also a comfortable and universal handle.
There's alot of unique and new handle designs out there mostly by western makers, and they have sharp lines and sharp corners. These handle designs really distinguish the maker and sell knives, but I don't think they are very comfortable in the hand. I know because I bought a few but that's just my opinion.

steel type - high carbon steel, (although AEB-L is pretty good)
length - personal choice, but I believe 210 mm is most popular and sells the most. I also think that most people don't want to pay for a small bladed custom knife. They prefer the longer lengths even if they cost more. There are exceptions and I just sold a 4.25 and 5". Customers seem to like an 8-8.5" blade if they are buying a custom kitchen knife.

Personally for my use, I settled in on about a 7" blade, I think it's most versatile, but I use a 5" prep utility alot as well
 
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Look at some classics like a French Nogent Sabatier chef's knife, a German Henckels or Wusthof chef's knife, and a Japanese Masamoto KS gyuto. Murray Carter's 101 Knife Designs book is great (check the library if you don't want to buy) and there are also a lot of free knife patterns at Dan Comeau's DIY knifemakers website, http://dcknives.blogspot.com

There is not one style, profile, or geometry that is acknowledged as the greatest of all time chefs knife. In fact, it could be argued that a general purpose chef's knife is a jack of all trades proposition versus having individual knives for each type of job in the kitchen (slicer, chopper, butcher, parer, etc). And as mentioned, every cook has different individual preferences. Make stuff and get them in the hands of a bunch of other people.
 
valknut said:
I'd like to try and stick to the Japanese type of knives. I'm just getting into cutlery so I'll definitely do some more research. But It makes sense that pro and home chefs prefer different styles
Click to expand...
to answer question, comfort and sharpness. length, ratios, size of curve, and related stuff makes for a good debate but means nothing unless the blade is comfortable to hold and use and laser sharp. i would suggest starting with an Ajikiri or ko-deba,(http://www.kitchen-knife.jp/standard/aji.htm) basically a small chef's knife with a 3" to 5" edge. don't worry about a hidden tang or wa handle or clad steel. you should be able to make one with a 4" double bevel cutting edge and a plain(not stabilized) handle that weighs 2 oz. or less. i like 1/16" stock, straight edge, ffg, 7 dps edge, 35mm to 40mm at heel, distal taper, balance point where blade meets handle. i don't rock chop, i slice. if i need mass quanties of chopped veg i use a manual spring loaded chopper(the kind you hit with hand) or food processor. i start with a rectangle blank, grind both sides, HT, then cut from spine to edge and make a point. the larger the cut angle, the more stiffness in blade.
once you are happy with result, is easy to scale up. this is a scaled up one i made, 8" blade, walnut handle, 3 ounces total weight, slices beef silverskin as easy as it slices cucumber. https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/basic-lightweight-chefs-knife.1511853/
enjoy.
scott
 
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