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What steel is this

Discussion in 'Shop Talk - BladeSmith Questions and Answers' started by John mc c, Jan 4, 2019.

  1. John mc c

    John mc c

    241
    Aug 23, 2018
    Hey guys this is a type of silver steel I get local and I'm wondering what we'll known steel is it like
    I've been treating it like w1 but it's not I know
    Carbon 1.13
    Sil .22
    Many .37
    Phosphorus .014
    Sil .018
    Chro .43
    Any help would be appreciated thank you
     
  2. DevinT

    DevinT KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Jan 29, 2010
    I’m not sure what the designation is, I’ve seen similar grades coming out of Europe. I purchased some strip steel similar to this from here in the US several years ago. This class of steel is used in the printing and paper industries.

    Good steel for knives, the extra chrome will make it deeper hardening and help refine the grain. Try hardening from 1475f and temper at 400f.

    Hoss
     
  3. Willie71

    Willie71 Warren J. Krywko. Part Time Knifemaker Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Feb 23, 2013
    With that much carbon, I’d even try running it at 1440-1460f. Do some test coupons and dial in your optimum hardening temp.
     
    DevinT likes this.
  4. John mc c

    John mc c

    241
    Aug 23, 2018
    Thanks hoss and Willie
    So would canola be fast enough?
     
  5. Willie71

    Willie71 Warren J. Krywko. Part Time Knifemaker Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Feb 23, 2013
    The chromium will help, but it’s quite low manganese. You would be better with fast oil, but heated canola might work. You might lose 1-2 Rc points compared to fast oil.

    Try a coupon in brine, and a coupon in heated canola oil and have them hardness tested pre temper. If you lose more than 1-2 points, get the right oil, or get a deeper hardening steel until you do. You can also do brinefor 3 seconds, then into heated canolato finish the quench. You will still crack the odd blade, but not nearly as many as a full brine quench.
     
  6. John mc c

    John mc c

    241
    Aug 23, 2018
    Thanks Willie.
    Yes that's exactly what happened it seemed to me
    Quenched in canola it hardened but knew I was losing a bit
    Interupted quench in brine and oil did the job better it seemed.quick 1-2 and out.didnt get them tested tho
    Just wanted to check that I was on the right track
    Thanks again willie
     
  7. DevinT

    DevinT KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Jan 29, 2010
    Is the steel new or used when you get it? Is there more to be had?

    Hoss
     
  8. John mc c

    John mc c

    241
    Aug 23, 2018
    New in all sizes of round in my local engineering suppliers in Dublin
    They always have it in stock
     
  9. samuraistuart

    samuraistuart KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Dec 21, 2006
    Looks like a high carbon W1 tool steel with slightly elevated Chromium %. "Drill rod". Agreed with the above posts. Keep the hardening temp 1450f-1475f, quench in fast oil.
     
  10. Natlek

    Natlek

    Jun 9, 2015
    koduu likes this.
  11. timgunn1962

    timgunn1962

    478
    Apr 1, 2009
    Silver Steel in the UK is usually to either BS1407 or to W1.2210. Yours looks like BS1407.
     
    koduu likes this.
  12. John mc c

    John mc c

    241
    Aug 23, 2018
    Thanks for all replies guys
    That should be helpful to lots of people this part of the globe as it's all we seem to have.that and o1
     
    DevinT likes this.
  13. DevinT

    DevinT KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Jan 29, 2010
    Use lower austenitizing temperatures when doing a water quench.

    Hoss
     
    Willie71 likes this.
  14. hugofeynman

    hugofeynman Gold Member Gold Member

    534
    Jan 18, 2011
    It’s pretty much like 1.2442 steel, a steel that Achim Wirtz sells. Drop him an email, he’s a pretty nice guy and doesn’t take too long to answer.
     
  15. John mc c

    John mc c

    241
    Aug 23, 2018
    Thanks for info. If that's his super clean stuff I've read great things and remember reading about its heat trestreat somewhere too I can root it out
     
  16. samuraistuart

    samuraistuart KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Dec 21, 2006
    Not really. 1.2442 has quite a bit of tungsten in it for wear resistance, this steel does not have any tungsten or any real carbide forming alloys, other than the very small Cr addition which will help add toughness, but not wear resistance.

    Think of it this way, the alloy the OP listed is akin to a deeper hardening White 2. Achim's 1.2442 is akin to Blue 2 or even Blue 1.

    115CrV3 is a very close comparison, although I don't see any vanadium listed in his specs, but it could be there.

    And to help clear up a few mistakes from the original post, I think this is what was meant:

    Carbon: 1.13
    Manganese: .37
    Silicon: .22
    Chromium: .43
    Sulfur: .018
    Phosphorous: .014
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2019
    hugofeynman likes this.
  17. hugofeynman

    hugofeynman Gold Member Gold Member

    534
    Jan 18, 2011
    Ah, ok, my bad! Thank you, samuraistuart!
     

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