What welder do you use in the shop?

cbr900son

cbr900son

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Mar 3, 2011
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Well been stocking up on new toys and making some jigs/tools for the shop and was wondering what size/type welder you guys use for knifemaking and around the shop in general?
 
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The most common one is a wire welder like a Lincoln or the HF copy. They work well with flux core wire, and with an argon bottle added, they are pretty darn good. They do a lot of basic welding reasonably well. For better work, get a good size stick welder, or go for a TIG/Inverter unit.
 
I have O/A Tig and stick and find use for all of them. If it was a pick of one it would be mig with argon, I think its the most versatile.
 
Welding: 110V MIG, 220v 250A MIG, 220v 180A MIG, O/A, Propane and coal forges, TIG/Stick inverter- I use em all regularly.
Whenever possible it's the TIG- sad that the best option is the most expensive! :)
 
Whats the thickest a mig can weld? There are a few tools for the shop id like to make that will prob use 1/4" plate. They wont see a lot of pressure so Im guessing I wont need full penetration but dont want a weak weld that breaks for nothing.
 
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Miller 250x Mig for heavy duty and general welding. Miller 180amp tig for fine work and SS/Alum. The 250 can weld to 1/2 inch thick though I would still run 2 or 3 passes.

But then I did repair my power hammer arm with my mig. It is 1.25" thick. Heavy V from both sides, many layover passes, preheat and normalize. Has held up for over a year now. It had been torch before with pure nickle rod.
 
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cbr900son said:
Whats the thickest a mig can weld? There are a few tools for the shop id like to make that will prob use 1/4" plate. They wont see a lot of pressure so I'm guessing I wont need full penetration but don't want a weak weld that breaks for nothing.
Click to expand...

These are pretty nice tools to figure that out.
http://www.millerwelds.com/resources/calculators/

Keep in mind that tthose calculations are all on single pass welding, you can always make a couple of passes
It just takes longer.


You have to be careful reading the quick spec sheets on how thick a MIG welder will go
they all use flux core welding for those charts with higher penetration (but you get all that nasty scale)

For a nice finish with gas, you have to go to a bigger machine.


1/4"
http://www.millerwelds.com/products/mig/product.php?model=M00245
would probably do you.
MIG is easy to learn


Arc is the cheapest to start with, has high versatility going to a different rod but has a longer learning curve.


I have access to
Propane-Oxy torch
DC Arc



Since we are on the subject
this website and the youtube chanel are excellent info
http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/
http://www.youtube.com/user/weldingtipsandtricks/videos?flow=grid&view=1
 
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Get a nice Tig machine. You can do stick with them too, which means you get a lot of versatility out of one machine.

The little Tig machines (squarewave/syncrowave 180) are OK, but you'll find the bigger ones usually have better low-end control and excel at finer welding (tig), which seems ironic, but it's true.
... but even a 180 can do 1 inch plate all day on 'stick mode.'
 
Stacy, I haven't personally used one of those, but at $400, I'd be leery of it, just looking at the pictures everything on it looks cheap. Next time I'm Harbor Freight I'll try to remember to look one over and report my thoughts.


If someone is looking to get a good welder for a decent price, I will always recommend to go the same way I did for mine. Look for a used stick welder. A lincoln 225 i a good one, you can usually find them for $100-$200. If it comes with the leads, ground clamp, and stinger, it's worth it, just make sure it runs.

But... If you want to expand on your welding, find a stick welder that has the DC option, you can then get a tig rig to attach to it later on, only thing you can't do with that setup is tig alu.

Here's the price breakdown for the used welder setup I recently got -

Used Lincoln 225 (w/out leads) - $200
Leads, clamp, stinger, - Approx $115

Then I lucked out and found a complete tig rig attachment at a pawn shop - $150

Total - Approx $445 (I already had a tank for argon, so that's not in the price list)






Find local weld shops, talk to them about used machines, they commonly pawn them for people, or know people who want to sell theirs. Stick welders are good, you need some practice, but you can get good used ones for CHEAP, they just aren't cool anymore, everyone wants tig and mig. Check out craigslist, and befriend welders, they'll know other welders, and you'll have an entire network at your fingertips. Lincoln 225 is a decent one to look for, Lincoln 250 is what I have, wonderful machine, but it's a massive, so the space conscious beware.
 
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I have a Millermatic MIG in my shop in Ithaca (160, 180, don't remember) which I run with solid core and a mix gas bottle, the thing is bulletproof, I have been using it hard and have had no problems with it in the 15+ years I have had it ( got it from a welding supply store, there really is a difference between the ones they sell at welding supply stores and the supposedly equivalent ones at Lowes, the welding supply store ones weigh substantially more, at least the ones I have picked up, supposedly because of a much more substantial transformer allowing much higher duty cycle) I also have a Smith brand medium duty oxyacetylene rig in Ithaca and in Syracuse, the Smith design I believe is much better than the Harris design, my older torch has been in constant use since 1989 and I am still on my original tips, O-rings, and regulators. I taught myself to weld with that torch and have done half inch full penetration (of course starting with a V cut on both sides) welding with it. I have a Miller TIG (Diversity 180) that I got last year so I could do stainless and aluminum, definitely different, it won't go as deep, but I can make nice bubble free welds and use it for spot annealing and other localized heat effects. I will be experimenting with using it for silver soldering at some point because it should work for things where the torch is not a neutral enough atmosphere. I bought a RealGear MIG last year to keep in Syracuse so I wouldn't have to keep moving my Miller back and forth, for $399 it came with an autodarkening mask, cart, and a few accessories
http://www.praxairdirect.com/PXItemDisplay?catalogId=10051&langId=-1&storeId=10152&itemID=65670

when I first tried it I had it on an extension cord and it couldn't penetrate sheet metal, but when I plugged it directly into an outlet it worked fine (I used it with mixgas, I have never used flux core) I wouldn't reccomend it as a primary welder but it is much better built than the HarborFreight which I have looked at a few times (there is an advantage to having a Harborfreight store 3 miles from my house, it saves me from buying a lot of junk because I can actually handle the product) If you can afford a Miller or Lincoln MIG they are a great machine that you will get decades of trouble free use out of, if you don't have enough money a Realgear will get you by until you can afford a Miler. The Harbor Freights are junk

-Page
 
Lots of good info and links here! Read thru and watched some videos. I understand a little more now. Ultimately Id like to start getting into forging and want tthe enjoyment of making my own forge and know I need to be able to weld for that and things like damascus billets and other fixtures/ tools Id like to make. Down the line I might even try bigger things like a press or power hammer . I think I enjoy the making fo things as much as knife making sometimes lol.
 
I've got an Esab Migmaster 250, that I keep 0.045 wire in for heavy stuff (spray transfer champ for heavy stuff), a Hobart Handler 187 (bullet proof, excellent turn on and weld box with number 4 tap being exceptionally smooth), that I keep .025 or .035 wire for tacking billets, and any quick and dirty fab, and an Esab Heliarc 252 (350 amp transformer) TIG/Stick unit.

Tig is the most versatile IMHO, but MIG is the most convenient, and almost anybody can do it for non-critical welds.

Stick could be arguably the most versatile with specialty rods for weird stuff, but I never use it.


For tacking billets together MIG is fine, and it's convenient for general fab work, but for all sorts of advanced damascus work TIG is practically mandatory. Stainless, stainless san mai, ferry flipping, etc. You can do all these in other ways, but the extra work mitigates the "point-and-click" time saving of MIG. I'm starting to even tack normal billets together by TIG with no filler.


If I had to buy one welder for a small shop, I'd probably go with a multi-process unit like the Lincoln Invertec V350 pro. It's a mig/tig unit with a lot of features, great reviews, etc. AFAIK it wont do AC TIG, so that eliminates TIGing Aluminum, but it apparently does great MIG and DC TIG. The Miller XMT 304, Thermal Arc Fabricator 252i/211i/181i, etc, are all similar (although I think one of these is less good than the other two?). You can always use a spool gun and weld Aluminum with MIG on these units, so unless you need the capability of AC TIG, these units are light, powerful, and feature packed. They're all expensive new, although the Thermal Arc is the most economical, and seem to get good reviews, and I've seen them cheap second hand.

The Heliarc 252 I've got, is pretty massive, and weighs in around 450lbs without accessories, some of the inverter units weigh well south of 100lbs, and consume much less electricity. This TIG I've got needs a 150amp circuit ideally, although I've gotten by with a 100amp circuit, but I can't hit top amperage.

If you get just a MIG welder, I strongly recommend atleast a small 220V unit, like the Handler 187/190's (the 187 is better). They offer a lot better performance and quality than *any* 110 unit that I've ever seen. Flux core may have some specific applications outside the shop, but for our use, you definitely want gas shielded MIG. If you have any aspirations to fab something like a Forging Press, or anything of the like, don't make the mistake of thinking that's a remote possibility with a HF welder (even the 220 unit), or any 110 unit, regardless of the brand. Personally I'd feel much more confident with an old Stick 220 buzz box, than a 110V mig welder.

Stacy, I've heard the HF Tig isn't worth being paid to haul it off, but no first hand experience. However, there are some guys that have had great luck (and some horrible luck) with the Chicom Inverter units like the Everlast, which are much more economical than the domestic equivalents, and have a ton of features. I think it's just hit and miss if you get a good unit or not. The guy at Welding Tips and Tricks site, uses one of the Everlast units in a lot of his TIG videos.
 
Big thumbs up for the Harbor Freight 240v welders.

I've got the 170 Amp MIG from Harbor Freight and love it. I've welded stainless, Aluminum, and mild steel with it. I'm at the point where I can get nice, clean, stacked-dime looking welds on 1/4" plate, but have had no problem welding 1/2" and thicker with multiple passes. I mostly use .030" wire and have it dialed in very nicely. I've found that it also welds .023" wire very nicely. We did a lot of this welding a roll cage to our Chump Car. It' doesn't do very well with .035" wire. It just seems to struggle with it, regardless of the settings used.

I've also used a Miller welder at the steel shop, and it is very similar on .030" wire. The Miller is just a lot smoother with .035", the HF can't hang with the bigger wire.

I've also got a Miller spot welder. Love it! Some things just beg to be spot welded.
 
I recienty purchased a Hobart 210. It is a dual voltage machine. I strictly use it 220v. If I ever need to take it somewheres that does not have 220 I can plug into 110v. I am not a very good welder but I am learning. I have joined a forum and watch a lot of videos.
 
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