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Discussion in 'General Knife Discussion' started by McCraggen, Oct 8, 2020.
Thanks @TripleB67 for bringing this thread back up again.
I can’t match up to @Gary W. Graley photos but I get lucky every once and a while. Thanks for the compliment!
Just curious, does anyone feel that the D2 steel is inferior to other blade steels used in $50 knives from other companies? From what I've been able to read many seem to consider the D2 to be a decent steel (may be a bit prone to rusting).
Is the 9Cr18MoV considered a step above or below the D2? I've read the D2 is a bit better but based on the pricing of some of their knives one could come to either conclusion. The G2 is used in some of their $50 knives but also in $80 knives. The 9Cr18MoV is used in both $40 knives and $90 knives.
Their D2 and Damascus are both great choices. I have many Civivi in both steels and prefer the Damascus. The main reason for preference is appearance though. They both take a great edge and hold it very well. Neither is really difficult to sharpen either. They really do top notch work for the price. The Damascus Praxis is probably my favorite from Civivi. Also, I have not had any issues with the D2 rusting.
Thanks for the information on the two steels - yes, the Damascus Praxis is stunning! If I wasn't trying to stay around 3 inches that would probably be my top choice! (and it's even cheaper than the Damascus Elementum I'm considering )
Just got my first Civivi , the Governor, for Christmas. Based in part on your earlier review. Very impressive knife. I ve been carrying it the last two weeks.
@whp that folder is pretty amazing overall. I did do one mod to it, seen here in this thread
Does anybody know what steels are used in Civivi damascus? I heard somebody on Reddit say it is pattern welded 9Cr18Mov but I can't find any information from official sources on that. I'm interested because I just ordered one.
I'll be buying 2 new Civivi's this week, and waiting for stock on a 3rd....looking forward to enjoying their bang for the buck value.
Civivi's D2 is okay for Chinese D2. Their 9Cr18Mov is excellent for 9Cr18Mov. Check out this cut test on 9Cr18Mov. This is a 1" section of blade sharpened to 15dps and tested across multiple edges on a standard medium for repeatability. To put the results in context for these test conditions, Real Steel's 9Cr18Mov did better than some of the Chinese D2. Civivi's 9Cr18Mov did as well as some of the lower-end S35VN and M390.
You may want to check out the Durus. That would fit your range. Those come in D2 as well as Damascus.
That is correct, but they have not released an exact composition. I will say I have had a lot of their Damascus, and it is has great performance for the price.
My only Civivi is the jade G10 Asticus. It’s awesome! I’d post a photo, but I wouldn’t be able to top the one @Retired UPS Driver put up on the first page of this thread.
Thank you for the info, I actually like 9Cr18Mov, it has performed well in my edge stability and retention testing. I'm happy with their damascus being made of that.
This is all the Civivi knives that I own. All are an outstanding value.
It's sort of hard to compare the two, since they are fairly different steels: D2 is semi-stainless and 9cr18mov is stainless. Perhaps more importantly there isn't as much hard analysis done on on 9cr18mov as there has been on D2. 9cr seems to perform somewhere between 440c and VG10... good edge retention and toughness and excellent rust resistance. D2 seems to end up with good edge retention and toughness and fair to poor rust resistance. I can tell from experience that 9cr is dramatically easier to sharpen. But if you are looking for "quality" in the more abstract sense, they are probably pretty comparable. Both are used in quality budget knives in the 30 to 60 dollar range by several manufacturers and will give good results as long as the heat treat and design of the knife are good. FWIW I am a fan of 9cr18mov and am really excited to try out AR-RPM9, which appears to be a powder metallurgy equivalent of 9cr.
On corrosion resistance, 9Cr18Mov is a slam dunk over D2. On edge retention, heat treatment can make a world of difference.
In the video I posted earlier, Civivi's 9Cr18Mov didn't just smoke Real Steel's 9Cr18Mov on edge retention. It also smoked their own D2. The thing with D2 is that its reputation for edge retention was built by more expensive knives with better heat treatments. Chinese D2 is another animal. It's mass-produced on a budget scale. There also seems to be some variance in composition. Under the particular test conditions used by Outpost 76, Chinese D2 is all over the place on performance. Some perform quite well but the average is pretty disappointing.
The way I see it, D2 is a trade-off that supposedly gives you better edge retention for less corrosion resistance. If it has trouble competing with genuinely stainless budget steels like 12C27, 14C28N, or even the less stellar 9Cr18Mov from Real Steel; that doesn't seem like a good deal.
BTW, AR-RPM9 doesn't seem to offer much over 9Cr18Mov in edge retention (for now, I'm hoping). Under the same test conditions, results were on par with Real Steel's 9Cr18Mov. In other words, Civivi's regular 9Cr18ov was a lot better. Given the powdered metallurgy and tweaks to composition, we expected better things from AR-RPM9. It could just be that they haven't figured out a good heat treatment for it (yet, I'm hoping).
You mentioned 14c28n, now there’s a steel that doesn’t get the love it deserves. I’ve been really excited to see Civivi starting to offer knives in this steel. If they handle it as well as they do 9cr they will get impressive results!
I only have one, a d2 Elementum. I really enjoy carrying, flipping, and cutting with it.
D2 on this takes and seems to keep it's edge pretty well;
Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr