Where to get PB washers to replace nylon washers...

[Tommyswrx]

I have the full set of Cold Steel Custom Series knives and they all look to be on nylon washers. I was looking to swap them for PB washers but need to know the best place to get them. Any help?

 

[David Mary]

First thing that came to mind:

 

[killgar]

You didn't ask, but I'll offer the following-

I used to think that phosphor bronze washers were an automatic upgrade to synthetic washers, but I don't feel that way anymore.

Here's a story I've told several times- Assuming that PB washers would be superior, I switched out the synthetic washers of my Cold Steel Ti-lite 4 for PB washers (I suspect the synthetic washers were teflon). Before the swap, with the synthetic washers, I could easily wrist-flick the knife open with a snug pivot. After the swap, I could no longer wrist-flick the knife open unless I loosened the pivot to the point of blade-play.

I wondered why this was, and after a bit of research I discovered that the COF (coefficient of friction, the measurement of how slippery a material is) of teflon is much lower than phosphor bronze. Teflon is more slippery.

I've been making switchblades for about ten years now, and I used to use PB washers in all of them. Then I was working on a knife and it just wasn't firing as strong as I require. I was using PB washers in it, but remembering my experience with the Ti-lite 4 I switched the washers to teflon, and the knife fired noticeably stronger, strong enough to satisfy me.

So now I'm a convert to teflon and use teflon exclusively in all of my knives.

That's my experience anyways.

The pic below shows how much I was into phosphor bronze washers. All those little containers have different size PB washers in them.

I buy my teflon washers from usaknifemaker.com.

On a related note- I don't know what knives you're looking to do the swap in, but It's my understanding, and my experience, that Cold Steel uses washers with metric sizing (inner diameter and outer diameter). It's possible they have them made just for them. There are very few PB washers for knives in metric sizes, so I wouldn't count on finding washers in the exact same sizes as the stock Cold Steel washers. None of the CS washers inner or outer diameters I've ever handled have matched any of the washers in my assortment.

 

[Tommyswrx]

You didn't ask, but I'll offer the following-

I used to think that phosphor bronze washers were an automatic upgrade to synthetic washers, but I don't feel that way anymore.

Here's a story I've told several times- Assuming that PB washers would be superior, I switched out the synthetic washers of my Cold Steel Ti-lite 4 for PB washers (I suspect the synthetic washers were teflon). Before the swap, with the synthetic washers, I could easily wrist-flick the knife open with a snug pivot. After the swap, I could no longer wrist-flick the knife open unless I loosened the pivot to the point of sloppy blade-play.

I wondered why this was, and after a bit of research I discovered that the COF (coefficient of friction, the measurement of how slippery a material is) of teflon is much lower than phosphor bronze. Teflon is more slippery.

I've been making switchblades for about ten years now, and I used to use PB washers in all of them. Then I was working on a knife and it just wasn't firing as strong as I require. I was using PB washers in it, but remembering my experience with the Ti-lite 4 I switched the washers to teflon, and the knife fired noticeably stronger, strong enough to satisfy me.

So now I'm a convert to teflon and use teflon exclusively in all of my knives.

That's my experience anyways.

The pic below shows how much I was into phosphor bronze washers. All those little containers have different size PB washers in them.

I buy my teflon washers from usaknifemaker.com.

On a related note- I don't know what knives you're looking to do the swap in, but It's my understanding, and my experience, that Cold Steel uses washers with metric sizing (inner diameter and outer diameter). It's possible they have them made just for them. There are very few PB washers for knives in metric sizes, so I wouldn't count finding washers in the exact same sizes as the stock Cold Steel washers. None of the CS washers I've ever handled have matched any of the washers in my assortment.

I appreciate it. I think I will stick with what came in them and if they ever need to be replaced I will buy the same ones. Thanks again.

 

[elevator man]

Now you got me thinking. I thought plastic washers were junk, stuff found in gas station knives. But the friction is truly less? Maybe I should get over my stigma of cheapo knives with Teflon washers and order some to swap into my two spyderco endelas. Might make em drop shut a little easier.

 

[killgar]

Now you got me thinking. I thought plastic washers were junk, stuff found in gas station knives. But the friction is truly less? Maybe I should get over my stigma of cheapo knives with Teflon washers and order some to swap into my two spyderco endelas. Might make em drop shut a little easier.

It's my understanding that Spyderco has used Teflon washers in a number of their knives.

I've read that Rick Hinderer also has a preference for Teflon washers, and that he used to use Teflon exclusively. Then he gave buyers a choice between bearings, bronze phosphor, or Teflon.

Here's my theory on how bronze phosphor washers got so popular, and developed the image of being the best- It all started with the Sebenza. Many years ago the Sebenza was widely regarded on this forum as the absolute ultimate folding knife. I remember those days here at Bladeforums, the Sebenza was king, and if you dared to question if a Sebenza was worth the money, or if a knife that expensive was really any better than a knife at half the price, you were in for a fight. You just didn't dare question the almighty superiority of the Sebenza.

I don't know how many times I read "If you only held one in your hand, then you would understand", and "If you used one you would give up all other knives", and so on. The Sebenza became downright mythological.

Well, the Sebenza had bronze phosphor washers, something unusual at the time. And since the Sebenza was regarded as the absolute best folding knife, that naturally meant that bronze phosphor washers were the absolute best washers. And that notion just sort of worked it's way through the collective psyche of the knife community.

That's my theory anyways.

And the more BP washers were used by other makers, the more it reinforced the idea that they were the best.

And of course people tend to believe that something made out of metal is better than something that looks like cheap plastic. And "bronze phosphor" or "phosphor bronze" sounds a lot cooler than "nylon" or "Teflon", just like "titanium" sounds a lot cooler than" stainless steel".

But again, just my theories, and some online, late night ramblings .

 

[David Mary]

All I know is I once had a knife with those super thin flimsy white washers. I assume they were teflon. Frankly I don't even remember what model it was, but I think it was a Cold steel. I opened the knife up one day to find the washer pretty shredded. But it was also rather gritty inside the pivot area. I had been carrying the knife in my pocket at the shop, and I get pretty dusty there, including metal dust, so that day I decided I did not like washers that were not metal. I replaced that knife's washers with pb (from a $20 deprtment store knife that I didn't like very much, though I did have to slightly thin them on a diamond sharpening plate first, followed by a finer stone), and didn't look back. Action was sufficient for my use. I wish I could remember which knife, but I know it's one I moved along after that.

Anyway this is probably a YMMV topic. While I would still most likely avoid a knife that uses them, or would endeavor (should I end up with one) to replace them with metal washers, I suspect, based on the venerable killgar's words, that for most people they would not be a problem, given most are not swimming in hardened steel dust on the regular. But also, I don't open my knives up for cleaning very often. Just rinse and dry for the most part. If I were to hazard a guess, I probably open any given user knife up twice a year at most (on average, barring initial or subsequent modding phases where dialing in occurs). I might more often, but whenever I do the buildup in the pivot is usually negligible, despite my location of carry.

ETA: I think it was a model with dual washers, PB and the flimsy ones I mentioned.

 

[jux t]

If it’s any help, I’ve replaced the stock washers in many recon 1’s and voyagers with .010x.250x.625 pb washers and am happy with them.

 

[Tensaw]

I've noticed Skiff sells pb washers, but I believe they're thick enough to replace bearings.