Zen Toolworks CNC Carving Machine Kit

T

ThirdEye4013

Joined
Nov 10, 2010
Messages
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This thing is probably the coolest thing Ive seen in a while. Its a desktop CNC Milling machine you get to make yourself. It is supposed to be a pretty straight forward build too. It comes with everything you need besides, a 3 Axis Stepper Motor Driver, a power supply, Female to male printer cable, and a spindle/cutter. But you can buy the motor driver for 30$ or so online, the power supply for about 30$ online as well, and you can use even a dremel for a spindle/cutter. But you can buy a better more expensive one online also. So all in all, with this kit and the extras, it should end up costing around $430. That is crazy cheap for a CNC machine.. It has a 12" by 12" by 10" work area. It connects to your computer and is ran from CNC software. Carve, Cut, Relief Carve, Inlay, Engrave; your Wood, Stone and other natural products, Metals, Fiberglass, you name it. I am about to find a way to get enough $ to buy one. I may sell my airbrush, and guitar or something. Imagine you can mass produce your own knives so quick with something like this, and sell them online and get your money back! Or offer custom CNC machining or build your own equipment.

Here's the Link to the amazon listing
http://www.amazon.com/Zen-Toolworks-CNC-Carving-Machine/dp/B002ARTLUG


Check out the ratings and comments, the first is very descriptive and long.
http://www.amazon.com/Zen-Toolworks...=dp_db_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1


Heres the companies YouTube page with plenty of videos to show how to assemble it and Show you it at work.
http://www.youtube.com/user/zentoolworks#p/u/3/zctqL_nZYyw


So what do you guys think of this? I think its great! Ive wanted to get a CNC machine for a LONG time and never expected to be able to afford one. But now im thinking differently after seeing this. I can think of so many things I would use it for its not even funny. So what do you guys think? should I get it?
 
ThirdEye4013 said:
Imagine you can mass produce your own knives so quick with something like this, and sell them online and get your money back! Or offer custom CNC machining or build your own equipment.
Click to expand...

I'm going to just throw a quick cautionary word out. A tool will not make knives, a knifemaker will. Ask Nathan The Machinist. He has daily access to lots of high-dollar CNC equipment that he uses in his knifemaking. He does more than most via CNC honestly, and there is still a LOT of handwork.

If I had $500 to spend on a tool and I was starting out in knifemaking, I'd go for a Grizzly or Coote grinder. It will do a lot more for you than a CNC carving machine for sure.

-d
 
Well first off, I dont plan to use it to make knives from start to finish.... I'm talking about cutting out my designs, liners, springs, handles, etc. Then I do the rest. Lol I wouldn't have a machine make a knife from start to finish and call it my own, plus I dont even see how this could even make a knife... I'm talking about layouts. I didn't expect to press a button and BAM! I have a knife, I was talking bout cutting out the pattern then me finishing it. I have 3 belt grinders, 2 bench grinders, and an assortment of a lot of other tools. This would just be in case I decide I really dig one of my designs and I want to make more but exactly the same. Or cut out a bunch of springs for a liner lock folder design, Engrave a perfect 3d image on a wood handle, or something else of the sort. And secondly I wouldn't call my 4th year making Knives, "first starting off", either....
 
This is what Decker is probably replying to;"Imagine you can mass produce your own knives so quick with something like this
The "knifemaker 5000" !

I'd be worried about durability, might be ok for softer things-wood-plastic or nonferrous metals.

take the money and get a bandsaw, Blades are cheaper than tooling for a cnc

oh

and to some here that give alot of good advice, 4years is just starting out. No condecention or negative connotation intended or implied.
 
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Gotcha. Didn't realize I worded it to sound that way, was in a hurry at the moment, left out the extras. I was thinking about that as I was writing it, "I'm gonna get quoted on this, about how it doesn't make knives,"

But what would make you worried about durability? Why wouldn't it cut a 1/4 inch thick bar stock of D2 or 1095? Did you watch any of the videos? they relief carved zen toolworks into stone. Even if that was soft stone, I joined there forum, with a bunch of people who actually made them, One person said they used it to cut out there own layout to make a case for a custom computer from 440 stainless 3/4" thick. So I see if perfect for what I would use it for, plus Metal is what I would use least on it. I would use it for 3d transfers mostly. Its very very detailed.

I have a band saw as well, Its pretty old, but its what I have used for years without problem, but I definitely cant do on a bandsaw, what this can do. Plus I always think of something I really want that I couldn't ever make by hand, and the price CNC Machining companies charge is just way to much than its always worth in my opinion. If I got this, I dont see buying Christmas, or b-day presents for the family anymore, or at least until I run put of Ideas..

Yeah 4 years may be pretty novice compared to a lot of people here, but what I meant by that, is I have all the stuff I NEED, already. This is a bonus, cuz I dont need anymore tools. Plus If I did, I could Make them with this!
 
Sure

Buy it and then get back to us with the good , bad and ugly about it.


If you have to sell everything you own to buy that kit, scroll down and read the list of things NOT included.
Motors, drivers, power supply, computer, software.....

That price is now doubled or tripled, and you still haven't cut anything.

I also suspect it may be good enough for roughing in handles, but not rigid or powerful enough to do steel.
at 7x7, it's too small to do any hunter sized fixed blade and the price for the 12x12 unit is MORE.

I wold spend that cash on standard tools, or if you want to CNC do the design and outsource the mfg.

I briefly eyeballed some cnc, but anything even remotely useful is thousands
I would rather get something with the rigidity to do metal
http://www.mini-lathe.com/KX3/KX3-2.htm


and the very second that you are setup to use the machine you choose, you will a project that needs a bigger machine.
 
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Your right, I dont know why I was even really debating it at first, Cuz I probably would get it no matter what. Like I said I always wanted a CNC machine, but never thought to be able to get a cheap one, at a size all I need. Most Desktop CNC machines are up in the thousands. I think this will buy its self somehow. If eBay is almost 70% Hong Kong mass produced junk metal stuff that isn't name brand that sells DAILY, I'm sure I could make something that will sell on there as well, even though I dont have a trademarked name or anything.



Edit: Guys... It cuts 3/4" 440 steel. Thats could be a Rockwell hardness up to 60 CR I dont see why it will have trouble getting through 1/4 " 1095 at all. especially when it will be annealed in the first place. Yeah didn't realize that was the 7x7 The 12x12 is 500$. But CNC software is all over the net, FOR FREE. All I would do is export my image from Autodesk AutoCAD 2011 into a .CNC file and import into the free software to print. In the videos Hes using Linux, which is ALL FREE. Not one thing on Linux costs anything. at all. And I have a computer.. Obviously. But double or triple? no.... I named the prices up in the first post for the extra materials. The stuff i found equaled out to 90$. So its gonna be about 490$ for the 7x7 and its about $600 for the 12 x 12. You still cant beat it.... If anyone can, please show me before I do buy this. LOL. And also like I said, I have all the standard tools I need.. I dont need anything else. This is a BONUS remember. Not to improvise for a grinder, bandsaw, scrollsaw, belt sander, disc grinder, drill, nor any other type of tool. I want this for cutting out and engraving advanced designs you just cant normally create so simply, that would waste time. Oh and It HAS THE MOTOR! Its a used motor but it HAS it INCLUDED! Its the 3 axis Motor DRIVER thats not included.

EVERYONE READ THE FIRST COMMENT IN THE RATING PLEASE... HE EXPLAINS THE WHOLE PROCESS, AND ALL THATS NOT INCLUDED AND INCLUDED.
 
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not to knock it like everyone else, but you could hold onto that money and put it towards a nice old bridgeport or metal lathe on craigslist... the applications for both of those tools are endless, and they will hold up a hell of a lot better than a little machine like this.. not to mention you can convert a manual mill to cnc control with some research and money.. and you'll have an invaluable tool, one that could make these kits for you :P
 
Kenon Rain said:
not to knock it like everyone else, but you could hold onto that money and put it towards a nice old bridgeport or metal lathe on craigslist... the applications for both of those tools are endless, and they will hold up a hell of a lot better than a little machine like this.. not to mention you can convert a manual mill to cnc control with some research and money.. and you'll have an invaluable tool, one that could make these kits for you :P
Click to expand...


Hmmm... Ill have too look into that. I wonder how much it would cost to convert it to CNC control? That would be very useful actually. Probably even better. So I can actually make a cylindrical shape. unlike this equipment lol. Good suggestion buddy! I appreciate it.


12345678910 said:
Notice that the kit you are looking at is called "carving" not "milling"

Have a look at this, it has good reviews.

http://www.tormach.com/Product_PCNC_main.html
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I understand it doesn't say milling. But watch the websites youtube videos. It does the exact same as the one you just showed me. I read no difference on that website. Plus its just a little too much. I gotta sell stuff to get it man, dont want to sell EVERYTHING.
 
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I predict you will get it and use it for not near as much as you think you would. Ask me how I know, I have a cnc milling machine (Tormach). Anyway there are some good free cad and cam programs but you will need to pay your dues learning them and or crashing your machine learning them. I predict this would do a great job on micarta handles both profiling them and or machining them to shape. I seriously doubt this would machine steel well. But if your hellbent in getting a cnc this is probably the best/cheapest way to get started.
I say get it and start cutting, you will learn alot and have some fun.
CW
 
I think the conversion for a bridgeport is another thousand or two.. but well worth it of course. You then have a real tool, It's no high speed cnc multi head milling station, but it'll do most anything you would want it to with the right tooling.

It's always worth it to get the best you can, and if the best you can get sucks.. wait a while :rolleyes:..

one thing about buying used tools too is you can always sell them for close to or more than what you got them for, so while the up front cost is a bit bigger than this little guy, It's a bit less risky :)
 
Yeah Im gonna read up about it, I joined CNCzone.com forums and ill find out what to go with. They even have a nice homemade section.
 
The cheapest CNC mill that will do what you want is the Taig. It runs less than $2000.
You can convert a Harbor Freight or Grizzly (Seig) Chinese model to CNC, if you know what you are doing.
Anything that uses a Dremel for a cutter head is basically a toy, and it won't cut 3/4" steel-unless you do about 75 passes.
 
is that why everyone thinks this wont do crap? I was just saying that you could use one. Your supposed to use an actual CNC Spindle/cutters. When i said you could use a dremel that was for cutting costs, but you dont actually use the whole dremel anyway im talking about the connector piece and the rotary bits. But i was gonna just get the spindles/cutter bits from them.
 
You obviously have your mind made up, and won't be confused by facts.
 
The machine has a PVC (plastic!) frame and end-supported shafts... hard to take it seriously.
 
Uh oh, somebody caught the CNC bug. Good on you buddy, I don't regret jumping head long into it. I did look before I leaped, but the cost of entry back then was a tougher to swallow too...

To anyone without any machining experience, I'd urge you to find someone with a little mill or something in their garage who will let you come over one afternoon and cut some chips (bring your own tools, or at least some beer) before buying anything. You might be surprised how heavy things need to be in order to take even a fairly modest cut in steel. A little machine will have you there all day trying to chew out a little slot.

To anyone with machining experience looking to get into CNC. I suggest you look into a retrofit and Mach3. And rather than try to retrofit a manual machine, find a good small old dead CNC to retrofit, that way things like ball screws are already in place. These machines sell for less than a manual machine because they otherwise have no value.

I think once you learn about what it takes in a machine to do the job, you'll view things like this (the table is basically suspended in air = low rigidity) a little more skeptically. It weighs 18 pounds? It needs to be 10-100 times that for a small cnc. You're not going to have a great deal of success making blades on that. It might eventually do it, but you could do it the old fashioned way faster, better and cheaper. I see its primary utility to a knifemaker as roughing out scales and perhaps doing some inlay work. Really a cool toy though. I'd have one in a minute.
 
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