ZWEAR questions

ShannonSteelLabs

ShannonSteelLabs

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Ok some quick questions on Z-wear.
How is the corrosion resistance? Is it similar to CPM 3V in that aspect?

How is the edge holding? And what hardness should i use for a edc/camp knife with a 3.5- 4 inch blade? The customer would like good edgeholding.

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Actually near the bottom of page 7.......

Same make-up as Vasco-Wear.....great steel BTW...
 
I've been taking smaller knives to 62 RC and bigger ones to 60 RC. The edge holding is excellent. The best of any steel I've worked with personally though I've got some 10v going now.

I've been using the data sheet heat treat, austenitize at 1975, plate quench, 3x 2hour temper at 1000f. Willy has been trying out lower temper temps.

Finish the knife closely before HT. It sucks to work with after. It's tough enough to support a very fine edge.
 
kuraki said:
I've been taking smaller knives to 62 RC and bigger ones to 60 RC. The edge holding is excellent. The best of any steel I've worked with personally though I've got some 10v going now.

I've been using the data sheet heat treat, austenitize at 1975, plate quench, 3x 2hour temper at 1000f. Willy has been trying out lower temper temps.

Finish the knife closely before HT. It sucks to work with after. It's tough enough to support a very fine edge.
Click to expand...
I use peters heat treating for all my heat treat so im looking for a general HRC number. Im sure they use the 1000 degree quench

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Please use correct terms !. I would like to see an F or C after the number , we do have an international membership .
Steel is quenched from the austenitizing temperature then it is tempered. Vasco is no longer there .It's now made by Crucible . It can now be found in 'Crucible steel selector ' as CRU WEAR.
 
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http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1439207-Zapp-Z-Wear-experience-and-heat-treat

I absolutely love this steel. :thumbup:

I've been doing some testing, and low temper is still too unproven to recommend for a customer knife. I've had zero issues/failures so far, but I think cryo/400f temper would work better with 1925-1950f austentize, from my early trials. I'm running edges of 0.003" with great edge stability and wear resistance. I have a few knives with 1975f austentize, cryo, 1000f 2hx4 tempers in use and the blades are amazing. I've been getting Rc63/64 with the 1975f/cryo/1000f tempers. Cryo gives me about 2Rc points above the datasheet numbers. For an edc or camp knife, you can't go wrong. It's not stainless, but it's way less reactive than the simple carbon steels.
 
Willie71 said:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1439207-Zapp-Z-Wear-experience-and-heat-treat

I absolutely love this steel. [emoji106]

I've been doing some testing, and low temper is still too unproven to recommend for a customer knife. I've had zero issues/failures so far, but I think cryo/400f temper would work better with 1925-1950f austentize, from my early trials. I'm running edges of 0.003" with great edge stability and wear resistance. I have a few knives with 1975f austentize, cryo, 1000f 2hx4 tempers in use and the blades are amazing. I've been getting Rc63/64 with the 1975f/cryo/1000f tempers. Cryo gives me about 2Rc points above the datasheet numbers. For an edc or camp knife, you can't go wrong. It's not stainless, but it's way less reactive than the simple carbon steels.
Click to expand...
Awesome thank you. Im thinking of shooting for 61HRC probably. I use peters heat treat for my knives. Im not sure what their temps are but they are really great with any steel i send.
Their modified 3V heat treat is sick. (61HRC and enhanced edge holding and corrosion resistance)

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kuraki said:
Finish the knife closely before HT. It sucks to work with after. It's tough enough to support a very fine edge.
Click to expand...

So on this Z Wear you are grinding the bevels in before HT? taking the edge to what thickness?
I'm going to be working on a .098 kitchen knife

regards
Harbeer
 
The x-wear steels have similar corrosion resitants to 3v, very good semi-stainless performance in my opinion. If corrosion resitants is an issue Peter's will do a low temper on Zwear.
 
HSC /// said:
So on this Z Wear you are grinding the bevels in before HT? taking the edge to what thickness?
I'm going to be working on a .098 kitchen knife

regards
Harbeer
Click to expand...
I'd bring the edge to 15 thou' or so before HT maybe a tiny bit thinner.

I'd shoot for 63HRC low temper. Helps with stain resistance and really makes it sharpen up great!
 
ShannonSteelLabs said:
I'd bring the edge to 15 thou' or so before HT maybe a tiny bit thinner.

I'd shoot for 63HRC low temper. Helps with stain resistance and really makes it sharpen up great!
Click to expand...
ok so the quench plates not really contacting the ground bevels isn't a problem?
I don't know, I have always quenched flat profiles and ground bevels after HT.

I also don't understand this low temper approach.... if the manufacturer has specified 1000F, why deviate?

Doesn't a higher temp draw equal better corrosion resistance?
Isn't a higher temper draw equal more toughness?
You also don't have to worry about grinding/overheating it if the temper is at 1000F.

EDIT - I just saw a knifesteelnerds article on Zwear so let me go read that...:D

thanks
Harbeer
 
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HSC /// said:
ok so the quench plates not really contacting the ground bevels isn't a problem?
I don't know, I have always quenched flat profiles and ground bevels after HT.

I also don't understand this low temper approach.... if the manufacturer has specified 1000F, why deviate?

Doesn't a higher temp draw equal better corrosion resistance?
Isn't a higher temper draw equal more toughness?
You also don't have to worry about grinding/overheating it if the temper is at 1000F.

EDIT - I just saw a knifesteelnerds article on Zwear so let me go read that...:D

thanks
Harbeer
Click to expand...

Using cryo to convert the retained austenite rather than a high temper leaves more free chromium for stain resistance, and prevents the formation of secondary carbides, which reduce toughness. Larrin did a great article on this steel a while back.

http://knifesteelnerds.com/2018/06/04/toughness-testing-cru-wear-z-wear/
 
HSC /// said:
ok so the quench plates not really contacting the ground bevels isn't a problem?
I don't know, I have always quenched flat profiles and ground bevels after HT.

I also don't understand this low temper approach.... if the manufacturer has specified 1000F, why deviate?

Doesn't a higher temp draw equal better corrosion resistance?
Isn't a higher temper draw equal more toughness?
You also don't have to worry about grinding/overheating it if the temper is at 1000F.

EDIT - I just saw a knifesteelnerds article on Zwear so let me go read that...:D

thanks
Harbeer
Click to expand...
The article on there is excellent.
As Willie71 Willie71 said the cryo helps with retained austenite and frees chromium.

Although I have found that Zwear will patina quite nicely. Not a super heavy patina, but nice blues and similar colors.
 
I profile, quench, then grind bevels. This group of steels likes a faster quench for the first half, then air cooling once you get below 1000f is fine. Cryo right out of quench. No snap temper.
 
so I made 4 Zwear knives, HT myself
the first one is a 6" prep just to get my hands dirty with it.
the 2nd is a 250 mm gyuto

thoughts - the grinding and finishing is miserable (compared to what I work with).
this material is no joke and laughs at ceramics belts.
I slowed down the SFM of the belt and that helped dramatically, run the belt fast and it just glazes the steel,
slow down the grinder alot and the material comes off like chips.

what i like, I like the edge, alot, but not enough to ever work with this again as a homogeneous steel... laminated Z wear core, yes I see some real promise.

otherwise I think this material is both expensive and costly
I went with about 220 lengthwise belt scratches and fine scotchbrite for the finish,

regards

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