Best edge for SAK

Pomsbz

Pomsbz

Joined
Jul 31, 2015
Messages
2,556
Hi,

As you know I'm a huge fan of Victorinox and I've been carrying one for years. The problem is that despite how easy it is to bring back a razor sharp edge, it really doesn't last very long.

I had recently resorted to using a stropped 600 grit toothy edge to try and retain the edge better after having the edge dull entirely from cutting peaches and the blade hitting the stone.

With getting a new couch today I cut off the material from the old one, mainly to check for lost stuff inside (my wife has a long list of lost jewellery over the years) but also because the suede material can come in useful for some projects I have ongoing. Cutting through the suede my recently sharpened SAK lost its edge almost immediately. I took it back to my Sharpmaker and put a stropped 1000 grit edge on it. Also lasted almost no time at all. I ended up finishing the job with a CPM 154 blade that not only did the entire job but was still shaving sharp at the end of it, it had been sharpened using the same Sharpmaker and stropping it's not a technique problem.

I do like my SAK but when I have to spend more time bringing back the edge than actually having the edge cutting stuff, it does get frustrating. Has anyone any bright ideas for a 'better' way to sharpen the SAK to maximise edge retention? I'm rather loathe to having to start carrying a SAK for the tools and another knife for the actual cutting. Albeit the idea of a tool only SAK is appealing as a mod next time I'm bored.

Would appreciate your thoughts!
 
Forget the SharpMaker for your SAK. Put a 25 to 30 degrees per side edge on it (50 to 60 degrees included angle). The steel is too soft to support lower angles, and the carbide content is too low to resist abrasion, so count on it going dull quickly. They don't make those things for knife people.
 
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First off, stop putting a polished edge or fine edge on the SAK. Its just not going to work well, I use an old Norton 'carborundum' stone or a Eze-Lap medium 400 grit diamond hone. I don't strop. I only use a course toothy edge and it lasts very well. When my sister in law had a sofa delivered it was cocooned in heavy cardboard and packing tape. My tinker cut it all off, then broke it all down to fit in her recycle bin, and after the tape residue was cleaned off with some alcohol based hand sanitizer it cut like nothing had been done. Still had the same edge as when I started.

Go toothy edge for SAK's. Forget the fine sharpening gizmos and just go with course. No more than 400 or 500 grit. And no stropping. The sole purpose of all those sharpening gizmos is, to get the money out of your pocket and into the gizmo makers pocket.
 
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I would echo what yablanowitz and jackknife have posted and add that I am a believer that many knife users sharpen their knives with stones or diamond bonded abrasives way too much and too often, I only remove metal from my knife or axe edges in extreme cases. Instead I use the old fashioned sharpening steel which aligns the microscopic teeth of a cutting edge without removing the valuable metal the blade is made of. It is only when the sharpening steel can longer bring a sharp usable edge to the blade that I start getting out the abrasives.

I have kitchen knives that I have not used abrasives on for years at a time because the sharpening steel is so effective!
 
Just another thought here. Is it with that knife specifically, or do you notice it with all your SAK’s? Reason I ask, I have my first SAK, bought in 1988 or 89, a small Tinker. I can get an edge on it that won’t last as long as others I have. I have a Hunter bought in 2003. I’ve dressed and skinned several deer with it before I had to even think about touching up the blade. My small Tinker wouldn’t last anywhere near that. I sharpen them all the same way, free hand on a stone. I’ve wondered over the years if there was just something a little different about that one and the metal used in the blade? Just my thoughts...
 
315 said:
Just another thought here. Is it with that knife specifically, or do you notice it with all your SAK’s? Reason I ask, I have my first SAK, bought in 1988 or 89, a small Tinker. I can get an edge on it that won’t last as long as others I have. I have a Hunter bought in 2003. I’ve dressed and skinned several deer with it before I had to even think about touching up the blade. My small Tinker wouldn’t last anywhere near that. I sharpen them all the same way, free hand on a stone. I’ve wondered over the years if there was just something a little different about that one and the metal used in the blade? Just my thoughts...
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No, the steel is the same, but some years ago Victorinox took the RC hardness up a point or two. It made a difference. This is why you will notice a better edge holding from more recent made SAK
s after about the year 2000 or so. With my memory, at this stage of my life, I can't recall the exact year, sorry!
 
315 said:
Just another thought here. Is it with that knife specifically, or do you notice it with all your SAK’s? Reason I ask, I have my first SAK, bought in 1988 or 89, a small Tinker. I can get an edge on it that won’t last as long as others I have. I have a Hunter bought in 2003. I’ve dressed and skinned several deer with it before I had to even think about touching up the blade. My small Tinker wouldn’t last anywhere near that. I sharpen them all the same way, free hand on a stone. I’ve wondered over the years if there was just something a little different about that one and the metal used in the blade? Just my thoughts...
Click to expand...

That is an excellent point Jim. Variations in manufacturing processes and materials supplied by others during manufacturing can be a common occurrence. A company I worked for back in the 1970s would have regular material variance requests come across my desk from the purchasing department because the product they were to buy had been discontinued or back-ordered. Occasionally, there would be special pricing if one of the specifications would be waived. I was always glad that I was just one link in that decision making chain before specifications for material were changed permanently or even for a one time occurrence.

Having just gotten my Victorinox Champion b back from Customer Service for a couple of items that needed attention, I believe, if it were mine, I would be inclined to send it in and have a different blade put on. Needing to sharpen a blade every time I needed to use it would be rather aggravating. Swiss Army Knives should solve problems not be one.
 
jackknife said:
No, the steel is the same, but some years ago Victorinox took the RC hardness up a point or two. It made a difference. This is why you will notice a better edge holding from more recent made SAK
s after about the year 2000 or so. With my memory, at this stage of my life, I can't recall the exact year, sorry!
Click to expand...

Whatever they’ve got going on the last 20 years seems to work well, hopefully they just stick with it!
 
Mitchell Knives said:
Very odd.

Are you sure you're removing the burr?

You could always try adding a small secondary bevel to strengthen the edge.
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It's a relatively new Spartan, year old if that. The material I was cutting is leather with backing, it's tough stuff. I'll try it tomorrow with another SAK for comparison. There is still some of the couch left. :D I like the idea of a secondary bevel, I'll try that.
 
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Pomsbz said:
Hi,

As you know I'm a huge fan of Victorinox and I've been carrying one for years. The problem is that despite how easy it is to bring back a razor sharp edge, it really doesn't last very long.

I had recently resorted to using a stropped 600 grit toothy edge to try and retain the edge better after having the edge dull entirely from cutting peaches and the blade hitting the stone.

With getting a new couch today I cut off the material from the old one, mainly to check for lost stuff inside (my wife has a long list of lost jewellery over the years) but also because the suede material can come in useful for some projects I have ongoing. Cutting through the suede my recently sharpened SAK lost its edge almost immediately. I took it back to my Sharpmaker and put a stropped 1000 grit edge on it. Also lasted almost no time at all. I ended up finishing the job with a CPM 154 blade that not only did the entire job but was still shaving sharp at the end of it, it had been sharpened using the same Sharpmaker and stropping it's not a technique problem.

I do like my SAK but when I have to spend more time bringing back the edge than actually having the edge cutting stuff, it does get frustrating. Has anyone any bright ideas for a 'better' way to sharpen the SAK to maximise edge retention? I'm rather loathe to having to start carrying a SAK for the tools and another knife for the actual cutting. Albeit the idea of a tool only SAK is appealing as a mod next time I'm bored.

Would appreciate your thoughts!
Click to expand...
I bought a G Sekai Trekker to which Ti scales were glued and contained the SAK tweezers, tooth pick, and ball point pen. This is a SAK copy from Japan which is of no special interest to me except for the ZDP-189 blade at 67 HRC. It is also available with wooden handle slabs minus the scale tools.
 
I just tried cutting the same material, same amount, with my Farmer. Still razor sharp. Must be something wrong with the Spartan blade. I have no doubts about Victorinox's quality standards so I'm going to blunt the edge entirely, grind it flat, then bring it back to 600 grit and try again! Thank you all for your advice.
 
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tiguy7 said:
View attachment 1376936 View attachment 1376937 View attachment 1376939
I bought a G Sekai Trekker to which Ti scales were glued and contained the SAK tweezers, tooth pick, and ball point pen. This is a SAK copy from Japan which is of no special interest to me except for the ZDP-189 blade at 67 HRC. It is also available with wooden handle slabs minus the scale tools.
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I can't find out anything about this one on a google search, would you mind pointing me in the right direction?
 
Pomsbz said:
Fully reground and working perfectly, edge holding up fine. No idea what was going on before.
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What edge angle did you put on it? I've been sharpening some used and new SAKs at 40° inclusive and noticed that on some that's narrower than the previous edge and on some it's wider. Haven't been able to do durability tests on the newly sharpened edges yet.
 
jlomein said:
What edge angle did you put on it? I've been sharpening some used and new SAKs at 40° inclusive and noticed that on some that's narrower than the previous edge and on some it's wider. Haven't been able to do durability tests on the newly sharpened edges yet.
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40 inclusive. Can't go wider on my sharpmaker and don't really want to being honest. I think you have a point though, if using a system like this at least, you have to start from scratch and get the edge angle exactly that of the system. Otherwise it's never going to be ideal.
 
Pomsbz said:
I can't find out anything about this one on a google search, would you mind pointing me in the right direction?
Click to expand...
I bought the knife used on B/F. I think the seller did the Ti handle replacement modification. The wooden handled G. Sekai Trekker should be available on line, but it doesn’t have the handle tools.
 
The Victorinox mini steel is a good tool for maintaining the edge on a SAK. I have a couple of the Zermatt pouches that include a mini steel and they're very handy.

I have an old Woodsman from the 70s (imagine a Huntsman without tweezers, toothpick, or key ring). The main blade has always seemed "funky" to me. Can't seem to get it to take a good edge. The small blade is fine. I've always suspected there is a problem with the steel of the main blade, and it sounds as if that's a possibility. I'd send it in and ask for it to be replaced, but it was a gift from my wife and I don't want to make any changes to it. I think I'll just order a Fieldmaster to use in its place, which would essentially be the same knife but "upgrade" the corkscrew to a Phillips. :D
EDIT/UPDATE: I've had a Fieldmaster sitting in my Wish List for ages. Needed to order something else last night so I finally gave in and added the Fieldmaster to the order! Should be here tomorrow. UPDATE/UPDATE: Arrived and in my pocket.
 
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