California legal folder and automatic

[model_1894]

I was told in California, folder blade length must be less than 3''. is that correct?
I was told in California, automatic blade length must be less than 2''. is that correct?

 

[luethge]

I edc a 4 inch folder in Los Angeles County. I have not encountered any issues. Your experience might be different. I make sure the clip is exposed, I don’t open it unless I’m cutting something.

There are many knowledgeable members here.. someone will chime in soon

 

[ferider]

Except for some specific illegal to carry knife types (gravity, Balisong, etc), or on school properties (blade < 2.5“) or in government buildings (< 4“), there is no blade size restriction for manual folders or openly carried fixed blades in CA. Counties are a different story.

But I’m not a lawyer, please do your own research. For example check with your Sheriff.

 

[killgar]

Both luethge and ferider are correct.

Just to reiterate-

Under California state law you can carry any size of manual folding knife, with the blade in the closed position, openly or concealed. The exceptions are as ferider mentioned (blade length limits on school property K-12, and government buildings).

But there are individual counties and cities that have their own blade length limits and laws regarding what can be carried openly.

As far as switchblades-

Under California state law a switchblade must have a blade under 2" long in order to be legal to carry on ones person anywhere in the state, including on private property, or to have in the driver/passenger area of ones vehicle in any public place.

Technically speaking, a switchblade with a blade under 2" long isn't actually considered a "switchblade" under California state law. And some counties/cities may have their own switchblade laws (for example, possession of any switchblade, of any size, is illegal in San Fransisco, SF Muni code Section 1292).

Here are two links to the official California legislative website where all state knife laws can be found. The first link is the statute that defines what a "switchblade" is under California law, the second describes what is illegal to do with a switchblade under state law. These are the same statutes used in court by judges, prosecutors, and defense attorney's, as well as members of law enforcement.

https://www.leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=17235.&lawCode=PEN

https://www.leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=21510.&lawCode=PEN

 

[killgar]

In regards to the reference to "box cutters" in luethge's post- Under California state law, a person can be charged with possession of a concealed "dirk or dagger" (CA pc 21310) if they are found to be carrying a concealed box cutter even if the blade is not exposed. This makes no sense, and is totally ridiculous, but this is the result of a recent California Appeals Court ruling (People v Hester, 2020). There is an exception however if you are carrying the box cutter for an "innocent" reason.

 

[Knife_Collector_101]

Knife Rights has just filed a lawsuit challenging California’s switchblade ban. Hope that effort is a success.

Personally, I think they should save a lawsuit like that for one of the remaining states that ban possession outright.

You can actually own a switchblade over 2” in blade length privately in your place of residence in California. What isn’t allowed is carrying it on your person in public, storing it in your car, and selling, lending or giving it away to someone else.

 

[Locutus D'Borg]

I have 2 California legal OTFs and they are fantastic. Cities and counties in Cali can tighten state knife laws.

 

[Man with no name]

I just slip one of these in my belt sash style and call it a day!

 

[ferider]

I just slip one of these in my belt sash style and call it a day!

I have no idea what "sash style" means. I googled it and this came up

(Nice knife!)

 

[killgar]

What isn’t allowed is carrying it on your person in public

Just for the sake of complete accuracy-

It's also illegal to carry a switchblade (blade 2" or longer) on ones person on private property, including in ones own home.

This is the result of an Appeals Court ruling from 2009, People v SC (a juvenile court case, so no name of defendant).

Notice how in statute 21510, under part (b), it only says "Carries the knife upon the person", with no mention of public or private property/places. Link-

https://www.leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=21510.&lawCode=PEN

In People v SC, Mr. SC was found to have a switchblade on his person (in a pocket) while on private property. He was arrested, convicted, and appealed. He tried to argue that the "public place" reference in part (a), which refers to a switchblade in a vehicle in a public place, should also apply to part (b), carrying a switchblade on ones person, and that since he was carrying on private property rather than a public place that his conviction should be overturned.

But the Appeals Court did not agree, ruling that because part (b) doesn't specify public or private property, that it applies to everywhere in the state, including in ones own home.

Here are some quotes from their ruling-

"we conclude the statute is violated any time a person carries a switchblade knife on his or her person, regardless of where the possession occurs".

"A switchblade carried on the person represents a constant threat to others, whether carried in public or in private".

"A switchblade carried at home, for example, is dangerous to family members and house guests during an argument".

This is one of the most boneheaded rulings that I have seen the California Appeals Court make. But on the bright side, there is language in that ruling, that in my opinion, confirms ones legal right to possess "switchblades" (blades 2" or longer), in the state of California.

Here is a link to their ruling- https://law.justia.com/cases/california/court-of-appeal/2009/a123371/

Note: That ruling refers to section 653k, which was the switchblade statute in 2009, California later changed how they numbered penal code statutes. Section 653k was changed to 21510.

 

[Man with no name]

I have no idea what "sash style" means. I googled it and this came up

(Nice knife!)

Can also be carried tucked under the belt unconcealed. The only reason I mention this knife is that with a fixed blade there is no mistaking it for a switchblade, balisong, gravity knife, or any other type of legally questionable folding knife in California.

 

[Man with no name]

20200. ​

A knife carried in a sheath that is worn openly suspended from the waist of the wearer is not concealed within the meaning of Section 16140, 16340, 17350, or 21310.

 

[Knife_Collector_101]

Just for the sake of complete accuracy-

It's also illegal to carry a switchblade (blade 2" or longer) on ones person on private property, including in ones own home.

This is the result of an Appeals Court ruling from 2009, People v SC (a juvenile court case, so no name of defendant).

Notice how in statute 21510, under part (b), it only says "Carries the knife upon the person", with no mention of public or private property/places. Link-

https://www.leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=21510.&lawCode=PEN

In People v SC, Mr. SC was found to have a switchblade on his person (in a pocket) while on private property. He was arrested, convicted, and appealed. He tried to argue that the "public place" reference in part (a), which refers to a switchblade in a vehicle in a public place, should also apply to part (b), carrying a switchblade on ones person, and that since he was carrying on private property rather than a public place that his conviction should be overturned.

But the Appeals Court did not agree, ruling that because part (b) doesn't specify public or private property, that it applies to everywhere in the state, including in ones own home.

Here are some quotes from their ruling-

"we conclude the statute is violated any time a person carries a switchblade knife on his or her person, regardless of where the possession occurs".

"A switchblade carried on the person represents a constant threat to others, whether carried in public or in private".

"A switchblade carried at home, for example, is dangerous to family members and house guests during an argument".

This is one of the most boneheaded rulings that I have seen the California Appeals Court make. But on the bright side, there is language in that ruling, that in my opinion, confirms ones legal right to possess "switchblades" (blades 2" or longer), in the state of California.

Here is a link to their ruling- https://law.justia.com/cases/california/court-of-appeal/2009/a123371/

Note: That ruling refers to section 653k, which was the switchblade statute in 2009, California later changed how they numbered penal code statutes. Section 653k was changed to 21510.

So, if you own one, it’s illegal to put in your pocket and carry it around on your own property? In other words, you can keep it, just as long as it doesn’t go into your pocket. Yeah, that’s kind of ridiculous. Pretty much unenforceable as well unless the cops got called to a domestic dispute and searched you and found it.

 

[killgar]

So, if you own one, it’s illegal to put in your pocket and carry it around on your own property? In other words, you can keep it, just as long as it doesn’t go into your pocket. Yeah, that’s kind of ridiculous. Pretty much unenforceable as well unless the cops got called to a domestic dispute and searched you and found it.

That is my understanding.

Here is another quote from the ruling regarding part (b) of 653k/21510-

"the language makes it a violation for a person simply to "carry upon his or her person" a switchblade knife. By having the knife in his pocket, thereby carrying it on his person, appellant violated the plain language of this clause".

Although it's a dumb ruling, at least they were very specific about "carrying" the knife "on ones person", and referencing "in his pocket", which is quite different than having a switchblade in a drawer/display case/safe/box/etc.

And I agree that it would be highly unlikely that a person would ever get caught carrying on their own property. And it's a misdemeanor, which isn't nothing, but as long as a person wasn't engaged in criminal activity, or giving the cops a hard time I doubt they would want to go through the hassle of an arrest and paperwork. But still, if I knew there were going to be cops on my property, I wouldn't want to have a switchblade on me in a way that they could see it.

 

[KELAMA]

I edc a 4 inch folder in Los Angeles County. I have not encountered any issues. Your experience might be different. I make sure the clip is exposed, I don’t open it unless I’m cutting something.

There are many knowledgeable members here.. someone will chime in soon

+1
I have a few edc knives in my rotation, but primarily I usually grab my 4" Spyderco Ti Millie most of the time.
Hey Brother- Marcellus Wallace is also from LA (see video below LOL). Just don't be doing any "gansta $hit, & you'll be fine.

I have no idea what "sash style" means. I googled it and this came up

(Nice knife!)

As I was scrolling down....I came upon this picture and was like "WTF!?" Thanks for the LMFAO!
I think I need to get 1 of these, so maybe I'd look a little less intimidating, if I ever decide to open carry my Topps

Here is another quote from the ruling regarding part (b) of 653k/21510-

"the language makes it a violation for a person simply to "carry upon his or her person" a switchblade knife. By having the knife in his pocket, thereby carrying it on his person, appellant violated the plain language of this clause".

Although it's a dumb ruling, at least they were very specific about "carrying" the knife "on ones person", and referencing "in his pocket", which is quite different than having a switchblade in a drawer/display case/safe/box/etc.

And I agree that it would be highly unlikely that a person would ever get caught carrying on their own property. And it's a misdemeanor, which isn't nothing, but as long as a person wasn't engaged in criminal activity, or giving the cops a hard time I doubt they would want to go through the hassle of an arrest and paperwork. But still, if I knew there were going to be cops on my property, I wouldn't want to have a switchblade on me in a way that they could see it.

^ This

I agree, as long as a person is respectful, and isn't hanging around a bunch of gangsta's....doing a bunch of gangsta $h*t, the LEO in our State have enough on their plate to be worrying about.

Case in point: About a month or so ago, I pulled into the Home Depot located along the 78 Freeway/College in Oceanside. I couldn't believe all of the riff-raff there was loitering in the back of the parking lot. I mean people you could clearly tell were up to no good. There happened to be a O'side LEO police cruiser parked in the back with an LEO sitting inside doing some work on his laptop inside. I parked directly next to him, got out and as I was walking by, I smiled, waved and said something along the lines like "my stuff in the back ought to be safe next to you!?" We both laughed and the next thing you know, we had a really nice conversation with one another for about 15-20 minutes. He pretty much stated that most of his days are laying low (like he was in this HD parking lot, and that 90% of his calls, we're rushing to "officer in distress" calls. He also stated how frustrating his job was, and that that very morning, they had arrested a juvenile illegal alien gangbanger, whom had THREE ghost guns in his possession. They arrested him, and less than 2 hours later, juvenile detention released this criminal punk to the custody of his mother.
I personally shook this officer's hand, thanked him for his brave service, and told him that there are many Patriot's still living in this State, and that we will always have your (LEO's) back. I told him straight up: I don't have a CC permit, but that I always have a CC weapon in my vehicle for if ever SHTF situations, and that I was a veteran, law abiding citizen with criminal history, and my father was a LEO. He simply thanked me, and we both went about our day..... I for 1, deeply appreciate the thankless job that most of these LEO are doing; they're just trying to do their best, to keep the our law abiding citizen's in this FUBAR State, safe, and to make it back home to their families every single day. This LEO, is married, and the father of 2 very young children.....

You couldn't pay me enough $$$$, to be a law enforcement officer, in this lawless FUBAR State.

 

[Vlade]

I have no idea what "sash style" means

Deleted due to drunkenness at 1:25 p.m.

 

[KELAMA]

If the lawlessness in this State continues spiraling out of control, I'm going to have no choice, but to start carrying this Topps fixed blade on my belt.

 

[KELAMA]

Knife Rights has just filed a lawsuit challenging California’s switchblade ban. Hope that effort is a success.

Personally, I think they should save a lawsuit like that for one of the remaining states that ban possession outright.

You can actually own a switchblade over 2” in blade length privately in your place of residence in California. What isn’t allowed is carrying it on your person in public, storing it in your car, and selling, lending or giving it away to someone else.

I have to plead ignorance. I never knew that this part (bolded), was part of the auto/switchblade laws here in California. And now that I do know, I honestly don't care.

 

[Puppy'sPal]

Woah, woah, woah, the wording is so nuts in regards to this California law. Can't even store in one's car in one's own garage? What if it's a vintage switchblade stored in an old restored VW that always remains parked in the garage? Mind blowing.

Then you can't even put the knife in your pocket? Well, guess I can now be open to collecting 8 ounces and above given have to keep them on the dresser or display case.

What I'd really like to know is, and I've contacted a few DA's and lawyers but so far none have provided advice because they can't technically provide "legal counsel" regarding this issue. This issue is whether or not switchblades or OTF's can be used legally in self-defense situation on one's own property/premises?

Let's say hypothetical, you are hanging with the fam watching a movie and all of a sudden at 10:30pm at night a few loud knocks hit your door. You get up to see who it is at this hour and lo and behold 3 masked guys all decked out in gear want you to open your door. I'm no gun owner but often carry a good sized knife on me. Or, let's say you're watching tv and all of a sudden a ski-masked fellow barges in at 3pm and all you have is that legal but illegal auto in your pocket. If push came to shove, could you use this knife in self-defense to protect you or your family? I ask this because I'll often have an auto on me over a manual, however whenever out the house, will always choose the manual.

Anyone have background in prosecution or defense?

 

[Man with no name]

Woah, woah, woah, the wording is so nuts in regards to this California law. Can't even store in one's car in one's own garage? What if it's a vintage switchblade stored in an old restored VW that always remains parked in the garage? Mind blowing.

Then you can't even put the knife in your pocket? Well, guess I can now be open to collecting 8 ounces and above given have to keep them on the dresser or display case.

What I'd really like to know is, and I've contacted a few DA's and lawyers but so far none have provided advice because they can't technically provide "legal counsel" regarding this issue. This issue is whether or not switchblades or OTF's can be used legally in self-defense situation on one's own property/premises?

Let's say hypothetical, you are hanging with the fam watching a movie and all of a sudden at 10:30pm at night a few loud knocks hit your door. You get up to see who it is at this hour and lo and behold 3 masked guys all decked out in gear want you to open your door. I'm no gun owner but often carry a good sized knife on me. Or, let's say you're watching tv and all of a sudden a ski-masked fellow barges in at 3pm and all you have is that legal but illegal auto in your pocket. If push came to shove, could you use this knife in self-defense to protect you or your family? I ask this because I'll often have an auto on me over a manual, however whenever out the house, will always choose the manual.

Anyone have background in prosecution or defense?

akti.org/state-knife-laws/california/