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Bad I paid Schenk Knives $10,000... months later no knives, no refund

REK Knives

REK Knives

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Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
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Taking to a public platform isn't a decision I make lightly, but after months of unanswered questions and an unfulfilled contract, I feel compelled to share my experience with Schenk Knives. In this post and thread I desire for my comments to be respectful yet honest.

I would also like to add… Following Zane's disclosure of an extended family member's medical challenges in October, I've sought to exercise significant patience and understanding. However, this situation has inadvertently resulted in financial hardship for my family. Therefore, I respectfully request that he address my concerns promptly, with a refund being of primary importance. While prioritizing Zane's personal circumstances remains necessary, it shouldn't impede a fair and timely resolution.

As a full-time knife maker, integrity and reputation are everything to me and many of you know me and my work. I stand behind my word and my products even if I lose financially. This isn't about tearing Schenk Knives down, but about shedding light on what happened to my business and, hopefully, offer potential customers of Schenk Knives the information they need to make informed decisions before entrusting Schenk with their hard-earned money.

While I wouldn't dissuade anyone from seeking Schenk’s services, I urge extreme caution. Consider utilizing escrow services, delaying payment until completion (COD), or any measure that safeguards your investment. I don’t want anyone else to go through the experience I’ve had.

Ultimately, all I seek is a peaceful resolution. I would like Zane to do the right thing and either refund the money I paid or the product that money was for.

Note: I texted Zane a link to this thread so he can respond publicly if he so wishes.

Quick synopsis (updated 1/25/23):

Since some people who read this aren't familiar with me or my business, I will give a brief overview. I am a full time knife maker and have been since 2015. My business is owner operated (by me) with no employees. I contracted a company (Schenk Knives) to make a production batch of one of my fixed blade designs (250 fixed blade knives for me with my logo on them) - this was a turn key service with an estimated completion date of early October, 2023. I lined up dealers for the fall of 2023 release based upon estimated completion dates by Schenk. 50% of the batch price was due up front so I wired Schenk Knives $10,042.92 on 4/13. In the summer of 2023 the 'CEO' of the company (Zane Schenk) informed me that my knives were lost, then changed it to say they were delayed getting into production, only to again say they were indeed lost in November which was AFTER the expected completion date!

Initially Zane took ownership of the problem by admitting they had failed in multiple ways. It has now been approximately 10 months since I paid the money to Schenk Knives and I am out the product and my money. Zane quit responding to my inquiries in November after I demanded a refund... until I posted publicly about this on Bladeforums about a month ago. Since then he has stated that he will refund the money although I have yet to see even $1 to show that he's serious - all I have received so far is what seems to be empty promises. Initially Zane took responsiblity for their failures and said he was going to make things right but now he is putting everything in the "owner's" court and saying he can't make certain decisions (like refunding my money). However, when I request to speak to the 'owners' they won't contact me so I'm in a bind.

Losing around $10k and not having anything to show for it is a significant financial setback and I need the knife community's assistance in getting this information out to the public so this doesn't happen to anyone else. From reading Schenk Knives google reviews it appears as if I'm not the only one.
 
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More detailed synopsis:


In an on-going effort to continue to grow my business and meet demand I decided in the first quarter of this year to launch a production batch of one of my fixed blade knife designs. I had worked with Schenk Knives in the past and they had made a smaller batch for me (of about 30 knives) - but I only worked with the Machine Shop Operations Manager there (Dylan Tanner) and he was fantastic.


On 4/13/23 I wired $10,042.92 to Schenk Knives to launch the production batch with the understanding that the estimated completion date was roughly 5-6 months per Dylan and confirmed by Zane later. It was a turn-key operation where Schenk Knives was supposed to do everything and furnish me with a finished product (except for the final sharpening (which I requested to do and making the sheaths, which I was going to have another company make).


I only had contact with Dylan up through this point. But in July, when I requested an update, I was informed my batch was 'lost' and they were trying to locate it. 7/17 Dylan advised he was leaving Schenk Knives and put me in direct contact with the owner of Schenk Knives, Zane Schenk. (note, on paper the owner is still Norman F Schenk who I believe is Zane’s father but I don’t think he has worked there for years). On 7/24 Zane informed me that the batch had been delayed getting started and that the current estimated completion date was end of Sept. or early October.

Throughout the next month or two I repeatedly attempted to get specifics on where my batch was at in the production process but my questions remained unanswered.. On 9/1 I was told by the production supervisor (Matt) that my knives had just arrived at heat treat and should be done and on the way back to Schenk Knives within a couple of weeks. I patiently waited and on 9/27 I spoke with Zane who said they had not arrived back from Peter's Heat Treat yet. I work with Peter's all the time so I texted a picture of my knife design to my contact there (Brad - supervisor over all knife heat treatment) to see how much longer they would be - Brad responded that they had not seen my blades yet which was a major red flag.

In mid October I confronted Zane about the lack of communication and poor management of my batch to which he agreed and apologized saying that an employee or two had quit and he had parts all over the place (at different vendors) but stated that he still did not know where my knives were. He had informed all his vendors to send any boxes of unknown knives back to him so he can try to locate my batch (along with 3 others that were apparently lost). By 11/3 he still did not know where they were so I requested a full refund of all money I paid him. 11/6 he texted me and asked if we could have a phone conversation on the following day. On 11/7 he again apologized and said the last box of unknown knives were arriving the following day (from various vendors) and he would finally know one way or the other if mine were lost. I specifically asked him that if they were not in the box would he refund all money I had paid him to which he agreed that he would.

Throughout the next few days I attempted to find out if he had located them but I kept getting evasive answers. It wasn't until 11/14 that Zane texted me and informed me that he had personally checked and the knives were lost. I have been trying to get my money back since then to no avail and Zane has stopped communicating with me.
 
Timeline:
  • 4/13 I received an invoice from Schenk and wired around $10,042.92 to launch the batch of production Ember 2.5 fixed blade knives (pic)
  • 6/7 I asked Dylan how the batch was coming along and he stated that it was going well and that he thought they were at double disc at that time
  • 7/11 I was informed that my batch was basically lost, not sure where it was in the production process (pic)
  • 7/17 Dylan advised via text that Zane was aware of and working on finding my lost knives (pic) and also sent an email to me that he was leaving Schenk Knives and that his last day was 8/10. He informed me to contact either Zane or Matt if I need anything. (pic)
  • 7/24 Zane finally informed me (via email) that the batch was delayed getting started and the current estimated time to completion was end of Sept. or early October (pic). When I responded to the email to ask questions about where the knives were at in the process there was no response. (pic)
  • 8/9 I called and spoke to Zane on the phone to try to follow up on my questions. He still did not know where the blades were in the process but said he would track them down and figure out exactly where they were. Zane assured me he would follow up with Matt and then reach back out to me with the requested info but that never happened.
  • 8/23 I called and spoke again to Zane and he again did not know. He apologized saying that he “spaced out” and forgot to check on them but would check and send me an email within the hour - I got nothing.
  • 9/1 I called and spoke to Matt, still requesting to know exactly where the knives were at in the process. He stated (very confidently in my opinion) immediately that they were currently at heat treat. I asked how long they had been at heat treat and he informed me that they had arrived at heat treat on/around 8/30.
  • 9/27 I called and spoke to Matt to get a status update. He sounded unfamiliar with my knives and where they were at but went to check with Zane. After checking with Zane Matt stated that they had not gotten the knives back from Peters yet but as soon as they arrived they would get right on them.
  • 9/27 I texted Brad (at Peters) to see if they knew when my knives would ship out. He stated that they had not seen the blades yet. (pic 1, pic 2, pic 3)
  • 10/16 I emailed Zane confronting him about the lack of communication and still not knowing where my batch was, with 3 pointed questions. (pic)
  • 10/18 I received an email back from Zane agreeing that they had failed to provide accurate and timely updates - he stated he would dig into it and get back to me the next day. (pic)
  • 10/20 Zane emailed me again and informed me that he was still waiting on a phone call back from a few people to get me accurate information. (pic)
 
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Timeline Continued:
  • 10/31 I spoke to Zane on his cell phone about all my issues and wanting to know where the batch was. Main points of the conversation were:
    • He apologized for the lack of communication and informed me that an extended family member had some severe medical issues and he was the only family member in the area who could help deal with it.
    • My batch, along with 3 other people have been caught up in this mess.
    • Orders from Schenk to contractors were never shipped with Purchase Orders
    • He informed me that the people who had been in charge of the batches who worked at Schenk had almost treated the batches like a shotgun blast and one batch may be at multiple locations/contractors.
    • He thought my blades had only been laser cut and NOT heat treated. He also indicated that it was his employee’s fault as they had provided him bad info and ‘half truths’.
    • He was expecting a box the following Thursday (11/2) and he thought my lasered blanks would probably be in that package.
  • 11/3 (Friday) I texted him to see if the knives were in the package and he said he still had not seen them yet. I responded to that text and requested a full refund of all money paid by the following Monday (11/5). (pic 1, pic 2, pic 3)
  • 11/7 (Tues at ~5:40pm) I spoke with Zane over the phone. Main points of the conversation were:
    • Zane said he wanted to learn a little more about me and what my company was all about since he had not dealt with me up to the problematic point.
    • I gave him a summary of the above
    • He stated he was actively trying to solve the problem “he had been given”. There were “ a lot of problems with changes in personnel” that he was unaware of (did not explain what those were).
    • He said that he understood and can feel my pain about having taken a loan to pay for this batch and not having any product.
    • I explained to Zane that if I had $10k of someone’s money and I wasn’t sure where their stuff was then I would make it my problem and track it down and figure it out… but as it stands I felt like I had been given the runaround since July on where my batch was.
    • He stated that he was confident the knives had been laser cut (because he had a PO for it) but wasn’t sure what happened after that.
    • He agreed with me but stated that he wasn’t brought into this problem until “super late in the game” (even though he had been aware of the issue since July) and blamed the issue on employees while at the same time saying it was ultimately his fault and accepting responsibility.
    • I stated to him that I understood there could have been issues with employees leaving and not knowing exactly where things were for 1-1.5 months but 3 months after the fact, in my opinion, was unacceptable.
    • He informed me that the last box of 'unknown knives' was arriving the next day (wednesday) and he would finally know if my knives were in there or officially lost.
    • I asked him pointedly “If they are not in there…then you can wire back the money?” to which He agreed that he would refund my money.
  • 11/9 (Thursday) I texted Zane and asked if he had found my blades in yesterday's package. He responded that he hasn't 'gotten pictures' of my blades yet but asked his employees to send if they find them. (pic)
  • 11/10 (Friday) I texted Zane and asked him to let me know about the knives prior to going into the weekend. He stated that he would get back with me that afternoon after he looked over everything. I received no reply. (pic)
  • 11/14 (Tuesday) Zane texted me and informed me that he has personally looked through all the knives he has received and can not locate my blades (pic). I responded to that text requesting to know what his specific plan was to refund the money I had paid for the batch and that I needed to know by noon the next day and he said he would let me know. (pic)
  • 11/15 (Wednesday) after not receiving an answer by 12:00pm MST I sent a text to Zane informing him that he had until Friday 11/17 at the close of the day to have the money wired back to me and if he didn't comply then I was going to have to pursue litigation against his company and take further steps. (pic 1, pic 2, pic 3)
  • 11/21 I hired an attorney and a demand letter was sent. Schenk was given until 11/15 to respond but has not responded in any way.
  • 12/19 (when I posted this thread and send Zane a link in case he wanted to respond) - Zane called me and expressed that he WAS going to return the money and apologized again. He stated he was going to try to have it returned by Christmas but the goal was 30 days or less. So I decided to give 30 days before I pushed to social media.
  • 1/3 I asked for an update via text. Zane responded that he had a meeting with 'the owner' (singular) and they were working to have it resolved for me. I asked for clarification on the owner (if it was his father, Norman Schenk). Zane responded that his father was one owner but it wasn't just him (being vague) but clarified that he (Zane) didn't have any ownership in Schenk Knives - he is the CEO. Note that the ownership of the problem was being shifted to the owners of Schenk Knives. (pic 1, pic 2, pic 3)
  • 1/12 Based upon something I read about I asked if Zane would be willing to agree to a UCC-1 lien on Schenk Knives but again, he said he would have to ask the owners. I decided this route was not something I wanted to pursue though for various reasons. Due to the repeated mentioning of the 'owners' being the ones who call the shots I requested to be put in contact with them. (pic 1, pic 2)
  • 1/25 I pushed all of this information to social media platforms. Zane responded the next morning that nothing has changed and he was still planning on refunding my money.
    • He said he would be happy to send some $$ as a sign of good faith (pic)
    • His father wasn't in a good position medically to speak to people but he would ask him to call me (pic)
    • I confronted him about him saying it WASN'T just his father who was the owner and he agreed that he did say that and his father wasn't involved in the daily decisions of Schenk.
    • I asked for clarification (see here) with no response
 
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Wow, sorry to hear that Josh. Hope you get a satisfactory resolution!
 
Not good. Not good at all. I hope your attorney can hold their feet to the fire and get complete restitution and appropriate damages on your behalf.
I know how much you were looking forward to this project coming to fruition.
 
Update: right after I texted Zane a link to this thread he called me and we had a phone conversation. He was very apologetic and assured me that he would get me the money and stated that he is actively working on it. I would absolutely love to post a peaceful happy resolution to this thread so I will be updating it as things progress 👍
 
I'm sorry to see all the troubles you've been dealing with Josh. I understand it's not the desired path, but I hope the attorney can get this resolved for you soon. I'd say you've been extremely patient through all of it.
 
I was hoping this would turn out differently. There is still time for Zane to make this right…come on Zane.
 
Hoping for the best resolution possible for you Josh.
You’re a pleasure to deal with and don’t deserve this.
 
Completely unacceptable. He (like most people) could probably get a $10,000 loan in about 10 minutes online. If he doesn't have the money to refund you immediately he should immediately get a loan in order to do so.
 
brancron said:
Completely unacceptable. He (like most people) could probably get a $10,000 loan in about 10 minutes online. If he doesn't have the money to refund you immediately he should immediately get a loan in order to do so.
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Anybody that can't scratch a check for 10K has no business operating in the orbits in play here. In my opinion, which is worth what you paid for it.
 
At this point, I would have a difficult time believing anything that this Zane character has to say. I hope that your attorney can motivate him to release your money. If internet searches start to alert buyers to this thread, the negative impact on his company may wind up costing him more than the $10k.
 
One thing I was wondering, were you planning on making it clear to customers that these were knives designed by you, not made by you?
 
Triton said:
One thing I was wondering, were you planning on making it clear to customers that these were knives designed by you, not made by you?
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If you knew Josh, you would know the answer to this. :) Josh’s character is impeccable. I’ll let him answer the question though. :)

If you ever get a chance to own any of Josh’s work, you will be wow’d. I promise you that.

Happy Holidays.
 
Sharp & Fiery said:
If you knew Josh, you would know the answer to this. :) Josh’s character is impeccable. I’ll let him answer the question though. :)

If you ever get a chance to own any of Josh’s work, you will be wow’d. I promise you that
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Good deal. I don't know him and was truly just asking a question. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you and yours.
 
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