Small Knife v. Big Knife - for Survival

Status
Not open for further replies.
Pahtoocara

Pahtoocara

Joined
Feb 9, 2006
Messages
2,192
I have only dabbled in this wilderness survival area so I can't speak to much about it BUT, I have some questions about knives for all the wilderness survivalists out there.

What knife would you use more in a survival situation? A small knife (under 5-6") or a big knife (over 6")? I have heard that the smaller knife is more useful to the survivalist because it is more versatile while the big knife is usually only good for chopping (ie creating shelter, firewood, etc).

If you where stuck with only one knife, what knife would it be? The small or the big? What type of knife? Or, would you go with a small knife and a dedicated chopper such as a hatchet?
 
I guess if I had to play that game of the one knife only, I'd want my 12 inch Ontario machete. With it I can make a shelter faster, split wood, and it can still cut. A big blade can do the small jobs if a bit awkward, but no way a small knife can do the big job. Sure you can batton a mora to down a sapling, but its just a chop or two with a sharp machete. And shelter is only equel to fire in survival. With a large blade for choping, and some strike anywhere matches, you should be able to get by.

When they did the study of how to outfit the space capsles in case it came down anywhere, the survival cutting tools were a Case 12 inch machete and a scout knife, pocket type.

Machete and pocket knife covers all the bases.
 
I use a 4" fixed blade and a small axe when i hike in the woods. In a survival situation if the rule of the game is "one knife", i would choose a 7" blade. Not as good chopper as an axe, not as handy as a small blade but it would do the job.

dantzk.
 
1823339smchamorroknifewstamp.jpg


Picture: excellent chamorro knife - made c. WWII and heavily used.

Native people who actually live in under developed areas tend to favor large bolos or machetes. If you are going to go primitive, you have best do the same, and go with what works.

n2s
 
You should learn to do anything that needs to be done with the smallest blade you carry. Chances are that is the one you will have on you when something goes bad.

However, to answer your specific question, there is no perfect size. Everyone has different preferences on what they will carry and you will find some will favor under 4 inch knives and some will favor anything over 10 inches. Most people are somewhere in between. Then you have the Hatchet, machete, and Khukuri crowd as well with good arguments.

Whatever it is you decide to carry, become proficient with it, learn it's limits and learn them well. Having a big beautiful safequeen is worthless in the real world.

If you always carry a SAK and save your leatherman for the trips, you have to realize that they have different tools associated with them. Similarly, if you carry a Trailmaster, but go out with a Master Hunter you may not be able to utilize it to it's full capabilities. Whatever it is you get know what you can do with it.
 
Something like the Ontario Rat7 seems like an ideal compromise to me. Heavy, thick 6.5" blade for effective chopping while still small enough (and even better with the big choil) for the light work.
 
I love my RAT7, its a great inbetween knife, but not heavy enough for choping. I usually carry that and a small folder. Sometimes if I know I will be doing a good deal of copping I take my gerber hatchet and a knife.
Wade
 
it also depends on where you are going, in the large forests of north america a lot of folks through the years have come to think of an axe as a necessity. in the jungles of central and south america a machete is the tool to survive with. i dont really think there is "one best answer" the situations terrains, user familiarity also come into play.

that said if i had to take one knife i would select my armaggedon by trace rinaldi, great chopper and takes a pretty good edge, has the double choils that let you choke up for control or back up on the handle for power. will do the work of a machete and does have a more controlled cutting ability.

the knife i am most likely to have in my pocket is the one handed trekker SAK, and given that it has a saw i will get by with it by adapting to the abilities of the knife.

when i am hunting, i will have a knives of alaska brown bear combo in my pack and a wyoming saw, sometimes a GB hunters axe. these would be the tools that i usually take on a hunting trip to cold climates. for africa i carry a 6" knife, like the puma white hunter, and my leatherman or one handed trekker.

alex
 
Pahtoocara said:
... the big knife is usually only good for chopping (ie creating shelter, firewood, etc).
Click to expand...

This is usually argued by people who have used poor cutting larger blades, handle a large blade by someone like Ray Kirk, the cutting ability and general versatility is in general extremely high. Just take a look at what the guys in cutting competitions can do with their large blades.

In terms of more "native" blade use, Ray Mears has a bushcraft series where he goes around to various locations, the use of long blades by locals is very common, they range from machetes to parangs, goloks and barongs. They use the large blades for both heavy chopping and precision shaping.

Which knife would be more useful in general depends on what else you have, your skill level with the knife, and the enviroment and then you would have to factor in other conditions like possible injury (much more likely to not be able to use a 3 foot parangs vs a 4" Mora) or having to depend on others and loan out your blade.

If I was picking blind which is a silly senario (who picks boots like that for example) I'd likely go with a forged blade from Kevin Cashen with a double length dual dropped grip, 14" blade, about 2" wide out of 3/8" stock with a heavy fuller, L6 in bainite and have Chas Clements make a nice heavy duty/layered sheath.

In addition to what Cobalt noted, I would suggest becoming familiar with blades you have little to no respect/use for, it might not be you after all who actually packed the cutlery and if you have to use a 420 fantasy bowie it would be useful to know how to do so without mangling it which means you can't use it like you would a Becker CU/7.

-Cliff
 
I love the 7" blade for an all rounder and the SR camp tramp in particular. This is my favorite do it all knife. This knife goes just about everywhere in my day pack and will ride comfortably on my belt all day long.
 
I've always liked the smaller blades myself because that's what's on my my person at all times, therefore, if something goes wrong I've got in hand what I'm used to useing daily. I've also never been in a situation where I said "geeze, I wish I had a bigger knife". Also with a shorter knife the work of making traps,snares,cordage, and other small chores is made easier with the tip of the blade closer to my hand. Chip carvers are very short. I know that alot of emphasis is place on splitting in this forum, but I for one have never need to do much of that. It seems too that as folks age the size of thier knife decreses.:D Splitting wood means that it is to large in diameter and I wonder how you get it into short chunks in the first place. Realisticlly carrying a whopper of a knife doesn't make sense for me, but then I don't live in a rain forest either.
 
Actually I believe a more common reason for splitting wood (alteast in my experience) is because it's wet ans you need to get to the dry core to get it to burn. Of course having said that I usually only have to do this with small diameter wood (which only requires a small (4") blade). Once I have a small and steady fire going I can usually dry out the larger stuff with the fire itself.
 
Brian6244 said:
Actually I believe a more common reason for splitting wood (alteast in my experience) is because it's wet ans you need to get to the dry core to get it to burn. Of course having said that I usually only have to do this with small diameter wood (which only requires a small (4") blade). Once I have a small and steady fire going I can usually dry out the larger stuff with the fire itself.
Click to expand...
That too has been my experience and I can usually get to the core by breaking the smaller stuff by hand; no batoning nessessary.
 
Pahtoocara said:
What knife would you use more in a survival situation? A small knife (under 5-6") or a big knife (over 6")? I have heard that the smaller knife is more useful to the survivalist because it is more versatile while the big knife is usually only good for chopping (ie creating shelter, firewood, etc).

If you where stuck with only one knife, what knife would it be? The small or the big? What type of knife? Or, would you go with a small knife and a dedicated chopper such as a hatchet?
Click to expand...

Pahtoocara,

Welcome to the forum!

Everyone has to answer this question for themselves. The best way to make this decision is personal experimentation. However, since you posted the ? I'll pitch my $.02 in.

In a true survival situation, I was not well rested, hungry, and not very healthy at the moment I realized I needed to do something. I was growing very weak and needed to build shelter quickly as darkness fell and temps dropped. My first priority was shelter (fire would come later as a close second). In a weakened state every effort had to be maximized to efficiently use my remaining energy. Long story short, my big knife allowed every swing to drive deeply into the wood I needed for shelter. Precious energy must be conserved when don't have much left. My big knife makes shelter easier on me. It makes fire easier, whether its making a fire or building my pyre. That could translate into making water and food easier by having the fire purify/cook it. So, I depend on my big knife. There is a fine line of too big, that is purely personal preference, dictated by many things such environment.

Now, while I agree a big knife can do most everything a small knife can do, but efficiency/energy influences the decision again. My big knife can do many small tasks, but I may expend large amounts of energy doing so. A small knife has its place in the intricate detail work so often needed around camp. It is light and comfortable for long hours of carving/wittling chores.

I carry a two knife set (pic links below). They are both in the same sheath and always with me. Whatever the circumstance, I have a head start in putting the odds in my favor. ;) :D

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e219/spiritbow/Knives/Pathfinderset.jpg

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e219/spiritbow/Knives/Pathfindersheathedfront.jpg

My decision is based personal survival experience. Simulate a true survival circumstance, as best you can, and what you need may over-shadow what you want. Some people do not function well having gone without food (some sugar thing, I think). While others, are hardly aware of the inconvenience. Under a controlled environment simulate no food, possiblity of injury, frustration, anger,etc. Then practice what you must do to deal with it. My big knife - wouldn't leave home without it. :D

Hope this helps!
 
so far ive been extremely pleased with the performance in both of my knives , a becker c/u 7 and a ranger rd 7 . i find that 7-8 inch blades work pretty well if they are ground right . for instance a flat ground ,thinner edged knife will perform better in wood work like fire building /shelter versus a hollow ground beefy tactical knife imho. ideally , iwant my knife to have enough heft to cut deep in chopping but not be so thin that it binds in the wood . overall i like to look at grinds, blade thickness, and last but not least blade material. then i start desciding btween the 7 or 8 inch or whatever size blade . i guess im an 'in between ' kinda guy. try chopping through a 2/4 with a ka-bar and then try it with a becker 7 or similar.
 
4" utility for me and a folding saw, I too havent seen the need, or rather my environment does not require me to have a long blade.

If I was going into the woods for a long time I would take a limbing axe in addition to the two items above.
 
When I run my wilderness 101 course I give each of the guys a 14 - 16 inch Tramontina and a Mora SWAK. So far I haven't run into a situation that these two won't handle.

vayy0747xr.jpg


Total cost on this combo was about $25.

rvasvitimas3iz.jpg


I want them to get practical experience with both the machete and small blade. I teach them how to do the large knife tasks with the Mora and the small knife tasks with the machete. It quickly becomes apparent why you carry both. As long as you keep the weight down this is not a problem.

IMO the artificial limits we place on blade selection are sort of silly. OK you are all by yourself and the nukes took your house and now it's nuclear winter and... The real world involves people planning with other people to do things in the wilderness for a limited period 99% of the time. If you have a few people in the group you can carry whatever you need. Mac
 
Awesome. Thanks everyone for the input.

My only real experience is in camping, and I wouldn't call it survival camping. I was having a discussion with a friend who brought up this issue of one knife to have for all occassions. He chose the smaller knife. I see the position of both sides but still need to experiment more myself. He has much more experience in the survival area than I do, so I respect his opinion. However, I was watching a Ron Hood video and he used the Battle Mistress by Busse. So, I guess the answer is whatever you are comfortable with.

I do use a quality Nepalese Khukuri or a CS Trailmaster in tandem with a smaller knife when I camp. Prior to that I really liked the KABAR but found that it was only OK for tent stakes and prying actually bent the blade slightly at the tang.
 
I have often thought about how prepared I may be in a given survival situation and ideally I agree with Mac but may not be ideally prepared.
I have my favourite 8" hunting blade (aitor) but have accepted the fact that all I might have on me is my keys with a leatherman micra and 1" magnesium rod with bic lighter flints glued to it.
Honing my flintknapping skills has jacked my confidence tho.
 
pict said:
The real world involves people planning with other people to do things in the wilderness for a limited period 99% of the time. If you have a few people in the group you can carry whatever you need. Mac
Click to expand...

In the real world I do this by my self:D
I don't need a TEAM:)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top