Chakmaks and flint striking

J W Bensinger

J W Bensinger

Joined
Mar 26, 2009
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I've been using the chakmak I made from O-1 as a flint striker with quartz, char cloth and tinder for firemaking for a bit now-but none of the ones that came with any khukuri in my collection-from any time period or maker-will throw a spark. Anybody have one that will?
Not a criticism-it's not like that's a common usage these days-just wondered.
It's very satisfying when you get the hang of it.
 
Yes it is very satisfying throwing a spark into a piece of Cedar fluff. Ive been flint knapping for about a month now and found that you dont even need steel to get a barrage of sparks. I use flint and a piece of quartz crystal prevalent everywhere around here. I found this out accidentally when abrading the edge of a piece of flint preparing it for taking chips. The only problem with this is you cant throw the sparks very far. Ill try some chakmas and see if I can get some results. Ive often wondered that myself.
I tried two different Chakmas and one performed wonderfully and the other you would be hard pressed to light up anything other than a piece of char cloth. The chakma that didnt work so well was not as hard near the tip as it was at the handle (file test) so im thinking it may have not been as hard as the other. The other chakma was hard from handle to tip. Could be the steel variances in composition from one vehicle to another as well as variances in hardness? Who knows? Ill upload a video shortly so you can see for yourself. I didnt light up anything because I was in the house but I think the density of sparks should speak loudly. Try some more Chakmas Jim. Ill try some more as well and see if I just got lucky on one.
 
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"The sharp edge of the flint is used to strike the fire steel at an acute angle. With practice, small pieces of steel are shaved off the fire steel. The friction of shaving the steel off the fire steel and the pyrophoricity of the steel heats the pieces to a molten state." Catch such sparks in water, and you will see that they are teardrop-shaped.

If the fire steel is too soft, you will not get sparks from striking it with flint. It has to be "knife hard."
 
Sparks flying. One chak is from a 25" Tirtha Sirupati about a 2012. The other is about the same era from a 20" Lachhu AK.

[video=youtube;1YBlzerJPK0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YBlzerJPK0[/video]
 
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I have always looked at it primarily as a burnishing tool....the plain ones simply glued into handles could be removed and hardened with Casenit as done commonly on frizzens and then reinstalled in handle as a striker....

We do not have naturally ocurring flint anywhere around here and ordering flints is not very primitive....so normally use a military Scandinavian firesteel and dryer lint....
 
Kamidog, The stone you are using is called Chert. An extremely common stone here in Corn Patch. With heat treating it will make decent arrow heads. You should try kapok if you want to see a fire go on the 1st spark. It does not accept water and thats why they put it in live vests....and it burns like crazy. The Thais export it as fire starter tinder for buckskinners. I use it as filler for my Martini-Henry cartridges.
 
For something than burns like crazy (never tried it), it sure compacts into unburned melted wads found downrange in my 38-55 loads...strange...

Edited in PS....my mistake....was thinking of my polyester filler....
 
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Bookie said:
Kamidog, The stone you are using is called Chert. An extremely common stone here in Corn Patch. With heat treating it will make decent arrow heads. You should try kapok if you want to see a fire go on the 1st spark. It does not accept water and thats why they put it in live vests....and it burns like crazy. The Thais export it as fire starter tinder for buckskinners. I use it as filler for my Martini-Henry cartridges.
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Your right Doc. Im a degreed geologist and my major was mineralogy. I know rocks like you know steel. Until I started knapping i pretty much ignored the chert and considered it as trash or leaverite (leave her right there). The chert found here is really sought after stuff all over the country for knapping but the grade varies considerably. Many people heat treat it but I havent tried that yet. There are many inclusions in some of it and some are very grainy quartzite like and some are like glass almost obsidian like. In the last month Ive knapped about 200 pounds of the stuff so im getting intimately familiar with the local stuff. I have already made some tools, celt, and axeheads with it and a few arrowheads and it is fine stuff. I will try heat treating it and see how it works out. Thanks for that info! Ive read they do it about 450 degrees ramp up and down very slowly for at least five hours or so.
So Kapoc is a tinder? Type of tree? I looked it up but didnt find much. Is it like pine knot (fat pine)? I use finely shaved pine knot mixed with palm shredded cedar bark if the cedar is dry. The pine knot is waterproof and will dang near burn underwater. The cedar takes a spark better so I mix them. Cedar bark makes great cordage and is bug resistant as well so its good all around stuff to keep in a BOB. Where do you get the Kapoc? Thanks doc. Good to hear from ya! Oh and if you still have a pic of that stone axe head id sure like to see a pic of it. I cant find where you posted it last time. I have a special interest in them about now. Ill show ya why later.

I carved out a piece of fire for my baby today. I think she likes it:rolleyes: Still needs some finish work but basically done.

dee9c5dc97b591422cca3f570bf6c612


Cool thread Jim. Sorry dont want to hijack it but I love primitive tools, technology, and fire making in particular. Hard for me to shut up:D
 
mtngunr said:
I have always looked at it primarily as a burnishing tool....the plain ones simply glued into handles could be removed and hardened with Casenit as done commonly on frizzens and then reinstalled in handle as a striker....

We do not have naturally ocurring flint anywhere around here and ordering flints is not very primitive....so normally use a military Scandinavian firesteel and dryer lint....
Click to expand...
Quartz works really well, and is all over New England. Including the dirt road I live on.
 
ndoghouse said:
Your right Doc. Im a degreed geologist and my major was mineralogy. I know rocks like you know steel. Until I started knapping i pretty much ignored the chert and considered it as trash or leaverite (leave her right there). The chert found here is really sought after stuff all over the country for knapping but the grade varies considerably. Many people heat treat it but I havent tried that yet. There are many inclusions in some of it and some are very grainy quartzite like and some are like glass almost obsidian like. In the last month Ive knapped about 200 pounds of the stuff so im getting intimately familiar with the local stuff. I have already made some tools, celt, and axeheads with it and a few arrowheads and it is fine stuff. I will try heat treating it and see how it works out. Thanks for that info! Ive read they do it about 450 degrees ramp up and down very slowly for at least five hours or so.
So Kapoc is a tinder? Type of tree? I looked it up but didnt find much. Is it like pine knot (fat pine)? I use finely shaved pine knot mixed with palm shredded cedar bark if the cedar is dry. The pine knot is waterproof and will dang near burn underwater. The cedar takes a spark better so I mix them. Cedar bark makes great cordage and is bug resistant as well so its good all around stuff to keep in a BOB. Where do you get the Kapoc? Thanks doc. Good to hear from ya! Oh and if you still have a pic of that stone axe head id sure like to see a pic of it. I cant find where you posted it last time. I have a special interest in them about now. Ill show ya why later.

I carved out a piece of fire for my baby today. I think she likes it:rolleyes: Still needs some finish work but basically done.

dee9c5dc97b591422cca3f570bf6c612


Cool thread Jim. Sorry dont want to hijack it but I love primitive tools, technology, and fire making in particular. Hard for me to shut up:D
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Hijack away Ndog! Very cool.
Sisal twine picked apart makes very good tinder, and if you leave it in a long length cordage too.
I use that, charcloth and quartz with whichever of the chakmaks I made that I can find lol-they're small and forge scale finished, so they disappear pretty readily...
 
Char cloth is the best! Its almost so good I consider it cheetin:D not really tho. Its the best by a longshot. One minute spark into it and you got fire. I use it in fire pistons and it is almost 100% even in the rain. Fire piston is my favorite way of making fire but flint and steel is just as good if you have pine knot or something that will ignite in high humidity but you have to catch a spark that will grow. All these methods are glorified by hollywood but unless you have tried them and realize how hard it is to do in humid conditions etc then all is a pipe dream. Google don't make it happen. You have to put your hands on it and do it over and over and over again and again in all conditions. Same applies with bow drill and other methods. If anyone is interested i can make and post more videos here in time. Fire is my thang no mater what:D
Jim, Do you have good results with your own chakma's? I first thought that the steel must be like over 1.0 in carbon content (files etc.) to make a good spark but when you posted this I tried 5160 and it sparked off wonderfully on one chakma so I know it will work. I will now try to harden some 1084 and 1095 and see if it does the same. Seems it is more of a hardening issue than a carbon content unlike I thought before.
 
5160, 1095, 1084-all work nicely. I used O-1 for most of the ones I've made, and just tempered it enough so It doesn't explode. One side with a 90 degree "spine", one with a rounded burnishing edge is what I've been doing.
I've tried to reharden a couple of Nepalese made chakmaks and stick them back in the handles, but I think the ones I tried were actually 1018 (they weren't HI's-haven't tried an HI yet.)
 
Old khuks I bought have pockets for the flint and tinder. Two had a piece of "flint" and the remains of tinder - hairy stuff. On a number, you can see chip marks on the chakmaks.
 
Kamidog, I found it under that last VooDoo doll I made of you. Here you are:
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P.S., Since you're a geo-nut, find me some iron pyrite for my wheellock.
 
Bookie said:
Kamidog, I found it under that last VooDoo doll I made of you. Here you are:
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What voodoo doll:eek:. I thought you lost that one?
Man that's a nice one. The groove is still pristine. Theres quite a bit of work that goes into making some of them depending on the shape they start with. Some peck at them for hours or days to get them to the shape they want then they grind them. Cool stuff. I think i was born way too late:D


Bookie said:
P.S., Since you're a geo-nut, find me some iron pyrite for my wheellock.
Click to expand...
How much do you need? I know i have some very pure stuff in my collection. They are perfectly formed cubes about the size of dice. Id say 1/2" to 3/4" cubes. Do you use it to spark on flint instead of hardened steel? Pls pardon my bangstick ignorance.

J W Bensinger said:
...
I've tried to reharden a couple of Nepalese made chakmaks and stick them back in the handles, but I think the ones I tried were actually 1018 (they weren't HI's-haven't tried an HI yet.)
Click to expand...

I may try that with the chakma that didnt spark and see what happens. Im thinking theres probably not enough carbon in 5160 to worry about the shattering. Do you think tempering is necessary?
I have noticed they use files occasionally for the chakmas and Kardas which is good for higher carbon. I have a few that have remnant marks like the Reti knives. Guess it doesnt matter much knowing that 5160 will spark off and its lower than the 10 series stuff.

Ha! Yep I have a driveway full of chert as well. They use ground up limestone (caliche they call it) but it is about half ground up chert nodules as well. Theres dump truck loads of softball size nodule in the ditches at the street they use for erosion control.

Anybody want chert for firemaking let me know. If its rare stuff in your parts ill send ya some.
 
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