Paper wheel problem?!

richard j said:
mike, i think he needs to change how he is sharpening on the wheels by going from sharpening in the front to how i sharpen so he can watch whats going on with his edge. i sent him some vids to watch that might help. i have knives that took a lot of sharpenings on the wheels and have a lot of life left in them.
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The way you sharpen (and your experience doing it) allows you to create the smallest burr needed to do the job, since you instantly see the burr forming. If you are using the wheels and look straight down at the knife with the edge away from you it is likely you will end up with a huge tin foil burr and wasting a lot of steel (I've had that happen before). That is why I am going to get a full face mask and try out your method to see if I can't get better results (I'm sure I will) and waste less steel.

Mike
 
i keep telling everyone to sharpen this way because of that very reason. not only does it allow you to see the burr form you can keep the blade against the wheel a lot better when you can see whats going on.
 
if i'm asked to change the grind of a knife and its going to take life from a blade i'll let the person know there might be an option to this. a while back i sharpened an emerson chisel grind to a v edge for a member. the factory edge was really wide compared to what i put on the other side. i could have resharpened the knife so both sides matched but it would have taken too much life from the blade. other than a cosmetic difference the knife was sharp and after a few sharpenings the edges would have evened out.
 
richard j said:
i keep telling everyone to sharpen this way because of that very reason. not only does it allow you to see the burr form you can keep the blade against the wheel a lot better when you can see whats going on.
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Copying your way of using the wheels I would say made the learning curve so much shorter for me. It really came down to being able to see the edge of the knife and what exactly is going on with it while its in contact with the wheels. After one hacksaw blade and 4-5 cheap knives repeatedly redone I'm putting edges that look better and are sharper than most factory knives I've ever come across. It really is ridiculous how good they are.

In regards to blade life, I took some of those cheap knives and intentionally ground 'em hard and long to see exactly how much steel I could take off in a given time as well as how hot I could get a knife. The wheels can take a fair amount of steel off, but it requires much more effort and time than one would suspect. It didn't take me long to realize my concerns over blade life were unfounded when I was using the right pressure and drag time across the surface. I can't imagine having to go 15 passes on a knife to get an edge back, that sounds excessive to me.

I have no problem putting anything across my wheels with fear of removing too much steel, even with what many consider to be too high of an rpm on my grinder.

Thanks again Richard.
 
normally with just a slightly dull blade i can work up a burr with just a pass on each side and sometimes 2 per side depending on the steel. nicks and dings of course take a few more passes. some burrs i work up can hardly be seen.
 
I would think there is a technique problem here. Perhaps using a vernier caliper and doing some testing by sharpening identical junk and measuring at the same spots would optimize material loss.
 
Thanks for all the replies. I spoke with Richard and I'm going to try his way but haven't been home much to try.

But as I hinted at before, I rarely work up a burr. I equated this to lost metal. I use the polishing wheel for most of my sharpening which does not raise a burr. This might be my problem because the blade may spend too much time being polished when a couple passes on the grit wheel would mean the blade spends a lot less time on the wheels.

However I am surprised that the polishing wheel with such a mild abrasive would take off so much metal. I assumed I was taking off next to nothing and this is not the case.

I will still try to get some pictures showing the metal loss.

Thanks again!

Ryan
 
15 passes seems way excessive. I have never done more than 4 per side on grit wheel and 2 buffing passes, even if I am changing bevel angle. I can usually do 2 grit passes to form a bevel, then the same to the other side, then 2 on buffer on each side and I am done. I do not remove that much metal. My wheels spin at 3250, which is really fast, I wish I could spin at 1750 instead. Maybe I will get a different motor one day. All I know is that my edges are sharper than ever, because as Richard J says, is time important to you? Well, yes, I want to have my knives sharp, and with the wheels, I can do it quite efficiently. I will get a hand set up also, I want to become proficient for when the end of the world starts, and we no longer have electricity. I AM JUST KIDDING!
 
So everytime you guys have a knife that is still sharp but won't shave you stick it on the grit wheel?

I guess I didn't see the need to raise a burr when the knife is still sharp so I use the polishing wheel. And if an edge needs a little more work I guess I didn't think 15 passes was that much when I wasn't using the aggressive grit wheel.

I guess I just assumed the polishing wheel was just polishing and refining the edge and not removing much material.

I guess my assumptions were wrong?
 
i look directly down on the edge in good light and see how much shine it has from the burr. if its a lot i work up a burr and if not i'll buff the edge. this is for my knives and any that are sent to me get a burr worked up but only whats needed to get a sharp edge. for an example i cut the finger off of a kevlar glove with the knife i made for jtr357 testing the edge. the edge was still sharp enough to hurt you but there was a tiny line of shine on the edge. i gave the blade 2 passes each on both sides and it was back to paper slicing sharp again. i did work up another burr before i sent the knife to him just to make sure it had a good edge.
 
Richard,


When you say two passes each, do you mean you run it on the same side twice then switch to the other side and run it twice?

Or, do you mean you run it once on a side and flip it over and run it once on the other side then repeat?


I ask because I want to know which is most effective.

Thanks.
 
i only make 1 pass and then flip to the other side and repeat if needed until the edge is sharp again. after 1 pass the burr is usually on the top side so 2 passes on the same side is a waste unless you still see a burr on the side you just done.
 
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