Tourniquets - Looking for Comments

H

Hazardous

Joined
Nov 27, 1999
Messages
42
I started carrying a meter long piece of thin surgical tubing in my backpacking/hunting/survival first aid kit recently to act as a tourniquet should the need arise. I began this practice after my usual partner on outdoor excursions began taking blood thinning drugs due to a heart condition. According to him, he can "bleed out" in a matter of minutes if he gets a big vessel cut because his blood does not coagulate. I also think the tubing could be used to hold splinting materials if wound around tightly, or to secure a pressure bandage if wound loosely.

Now, I am aware of the danger of tourniquets. The last thing I want to do is induce gangrene. It just seems that in a severe injury situation, it's better to have one than not. I also think the tubing is better than using your belt or some other improvised material because of the versatility I mentioned above.

I'm interested in comments from you more experienced folks on this subject.
 
I don't know that I particularly qualify as more experienced, but knowing how to make a tourniquet is a good thing, practicing it is not...
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Life or limb, that's all I can say. If you've tried everything else, and the bleeding won't stop, put a tourniquet on. And if thee's not currently an ambulance on the way, kiss that limb goodbye. And never take the tourniquet off, that's a job for the docs your rescuers take you to.

Just for the trivia part, you too can bleed to death in mere seconds if you cut the artery in your thigh, and much quicker if you hit the jugular. Better practice your speed-tying skills...
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Stryver

 
I agree with Stryver, that is a LAST resort. And if you make it you better make it with the knowledge you have a very good chance at losing the limb you use it on. Only for use if the alternative is death.

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Lee

LIfe is too important to be taken seriously. Oscar Wilde
 
Hi everyone,

almost ALL (if not all) bleeding can be stopped with direct pressure (to include pressure dressings), elevation above the heart, and pressure points. In fact almost all bleeding can be stopped with 10 minutes of direct pressure... unfortunately, most people think ten minutes is two

I have worked many ER's and everytime someone comes rushing in with a "I have a really bad cut and we can't get it to stop bleeding"... Guess what... after 10 minutes of direct pressure, etc... it always stops.

Next issue. If you do apply one (you shouldn't ever need to) than do not use tubbing. To much tissue damage. Use something that provides at least a 2 inch wide band around the area and place it several inches above the site.

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Greg Davenport
http://www.ssurvival.com
Are You Ready For The Challenge?
Are You Ready To Learn The Art Of Wilderness Survival?

 
Using a tourniquet in a serious limb injury is compulsory, otherwise you can bleed to death. you can not take into acount the neck artery, because this kind of injury causes almost instant death or at least brain damage.
The most serious injury is the thigh artery. or the upper arm one. The body can be drained uot of blood in a couple of minutes. this is why you must act rapidly. If you are not ready with the tourniquet, you must place something solid, the size of a chestnut in your inguinal zone (armpit respectively) and pull the knee (arm) towards the chest to reduce the bleeding.
The tourniquet you aply must be removed every 2 hours for 3-5 minutes to prevent the limb tissues necrosys. Do not be afraid to remove it, because there is enough time (2 hours) for the organism to mobilize the blood from the internal organs. The tourniquet does not need to be sterile, because it is not to be applied on the wound. After aplying it, the wound can be cleaned (rinsed with water, if you do not have something else).
You can use anything as a tourniquet as long as it provides a good tightness.
You can also carry some "fibrinogen" (I don't know the english term for that) sponges, which can be aplied right into the wound and reduces the bleeding almost instantly. I think you can find it in a drug-store.
As for myself, I carry an "Aitor Jungle King I" survival knife every time I go out in the wilderness. It has a survival kit provided with two latex tubes which can be used as a tourniquet, or to make a slingshot.
Hope you'll find the information usefull.


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Radu Costache

 
As always, information is mixed about critical procedures. A lot of this reminds me of snake bite threads.

According to the National Safety Council and Wilderness Medical Society, tournequits, once applied, should NOT be released except by primary caregivers.

Tournequits do have there place where pressure may not be feasible. If there are multiple accident victims such as a wreck, and only one person able to administer first aid, tournequit's may be necessary to control severe bleeeding in more than one victim.

If you are a first responder to an accident and decide that a tournequit is needed to save a life, then ALWAYS write the letter 'T' and the time the tournequit was placed on the victim. This writing should be on the victim's forehead in large enough letters that primary rescue personnel will recognize it. The time stamp gives the primary care givers time data as to whether the limb can possibly be saved. This also assures that no tournequit is looked over by primary care givers.

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Randall's Adventure & Training
jeff@jungletraining.com

 
First of all, Greg is absolutely right.

Second, someone really should put together a Wilderness Care FAQ, since certain questions seem to get raised again and again, both here and in other wilderness forums, such as Doc Ron's and Jeff's. In order of frequency, these seem to be

(1) Sutures
(2) Tourniquets
(3) Snakebite remedies
(4) Maggots.

One is left to wonder why these questions are so frequently asked, since the problems they relate to are relatively rare. I guess the *frequent* wilderness problems -- diarrhea, constipation, blisters, sprains, insect stings -- are things everyone already knows how to handle.
 
Originally posted by Walks Slowly:
someone really should put together a Wilderness Care FAQ, since certain questions seem to get raised again and again, both here and in other wilderness forums. In order of frequency, these seem to be

(1) Sutures
(2) Tourniquets
(3) Snakebite remedies
(4) Maggots.

One is left to wonder why these questions are so frequently asked, since the problems they relate to are relatively rare. I guess the *frequent* wilderness problems -- diarrhea, constipation, blisters, sprains, insect stings -- are things everyone already knows how to handle.
Click to expand...

Good point and I agree 100%. Just in case anyone is interested in a source that covers these issues...check out my book "Wilderness Survival"... read the chapter on Health issues.
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Greg Davenport
http://www.ssurvival.com
Are You Ready For The Challenge?
Are You Ready To Learn The Art Of Wilderness Survival?

 
I went to Mr. Davenport's site and checked on his qualifications. His qualifications are acceptable to me.

His advice about tourniquets and bleeding is absolutely correct.

People on anticoagulants have only a slightly impaired coagulation cascade. They will clot, it just takes a little longer.

You guys are doing just fine. BTW, listen to Walks Slowly as well. He knows his stuff.

Walt Welch MD, Diplomate, American Board of Emergency Medicine
 
I defer to Greg and Walt as they have much more experiance than myself.

However, I did work in a para-medical capacity in an advanced life support unit
for 3 years and my experiance is consistant with their comments.

In that time I never applied a tourniquet dispite calls involving a severed hand, fingers, arm, and lower leg.

In each case firm and direct "digital" pressure (using gloved fingers into the wound area)followed by firm pressure with sterile compress bandages satifactorily controlled bleeding.

One exceptiton was a partner who had a case of a severed femorial (thigh) artery that was too high in the leg to apply a touriquet.
That patient did bleed to death as the artery could not be located in time to use a clamp/hemostat, nor did any amount of pressure control it. That was in an auto accident case involving catastrophic injuries with multiple fractures.

I have heard many more stories of how a tourniquet cased the loss of or comprimised a limb, rather than saved a life.

Dispite this, it could wise to consider a touriquet in dire circumstances WHEN ALL OTHER METHODS OF BLEEDING CONTROL FAIL using a cloth, i.e. bandana, and stick to twist for tightness, particularly if you must treat you own self. A belt could work too.
 
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