Air born dust collection?

G

googlebutt

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Jun 4, 2018
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I've order the gear needed to create my first knife by hand via stock removal (half face respirator included), but I'm thinking about dust collection if/when I get a 2x72 in the future. My workshop is in a shared garage, so I want to do everything in my power to keep myself and my family safe from fine particulates. My plans as of right now are to create the spark bong/metal dust deputy/shop vac system, in addition to enclosing my grinding area using a plastic curtain (top will still be open). My primary concern is controlling air born particulates. I understand that controlling settling dust is key, so perhaps some sort of shroud on the grinder itself will help there? I plan to remove my apron/shop clothing before entering the house as well.

Is there an affordable way to control this dust with confidence? The cost and risk involved in ensuring safety have definitely cooled my motivation to move forward.

Thanks.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
The automatic air cleaners used by woodworkers work great for airborne fine dust. The better ones run between $200 and $400. They are hung from the overhead and will run for a preset time after you leave the shop, then shut off.
https://www.woodcraft.com/search?q=air+cleaner&button=search
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These work great. I got one off of Craigslist for $100.

I've had both the cheap Amazon filters and the expensive OEM ones. The cheap ones work just as good IMO.
 
If you work in a shop with garage doors or the like, I don't find air purification all that useful. I wear a respirator in most dust producing tasks, so I am not worried about breathing it in while I make it. I generally will pop the garage doors for a few minutes (I live somewhere with some wind and I have doors on both sides of the garage) to evacuate the air after a task that produces dust. When grinding knives, you really only neet to worry about the abrasives and some of the handle materials. The steel itself wont be airborne for more than a minute or two.

For knife work, there are a bunch of options but a decent bucket style cyclonic filter with a water filled bucket underneath the separator and a collection hood beneath the platen is probably the best way to go. Only thing that perhaps would reduce the need for the respirator would be a coolmist system in conjunction with the seperator, but I would still wear one to be safe.

Either way, you dont really have to worry about the dust on the floor, the particles are all far heavier than air, and settle out. Just sweep up regularly and you are fine. The dust collection is for convenience and cleanliness more than safety.
 
I run the Jet and it is surprising how quick a filter can fill when grinding a lot.

Do not have the luxury of multiple doors to open so I run the filter about an hour more after I am done.
 
Thanks for the replies everyone. It sounds like if I partition my grinding area off using plastic shop curtains, with one of these air cleaners overhead, that should help control airborn particles and control the spread of dust in general?
 
my grinder and buffer each have their own clear plastic sheet enclosure, including roof. the buffing enclosure has a shop vac dust collector. the grinder enclosure has a rikon 63-100 dust collector. i like it because it is an all steel canister and top. my cellar does not get dusty anymore.
 
I've seen guys build their own filter boxes out of an old squirrel cage blower and some plywood. You can find plans on various woodworking sites/forums. It's basically what I'm assuming is a larger capacity version of the WEN unit linked above. I've seen blowers on craigslist for $50 or less, or if you know an HVAC guy, they scrap them all the time.

A much simpler version is a box fan with filters over the grill, though I can't say how efffective this really is.

No matter what you come up with, I'm sure you'll still want some localized collection at your dust sources.
 
I need to install some sort of air cleaner/filtration devices in my shop. Will the Woodcraft air cleaners listed above by Stacy clean up around my grinders as well as the vacuum systems such as Delta, Grizzly? I'm not sure it would, but am in no way an expert on the matter. I'm thinking of running dust collectors under each grinder wheel, connected to a vacuum or squirrel cage fan (shooting it outside the shop).....

What is your opinion? I've got to do something...
 
Just a quick note on local dust collection: Make sure you have some kind of spark arrestor.
 
joedhiggins said:
If you work in a shop with garage doors or the like, I don't find air purification all that useful. I wear a respirator in most dust producing tasks, so I am not worried about breathing it in while I make it. I generally will pop the garage doors for a few minutes (I live somewhere with some wind and I have doors on both sides of the garage) to evacuate the air after a task that produces dust. When grinding knives, you really only neet to worry about the abrasives and some of the handle materials. The steel itself wont be airborne for more than a minute or two.

For knife work, there are a bunch of options but a decent bucket style cyclonic filter with a water filled bucket underneath the separator and a collection hood beneath the platen is probably the best way to go. Only thing that perhaps would reduce the need for the respirator would be a coolmist system in conjunction with the seperator, but I would still wear one to be safe.

Either way, you dont really have to worry about the dust on the floor, the particles are all far heavier than air, and settle out. Just sweep up regularly and you are fine. The dust collection is for convenience and cleanliness more than safety.
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Unfortunately not all of the particles are not heavier than air.. stuff stay in the air for a day or two....Especially grinding Micarta which releases Formaldehyde. Bone, Antlers etc ———————————It’s long term exposer to all of these fine dusts and any fine dust damages your lungs overtime!————————————-I have a customer that’s a Pulmonary Dr, he said Bakers can get a condition called.. “Bakers Asthma” from the fine dust of the white flour they are around.. I keep my mask on for the rest of day I’m in my shop after I stop grinding and have the air filter running....
 
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I have a spark bong set-up and a couple of box fans with 20"x20" furnace filters on them. They work pretty good. I'm going to be adding curtains around the grinders.
 
Rhinoknives1 said:
Unfortunately not all of the particles are not heavier than air.. stuff stay in the air for a day or two....Especially grinding Micarta which releases Formaldehyde. Bone, Antlers etc ———————————It’s long term exposer to all of these fine dusts and any fine dust damages your lungs overtime!————————————-I have a customer that’s a Pulmonary Dr, he said Bakers can get a condition called.. “Bakers Asthma” from the fine dust of the white flour they are around.. I keep my mask on for the rest of day I’m in my shop after I stop grinding and have the air filter running....
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Yeah this is my concern, as my family uses the garage on a daily basis. How long do you figure the garage should be avoided with a curtained off grinder + air cleaner above it?
 
googlebutt said:
Yeah this is my concern, as my family uses the garage on a daily basis. How long do you figure the garage should be avoided with a curtained off grinder + air cleaner above it?
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what do you mean by using it? Play area for the kids? Laundry machines there?. If they are only out there for a hour a day or less, I wouldn’t worry about it.. it’s us standing in it for hours at a time day in & out that has the accumulative problem..
 
Rhinoknives1 said:
what do you mean by using it? Play area for the kids? Laundry machines there?. If they are only out there for a hour a day or less, I wouldn’t worry about it.. it’s us standing in it for hours at a time day in & out that has the accumulative problem..
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No kids, but yes the laundry machines are in there, pretty much just an in and out sort of deal. Way less than an hour a day. I feel more confident that these relatively affordable dust control solutions in combination with a half face respirator (with p100 filters) will protect my body at a hobbyist level, only grinding on the weekends.
 
googlebutt said:
No kids, but yes the laundry machines are in there, pretty much just an in and out sort of deal. Way less than an hour a day. I feel more confident that these relatively affordable dust control solutions in combination with a half face respirator (with p100 filters) will protect my body at a hobbyist level, only grinding on the weekends.
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The half face are a pain ..Look up the Resp-o-raptor. I prefer these and sell them as well because they are the easiest to use and you can answer the phone, chat with someone for a minute. Someone sells them on Amazon.———— I don’t use the dorky nose clip. Just only breathe out through your nose.. they have the same p100 nuance partial rated filters..
 
For full dust and air quality control you need:
1) A PAPR hood of some type is what I recommend for the air you breathe when working. It runs all the time while you are in the shop grinding. It also keeps your face cooler.

2) A shop vac will suck up the grit around the grinder and on the floor.

3) A dust collection setup under the grinder arm with a spark trap will remove a lot of stuff when you are grinding.

4) An air filtration systems that hang overhead will filter the free air in the shop. They should be able to filter the air in a normal size shop five to ten times an hour.

While AC duct filters duct taped to a box fan are better than nothing ( and they aren't much better than nothing), they don't do anything close to the job of a proper shop air filter with the right filter types.
The overhead filter units remove virtually all free particles below 3000 grit, and nearly all the particles below 50,000 grit. The air coming out of them is probably much cleaner than the air outside your house.

The portable cylinder units that sell for $80-$100 and use a shop vac filter and a round fan are of some use to pull dust and chips away when doing power carving, but they aren't air filters to any real degree.

BTW, the units at woodcraft are on sale regularly for about 1/3 off. I have seen the $400 unit selling for $250 several times this past year. They have remote control, all sorts of programmable run times/delays, and reminder lights to let you know to change the filters. They are also very quiet.
 
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Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
A PAPR hood of some type is what I recommend for the air you breathe when working. It runs all the time while you are in the shop grinding. It also keeps your face cooler.

A shop vac will suck up the grit around the grinder and on the floor.

A dust collection setup under the grinder arm with a spark trap will remove a lot of stuff when you are grinding.

The air filtration systems that hang overhead are for filtering the free air in the shop. They should be able to filter the air in a normal size shop five to ten times an hour.

While AC duct filters duct taped to a box fan are better than nothing ( and they aren't much better than nothing), they don't do anything close to the job of a proper shop air filter with the right filter types.
The overhead filter units remove virtually all free particles below 3000 grit, and nearly all the particles below 50,000 grit. The air coming out of them is probably much cleaner than the air outside your house.

The portable cylinder units that sell for $80-$100 and use a shop vac filter and a round fan are of some use to pull dust and chips away when doing power carving, but they aren't air filters to any real degree.

BTW, the units at woodcraft are on sale regularly for about 1/3 off. I have seen the $400 unit selling for $250 several times this past year. They have remote control, all sorts of programmable run times/delays, and reminder lights to let you know to change the filters. They are alsonvery quiet.
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But, will an overhead filtration system perform as well as a dust collection setup under my grinder arms? That’s my $64,000 question.
 
No.

Ideally you want both. The one under your grinder catches the big stuff the one over your head catches the light stuff, and the one on your face catches the stuff that the other two haven’t caught yet.
 
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