Just curious but just how big were those trees that they got lost going around them?As I write there are two men lost, dehydrated and requesting assistance in the Santa Cruz mountains (outside of my coverage area FYI).
Apparently they came to a section of trail that was blocked by a couple of down trees so they decided to go off trail and got lost.
Just an argument for larger survival knives.
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Almost any knife, within reason, can be used as a bushcraft/survival knife—do you agree?
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scdub
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No idea - just heard the call on the radio. I am in Redwood county so potentially quite big.
It’s possible that a big knife wouldn’t have helped, but having cleared MANY trees from trails in the last 20 years, I’m pretty confident that they could have gotten through with a large knife, axe or saw…
Or just walked around without losing sight of it......LOL......Theres got to be more to the story.....
scdub
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That certainly might have worked too, but that’s all I got from the radio.
It could have been as simple as it sounds however. I’ve been on many search-and-rescue details and I’m no longer surprised at the strange decisions people will make while out in the woods…
If I get a chance and the trees are still there I might try to hike up to the location and check it out over my weekend. I’ll be sure to follow up if I do.
scdub
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Yes, but only if you know what the knife is capable of and you have planned your other gear accordingly.
Modern outdoor survival is primarily about the ability to maintain body temperature. Heat or cold will kill by far more lost hikers this year than thirst, starvation or wild non-human animals.
A survival knife is just one tool in part of a system designed by the individual to best address their likely survival challenges and how “comfortable” they want to be if they unexpectedly find themselves spending a few nights outside waiting for rescue. With enough other gear, you don’t even need a knife.
I enjoy having survival knives of varying sizes and weights because I can tailor the knife to other variables such as the terrain, the weather/overnight temperatures, if I’m expecting to clear the trail, what other gear I’m carrying, etc.
If you’re traveling into a forest that’s gonna get cold, and you aren’t bringing multiple layers of clothes and some type of shelter, please consider bringing a large survival knife, axe, and/or saw along (after learning how to make fire and shelter).
Happy trails!
vnvman
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It doesn't even have to be a knife. Even a nail file could save your ass in certain survival situations, help you shave some sticks and strike a rod. Will it be able to save/help you in MOST situations? Hell no.
For a more serious answer, I think that even just a 20€ Victorinox could prove itself a bushcraft/survival powerhouse if you have the right skillset and the conditions aren't too dire: a small saw coupled with a thin blade and some other tidbits can go a long way.
If i was starting out bushcraft I'd pick up something like a Victorinox Hiker. You can learn all of the basics with that. You can check out Felix Immler's Youtube page and see how much you can do with such a simple, urban edc like tool.
Otherwise, of course a Recon Tanto will have you covered for most needs, if it was me tho if you plan on batoning a bunch maybe a Recon Scout or a cheap fixie like a Mora Garberg would be best. Throw a small saw in the mix like a Silky pocketboy and you're set for life.
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I think there is another side to this equation though.
A knife is lower on my priority of survival for me than a lot of things. A tarp for example
And relying on a knife to say build a shelter is so much harder than if you just throwing that tarp up and mabye cutting a bit of string with the world's most effeminate knife and then just sitting under it.
So then if we compared these two knives alongside their ideologies the small knife is much more effective.
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For my skill level and preference, my minimum would be small fixed blade. There’s a small possibility that a SAK might break in less than ideal situation. A fixed blade inspires more confidence at least. That’s just me.
vnvman
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Absolutely, any tough 4“ fixed blade + saw will trump most combos in terms of weight/efficiency ratio, that's out of question.
By the way I do think that with few exceptions if you're under 4" in my opinion you still have most of the shortcomings of a small pocket knife (can't hack much and still can't baton anything that isn't stick size already), and might as well carry a CS mega folder for the same footprint, packing more cutting ability without compromising much in strength.
I mentioned the SAK because such knives as I'm talking about here definitely aren't most people's cup of tea for urban daily carry, and at the end of the you have only get to "survive" with what you have on you realistically all the time.
Personally I do EDC a Cold Steel Colossus or even a 4Max so it's not my problem, either way I think the SAK is a good and cheap starter package for somebody who wants to learn bushcrafting because it teaches you to rely more on skills and ingenuity rather than bulldozing though the woods with a hyooge chopper and never reach beyond stone age caveman level skills wise.
Here's my 2 pennies about the OP topic. "Survival" was popularized by so called experts on TV who claimed to be preparing you for an unlikely scenario. A certain shark infested tv network would have you believe that at any given moment you could be thrust into a situation where the only fluid you would have on hand that could quench your thirst and save you from certain death of dehydration is your own pee or fluid from animal crap squeezed into a bottle you found floating on an ocean of undrinkable salt water.
These "experts" also claimed all they had to save themselves in this situation was a $10 flint stick, military style canteen and a $2000 custom hand made knife that has their name laser etched into the newest powdered steel.
Now my reality. I'm not going to be backpacking across shark infested deserts with only my Scooby Doo boxer shorts on and a ball point pen. I'm waking up, sticking a swiss army knife in my pocket and might face sudden instant death from a paper cut opening a card board box. I won't be opening that box with a fancy acid etched machete made from powdered Damascus steel.
My survival knife is likely going to be a folder. My Bushcraft knife is likely to be that same folder. Likely my Emerson or a Bugout.
These "experts" also claimed all they had to save themselves in this situation was a $10 flint stick, military style canteen and a $2000 custom hand made knife that has their name laser etched into the newest powdered steel.
Now my reality. I'm not going to be backpacking across shark infested deserts with only my Scooby Doo boxer shorts on and a ball point pen. I'm waking up, sticking a swiss army knife in my pocket and might face sudden instant death from a paper cut opening a card board box. I won't be opening that box with a fancy acid etched machete made from powdered Damascus steel.
My survival knife is likely going to be a folder. My Bushcraft knife is likely to be that same folder. Likely my Emerson or a Bugout.
Outdoor rec user decision making is certainly a crap shoot, but remember the ones we see are only the self-selected ones that turn into a call for service. The others somehow remedy their defects and go on about their business.
Two dehydrated dudes unable to circumnavigate fallen trees, I can think of ways they could get in trouble with a knife. Perhaps in their efforts to stave off dehydration, they consumed all their alcoholic beverages.
Which could slow their rate of travel, they’d be “injured, known location” and require fewer resources to find.
Parker
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Damn I have a lot of knives. I've done a smattering of backpacking, climbing, and car camping in my 70+ years. But not nearly enough to master any necessary skills. But change is in the wind. We’re moving to a rural county north of NYC. It’ll be quite a change from longtime city denizen to country squire. A new small house sited on 25 acres with field, woods and stream for me, my wife and the dog.
There’s a lot of firewood to cut and stack. Kindling, too.
There’s a lot of firewood to cut and stack. Kindling, too.
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It’s not like all this bush craft / survival stuff just happened in the last few years or whatever. My grandfather and my dad used whatever knife they happened to have with them to cut and whittle wood and sticks for all kinds of purposes back before any special steels or designs were developed.
Yes there are special designed knives that have been developed for just the specific reason of working with wood and other materials in the great outdoors that probably excell in bushcraft and still do a fair job of slicing and dicing but maybe don’t perform as well in other ways.
As for myself I don’t do a majority of tasks that could be considered bushcraft so I’m not that concerned about the design or steel in that regard. I have several knives that have performed well in many different situations and fit my need in a utilitarian manner and that’s what I care about.
Yes there are special designed knives that have been developed for just the specific reason of working with wood and other materials in the great outdoors that probably excell in bushcraft and still do a fair job of slicing and dicing but maybe don’t perform as well in other ways.
As for myself I don’t do a majority of tasks that could be considered bushcraft so I’m not that concerned about the design or steel in that regard. I have several knives that have performed well in many different situations and fit my need in a utilitarian manner and that’s what I care about.
scdub
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For sure, and as I said if you have enough other gear you don’t need a knife at all.
However a knife is higher on my list than everything except a map, compass and ignition source as it can also help me gather dead standing wood for a fire.
I’m 100% pro tarps, bivy sacs, and anything else that helps keep you warm.
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As someone that has researched the subject for all the information that exists nobody has a clue what their belt knives looked like (made by a government armory for the trip) but they were probably pretty similar to big butcher knives. If only one still existed!
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The first "EDC, bushcraft, survival" sheath knives were simply the most rugged knives available at the time, which was most likely a butchers knife....
As for a slip-joint, not by choice but if it's the knife in your pocket.
Apologies to those who have already seen this vid, it's been posted before.
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The first "EDC, bushcraft, survival" sheath knives were simply the most rugged knives available at the time, which was most likely a butchers knife....
As for a slip-joint, not by choice but if it's the knife in your pocket.
Apologies to those who have already seen this vid, it's been posted before.
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