Any opinion on Henckels for a home cook?

[N8N]

Good evening all,

After sorting through all my kitchen stuff and realizing that I have a pile of mismatched kitchen knives, I at least sharpened them all (OK, I got some of them sharpened as they were so beat that I didn't want to try to sharpen them by hand, those were ones that I probably picked out at the thrift store) but discovered a couple pieces completely missing. I had no santoku, I have one carving knife but the place that I took the real bad ones to didn't sharpen it, they said it would be a waste of money (it's an old "Flint Stainless" knife with a wood handle; I'm CERTAIN that was a $2 thrift store purchase) and I also don't have either any steak knives or a knife block that will hold all the knives I want to have handy. I did splurge and bought a real Japanese santoku from the shop that sharpened my knives, and that's when I realized I needed a new block.

The best knife I have besides the santoku is a Henckels chef's knife, and a lot of my kitchen utensils are of that aesthetic (black plastic or Bakelite handles, I also have some Chicago Cutlery knives that are a close match, as well as almost a full set of similar looking old Ekco Flint utensils - spatula, potato masher, carving fork, spoons, et cetera.)

Now, it appears that the $200 "Henckels Classic" knife set includes a carving knife and steak knives and would be less money than buying the carving knife, steak knives, and block separately. It looks like it also has extra slots so I could put my santoku and a bread knife in it also. Extra knives are always good. But the question is, would this be a good buy? Or should I budget more money and get better stuff? I am not a pro chef but definitely squarely in the "I can cook, but please don't ask me to do anything too challenging" category and honestly I've been muddling through with my collection of thrift store refugees for 20 years now but I'd like to just have more quality stuff.

I also had a professional edge put on my two EDCs (a Griptilian and a CQC-7) and a SOG that lives in my "go bag" that a friend gave me years ago when I lost my then-EDC. They get used for mundane tasks, but it was real satisfying to open that coffee packet at work this morning when I put the first pot on

Edit: I think I found the gotcha. The steak knives included with the set are stamped, not the nice forged bolstered ones that you'd buy separately for a lot more money. That said, I just went and looked at my knives again and my "good" Henckels chef's knife (my other one is a Chicago Cutlery that for all the world looks darn near identical, although it's lighter, and it did sharpen up OK although I can't speak to durability) is stamped as well. I know I bought that ages ago before I knew as much as I do today about cutlery. So I'm still considering making that move and just considering the steak knives a stopgap. Thoughts?

 

[sabre cat]

My steak knives are made by Furi down in Australia. They are all stainless and don’t match my kitchen knives.

They are all stainless and really dress up a place setting. They came with a plastic storage box so they are not in a knife block.

And speaking of knife blocks, I would recommend a magnetic bar mounted on the wall instead. It will free up space on your counter and it is better for the cutting edge of your knives.

 

[Ourorboros]

Knife sets sound good, because they give you a number of knives for the money. But how good are the knives?
Personally I'd go get individual knives that fit what I do and buy quality.
Good knives will give better results and feel better than having a pile of mediocre knives.
So ask yourself which knives do you really use? What knives fit what you do? Then buy accordingly.

 

[coxhaus]

I have around 30 kitchen knives. Most are Henckels 4star and some Wusthof Classic knives. They work great for me. I use a Worksharp Ken Onion and sharpen at 15 degrees.

If I, was you, I would buy just a couple of knives to start and not a whole set. A chef's knife and a paring knife would be a good start.

 

[N8N]

Good morning all and thanks for your thoughts.

My steak knives are made by Furi down in Australia. They are all stainless and don’t match my kitchen knives.

They are all stainless and really dress up a place setting. They came with a plastic storage box so they are not in a knife block.

And speaking of knife blocks, I would recommend a magnetic bar mounted on the wall instead. It will free up space on your counter and it is better for the cutting edge of your knives.

I'm kind of stuck with a block for now, as I'm renting and the whole around the counter area is tiled. I expect that to change in a year or so, but for now, this is where I am.

Knife sets sound good, because they give you a number of knives for the money. But how good are the knives?
Personally I'd go get individual knives that fit what I do and buy quality.
Good knives will give better results and feel better than having a pile of mediocre knives.
So ask yourself which knives do you really use? What knives fit what you do? Then buy accordingly.

I would say chef's, paring, and to a lesser extent carving.

I have around 30 kitchen knives. Most are Henckels 4star and some Wusthof Classic knives. They work great for me. I use a Worksharp Ken Onion and sharpen at 15 degrees.

If I, was you, I would buy just a couple of knives to start and not a whole set. A chef's knife and a paring knife would be a good start.

Given all the above though, I was thinking that the set would still be cheaper than buying the exact same knives individually; I'm having a hard time even finding a nice looking big block that will hold a lot of knives for an inexpensive price. Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated! I would think it would need to hold at a minimum, chef's, santoku, carving, paring, bread, maybe filet/boning, steel, am I forgetting anything?

Also looking for input on the Henckels "Classic" line specifically as it fits my aesthetic. The similar Wusthof knives are significantly more expensive, and recommendations for any other lines I should look at would be greatly appreciated.

 

[N8N]

After looking around some more, Wusthof is offering a "free" knife block, shears, and steel with $300 purchase, which would just cover the three knives I mention above (chef's, paring, and carving). Seems like Wusthof Classic is about equivalent to Zwilling Pro S in both price and design/performance. Thoughts on that idea? I have all the other "basic" knives (bread, filet, etc.) in various quality levels (and all freshly sharpened) so I'm not missing an occasional use knives, and can replace them or not down the road as I see fit.

 

[The Zieg]

After looking around some more, Wusthof is offering a "free" knife block, shears, and steel with $300 purchase, which would just cover the three knives I mention above (chef's, paring, and carving). Seems like Wusthof Classic is about equivalent to Zwilling Pro S in both price and design/performance. Thoughts on that idea? I have all the other "basic" knives (bread, filet, etc.) in various quality levels (and all freshly sharpened) so I can replace them or not down the road as I see fit.

The Wusthof block deals can be a very good way to go as long as you are happy with the scale construction and the feel in your hand. You are probably looking at a set that uses X50CrMo14 steel which is a very good German kitchen steel that will serve for decades, if not centuries (seriously, your great grandchildren can use these knives if they do not wear down to nothing). My wife and I have the same block set of Wusthof Grand Prix knives (a line no longer available) received as a wedding gift in 1998 and we use the hell out of them. We wash and dry them carefully, use the steel on them regularly, and I sharpen them on a Japanese stone when needed, about once a quarter. Mine are a bit different in steel composition, X60CrMo15, but it's only a slight difference, just a tad harder than what is being used today.

If the set you're looking at is Chinese made, they may still be constructed of German steel imported to the factory in China and simply built there under license. Nothing wrong with this, though the knives produced in this jobbing arrangement sometimes have wonky scales or proud rivets. Fit and finish can be uneven. Wusthof will also send materials to Spain in the same sort of export plan, and these knives will usually be better than the Chinese constructed knives. The knives built in Germany are probably the best constructed.

Ultimately, it boils down to how they feel in your hand. Prepping a bird or slicing a bag of onions with an expensive German made knife that does not balance well for you or has handle edges that dig into your palm is worse than a more affordable Chinese made knife of the same steel that fits your hand and balances nicely. It's a tool and you have to like how it feels and goes through the food. I can no longer read the etching on my Wusthofs so if you told me they were Chinese or Spanish, I wouldn't care as they are great knives with great steel and feel and balance well.

Let us know what you end up with!

 

[coxhaus]

I am old and I have my mom's old Henckels 4star knives. They are around 50 years old and still work great. My grandkids will be able to use these. They will last that long. I had a lower line Henckels and it would not hold an edge like my Henckels 4star knives so it had to be sharpened more. I think the Henckels 4 star or 5-star knives are the best but I have experience with Henckels Classic knives. I have heard all my life if you buy Henckels knives you want to make sure they are made in Germany.

 

[N8N]

The more I reflect, the more I think I am going to order the Wusthof knives (just the Chef, Paring, and Carving - and really 2/3 of those I have "acceptable" ones, but the longer you put off buying the good ones, the less you get to use them) on Friday when I get paid, unless someone talks me out of it.

 

[BDubbs]

Where are they made? This is a little off topic from the brand in question but I’d go with the victorinox fibrox handles ( chef knife, bread knife, 6 in utility knife, handful of pairing knives) for the kitchen knives and call it a day. They are stamped but an amazing value for the price. I’ve got an 8/6/5 and bread knife and recommend them to everyone. They routinely crush much more expensive knives in reviews. Sharpness and edge retention are right up there with my global and Messermeister for a fraction of the price. You can get a universal knife block with plastic rods in it as well or a magnetic knife block. A set of nice non-serrated steak knives will vary in price depending on your handle material, a lot of time your well known cutlery brands will have lowered tiers knives that are actually made in China to be more cost competitive. Do what you want with your money but I avoid them. Good luck and post up a photo on what you go with.

 

[N8N]

Where are they made? This is a little off topic from the brand in question but I’d go with the victorinox fibrox handles ( chef knife, bread knife, 6 in utility knife, handful of pairing knives) for the kitchen knives and call it a day. They are stamped but an amazing value for the price. I’ve got an 8/6/5 and bread knife and recommend them to everyone. They routinely crush much more expensive knives in reviews. Sharpness and edge retention are right up there with my global and Messermeister for a fraction of the price. You can get a universal knife block with plastic rods in it as well or a magnetic knife block. A set of nice non-serrated steak knives will vary in price depending on your handle material, a lot of time your well known cutlery brands will have lowered tiers knives that are actually made in China to be more cost competitive. Do what you want with your money but I avoid them. Good luck and post up a photo on what you go with.

View attachment 1611339

Odd you should mention the Victorinox. My housemate has that exact chef's knife, and while the steel may be superior, it just doesn't feel in my hand like enough of an upgrade - or really, any at all - to the two chef's knives I already have (a Spanish made stamped "Henckels International" and an almost identical Chicago Cutlery knife that I got for free from a new neighbor cleaning out her attic. In fact I got two identical CC chef's knives so gave one to a housemate who was moving out to his own place, but I digress.) In fact, while the Victorinox may be overall a better knife, the Chicago Cutlery looks better sticking out of the knife block. There, I said it, appearance does matter. As I said before, if I could get something with that style traditional German full tang, three rivet handle, that would match a lot of utensils and other knives that I have, and yeah that does count for something. Same housemate has a neat little Zwilling Pro paring knife of which I'm very jealous. Mine is another Chicago Cutlery which is actually a neat little knife albeit considered low end, and I could use it just fine until it was slap wore out, but the Zwilling just feels... better. Hence my concentration now on forged knives from either Zwilling/Henckels or Wüsthof. Basically more like the Meridian knife in your pic, although I think the Wüsthof Classic have a full bolster rather than a half bolster like yours.

Or, in other words, I think going from my current Henckels International to Victorinox would feel to me like a lateral move, so why bother. Going to a forged knife with better balance, now, that is what I'd like to try, if that makes any sense. Now I don't see myself replacing things like a bread knife (mine is a matching Chicago Cutlery) or seldom used ones like a filet (that one doesn't even match, it's an ugly probably 50+ year old wood handled Ekco) with matching German knives unless it's just for complete vanity reasons.

To specifically answer your question, the knives that are on the top of my list now are the Wüsthof Classic, made in Solingen, specifically the 3.5" paring knife, 8" carving knife, and 8" chef's knife, with a 17 slot block, shears, and steel (I don't need anything but the block really, but a new steel would be nice. Would probably keep using my Dexter Russell shears as I can take them apart and toss those in the dishwasher.) Zwilling Pro (half bolster) or Zwilling Pro S (full bolster) would also be options (I believe those are all made in Germany as well) I am just looking at the Wüsthof as I need a new block as well; the knives themselves appear almost identical. Probably not going to even get the meat fork as I have an Ekco one that matches from 10' away, and who knows whenever I'll have reason to carve a whole bird or ham any time soon - and if I do it'll be once or twice a year - so that should be adequate. The knife that I actually just purchased is a Masutani santoku with the half-tang, western style handle, after fondling about 8 different suggestions at the knife shop. (they are very Japanese centric though and while technically a Wüsthof dealer don't actually have any in stock.) I haven't used the santoku yet as I just picked it up on Thursday and am still cleaning and rearranging - this whole discussion started as an offshoot of my efforts to clean up and pull together all my kitchen stuff; when I got all my knives sharpened I realized there was some crap in there, and also some holes in the "collection" like the complete lack of any santoku at all.

 

[BDubbs]

Lol, man this is a safe space if you can’t talk about buying knives based on appearance here then where can you? I think the “best“ knife is a free one that you happen to really like. Sorry I misread intent of your post, didn’t mean to come off sounding condescending. I don’t think you can go wrong with the wusthof classic, or Zwilling pro, or really any of the major brands made in Solingen. I do like the wusthof ikon handles but I’m also partial to the half bolster and it doesn’t have the traditional shape with 3 rivets. My Messermeister doesn’t do anything my Victorinox can’t but it just makes me happy, I love the ring it makes on a steel and look forward to opportunities to use it on big jobs like breaking down beef and chicken, squash/melons or large amounts of veg prep. Good luck with whatever you choose and upload a photo once you have it set up.

 

[N8N]

Just was cleaning up the kitchen and I noticed housemate has two chef's knives, the other that I never really noticed before has a handle similar to the Victorinox but has a half bolster and is "Mercer" brand. I looked them up and I'm thinking he might actually know what he's doing as it appears to be a similar steel alloy to Wüsthof. They also are apparently available in a traditional full tang, riveted handle for a quite reasonable price. Any opinions on those?

Edit: after looking, the knife he has is the "Mercer Genesis" which has a very similar (the same?) handle to the Victorinox; the line that looks more like what I would want in a handle is the "Mercer Renaissance". They're all marked "NSF" which I assume means they're marketed more at the professional than the home cook but that really bothers me not at all (see Dexter Russell shears, above, I like that I can take them apart and clean them thoroughly.)

 

[N8N]

Lol, man this is a safe space if you can’t talk about buying knives based on appearance here then where can you? I think the “best“ knife is a free one that you happen to really like. Sorry I misread intent of your post, didn’t mean to come off sounding condescending. I don’t think you can go wrong with the wusthof classic, or Zwilling pro, or really any of the major brands made in Solingen. I do like the wusthof ikon handles but I’m also partial to the half bolster and it doesn’t have the traditional shape with 3 rivets. My Messermeister doesn’t do anything my Victorinox can’t but it just makes me happy, I love the ring it makes on a steel and look forward to opportunities to use it on big jobs like breaking down beef and chicken, squash/melons or large amounts of veg prep. Good luck with whatever you choose and upload a photo once you have it set up.

I didn't take your post in any way badly. You recommended what for all I can tell is an excellent knife, I just wanted to go "next level" and not only have a good knife from the standpoint of the steel and edge but also balance, hence looking at forged ones.

That said, if I *had* a decent carving knife, I might not be going down this rabbit hole, as even the literally free Chicago Cutlery knives that I have really aren't that bad in the grand scheme of things. I've seen people using lots worse, anyway.

Just curious, why preference for half bolster? I'm agnostic at this point as I am not sure I've even handled a kitchen knife with a full bolster, just honestly looking for input.

 

[BDubbs]

I didn't take your post in any way badly. You recommended what for all I can tell is an excellent knife, I just wanted to go "next level" and not only have a good knife from the standpoint of the steel and edge but also balance, hence looking at forged ones.

That said, if I *had* a decent carving knife, I might not be going down this rabbit hole, as even the literally free Chicago Cutlery knives that I have really aren't that bad in the grand scheme of things. I've seen people using lots worse, anyway.

Just curious, why preference for half bolster? I'm agnostic at this point as I am not sure I've even handled a kitchen knife with a full bolster, just honestly looking for input.

Totally understand, obsessed over 10 in chef knives and visited stores repeatedly before i got the Messermeister. I like the half vs full just for (assumed) ease of sharpening. To be clear I’ve never had to sharpen a full bolster so it may be a non-issue, but if you sharpen it and the bolster and not the blade is on the cutting board then I assume you have to then thin down the bolster.

Mercer - No exp, they seem to use good steel and have high quality control and cut costs by fabricating in Asia, Taiwan I read.

 

[CDHumiston]

We have two large complete sets of some of the best Henckels knives. My wife loved them for quite some time, but I was doing a lot of sharpening.

I bought her this one knife and she uses it almost exclusively now...

Enso HD 7" Vegetable Cleaver - Made in Japan - VG10 Hammered Damascus Stainless Steel Chinese Chef's Knife​

 

[N8N]

We have two large complete sets of some of the best Henckels knives. My wife loved them for quite some time, but I was doing a lot of sharpening.

I bought her this one knife and she uses it almost exclusively now...

Enso HD 7" Vegetable Cleaver - Made in Japan - VG10 Hammered Damascus Stainless Steel Chinese Chef's Knife​

Heh. Many miles away, something crawls to the surface... my new santoku is VG10, damascus, and has a black pakkawood handle, although it's closer to a Western style handle. I need to finish cleaning up and actually cook something so I can use it

 

[N8N]

Totally understand, obsessed over 10 in chef knives and visited stores repeatedly before i got the Messermeister. I like the half vs full just for (assumed) ease of sharpening. To be clear I’ve never had to sharpen a full bolster so it may be a non-issue, but if you sharpen it and the bolster and not the blade is on the cutting board then I assume you have to then thin down the bolster.

Mercer - No exp, they seem to use good steel and have high quality control and cut costs by fabricating in Asia, Taiwan I read.

Fair enough, I assumed the same. I just didn't know if it was a balance thing from your perspective or if the sharpening thing was your main consideration. And yes I am assuming it would need to be ground down at some point. Now the top candidates are actually different - Wüsthof has a full bolster while the Mercer has a half bolster. I also found a cool Mercer set that instead of a block comes with a magnetic stand (M21941 if you want to see it online)... that is kind of appealing. Dunno if it's better or worse, but it's different. I guess I'm probably going to order SOMETHING on Friday, what it is, who can say at this point in time.

Yes, I do tend to kind of obsess over purchases that in the grand scheme of things it would be fairly easy to make a "good" choice. It's just the way I am...

 

[BDubbs]

Fair enough, I assumed the same. I just didn't know if it was a balance thing from your perspective or if the sharpening thing was your main consideration. And yes I am assuming it would need to be ground down at some point. Now the top candidates are actually different - Wüsthof has a full bolster while the Mercer has a half bolster. I also found a cool Mercer set that instead of a block comes with a magnetic stand (M21941 if you want to see it online)... that is kind of appealing. Dunno if it's better or worse, but it's different. I guess I'm probably going to order SOMETHING on Friday, what it is, who can say at this point in time.

Yes, I do tend to kind of obsess over purchases that in the grand scheme of things it would be fairly easy to make a "good" choice. It's just the way I am...

Exact same way, more so on purchases I don’t plan on making again, really want to get it right the first time. That Mercer set has same steel as my Messermeister, big difference in price with the Wusthofs?

 

[Spideyjg]

Get a great chef and your #2 and 3 blades. For me that is a chef, 6" utility, and a Chinese cleaver

None of the German knives are "bad" but the feel may be a deal breaker. Gimme Henckles Pro S or Messermeister Elite handles over Wusthof Classic, Hate the Wusthof GrandPrix II "ergonomic handle but love the F Dick Premier but they are thicker blades.

If you hold a pinch grip look for blades with a swept back handles like the Victorinox or the Zwilling Pro They feel better for pinching.

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