Attaching head to handle

Brian C -
Listen carefully ... why do we NOT dry-fire a rimfire rifle or pistol? Because the firing pin will hit the rim of the chamber and will deform it slightly so that the cartridge cases stick. Why do we NOT beat on the bottom of a tomahawk eye with the hardened face of a hammer? Because the eye area of the hawk head is SOFTER than the hammer, and will deform, and bulge into the eye, and you won't get a handle to fit right until you re-shape the damaged area. If you have to do it that way, use a hardwood or brass drift.
Enough said.

Cliff -
Suggest you try your "wide surface" with a hawk having an upswept upper edge ... if you don't strike within about an inch and a half of the edge of the block you've just hit the upper blade between eye and point and have a very non-perpendicular skewed impact that doesn't help the handle fitting. If you're off by an inch, the corner of the handle hits the edge of this "big target" and you likely chip off a chunk of the handle. Especially when you are striking from shoulder height (you're right on that one) trying to equal by more primitive methods the degree of force effortlessly available from a $30 2-ton arbor press so that when the handle is finally "in" it is going to stay "in" virtually forever - without wedges. Now try this when you've just done about 12 hawks, it's late at night, and your tail is dragging.

Now if you mean that you miss the target completely and smash the handle off something else, well yes I didn't address that because quite frankly if you do that you really should not be using a tomahawk as you don't have the control to use it safely.
Click to expand...

I'm not as clumsy as you apparently think I am - just smart enough to figure out a way to dependably set handles without ANY chance of marring a precision ground hawk head or chipping a corner off a handle that cost me money and probably already had a couple of hours of shop time invested in it. I learn from unhappy experiences ... and when possible, try to keep others from making the same mistakes.

TWO HAWKS
http://www.2hawks.net
 
Teaching is a difficult profession, you never really know if you have taught an individual to think, or to do something.
Axes, Hatchets, and Hawks, all different, some cross over, not one that does all things perfect. When you challenge the teacher, let us hope that the thought process is what you left the class with.

Be Well
FO
 
LOL, Two Hawks. The info you've provided just confirmed my thoughts about hitting the underside of the tomahawk head. I do get the message. ;)
 
Two Hawks :

Suggest you try your "wide surface" with a hawk having an upswept upper edge
Click to expand...

The Cold Steel tomahawk that I mention has such an edge profile, the toe of the bit is above the handle.

http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/images/atc_cs_gb_pab.jpg

There is still a huge margin of error on the strike impact. Far in excess of what you would need to be able to use a tomahawk safely. If your tomahawk hits are scattering 1 and a half inches from where you need them to go, you are very likely to injure yourself when using them. As when chopping you use a far greater swing arc and a much higher velocity. If on a straight drive you were scattering 1.5 inches or so, on a full swing you would probably be double that or more. You would have difficulty even hitting the wood, let alone staying in the cut path.

In regards to deforming the head, there are two opposing forces. One is the friction between the eye and the wooden haft, and the other the internal metallic bonds of the tomahawk head. The former is far weaker than the latter. Even if you wanted to drive the handle so far into that head that it has to deform, the wood will deform far before the tempered steel tomahawk head. Again though it is in the method.

It is quite possible for this to happen though depending on what the head is made from. If the body was simple mild steel and was unhardened, and the eye was very thin, you could probably deform it. However even mild steel doesn't indent that readily, it is steel after all. I would assume on such heads that you would get localized indendation though and not gross deformation. In any case, it would very likely deform when throwing if you missed the target so its a moot point.

Now try this when you've just done about 12 hawks, it's late at night, and your tail is dragging.
Click to expand...

We were discussing field setting of heads, not how you would perform them in a shop.

-Cliff
 
Cliff-
(1) Not talking about the handle deforming the head. Talking about your d*mn hammer on the underside of the eye deforming the eye.
(2) Not talking about swinging a hawk to cut wood. Talking about holding it vertically in one hand, with the other hand steadying the blade, while very carefully "dropping" it with considerable force to cause the top of the handle to hit a block so that inertia will seat the head a little bit (and after MANY repeated hits still not as firmly as using a press, but if you're doing it away from the shop you don't have a lot of alternatives).
(3) You may have a huge stump to hit (and if the handle is in fact vertical to ensure perpendicular setting force the top edge of an upswept hawk head WILL hit the block before the top of the handle once the handle is set anywhere near as deep as it needs to be). So you have to hit at the edge of the stump, and CAN miss especially if you are tired. Chipped handle head.
(4) If you really want to have some fun, use your beat-on-the-bottom-of-the-eye-with-a-hammer technique with a highly polished blued or browned head in which you are final-setting a highly polished gunstock finished handle. Those are what I normally work with. If I can set them without destroying them and p*ssing off a customer, anybody else should be able to use my suggested techniques without messing up their hawk. I have installed handles in several hundred tapered-eye hawks, and they don't come loose.

Everybody else -
I think we have beat this subject to death. I need to spend more time on the grinder (and arbor press) and less time on the computer.
SUMMARY:
(1) If you can't spend 30 bucks for an arbor press or have to set a new handle in the woods, use the traditional inertia method and be careful to keep the handle vertical while slamming the assembly into the block. And don't miss and hit the edge of the block.
(2) Don't beat on the bottom of the eye with anything harder than the hawk head (remember that most wrapped-eye hawks have mild steel no harder than angle iron in the eye area - just the bit is tool steel). If you have a nice hawk, don't even do that ... take it back to the shop.

Over and out.

TWO HAWKS
http://www.2hawks.net
 
Two Hawks,
Thanks for all the information.
We appreciate your expertise
and patience ;) .
Doc
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top