Backpacking- Internal Frame

Joined
Jun 26, 2007
Messages
906
Hello all, I was hoping to get suggestions for the titular item- a pack, with capacity for about 3 days, with an internal frame. I looked back about four pages and didn't see a similar thread. I'm returning to the forums after a long hiatus, so if there is a sticky i should read if I'm in the wrong place, let me know.

Anyway, I'll start with what I have now. I have had the same Kelty pack since my days as a Boy Scout, and while it has been totally bulletproof, it is just too small for more than a night or two, and even that comes with limitations. I really like the internal frame- I've taken external frame packs into the woods before, and found them heavy, unmaneuverable, and uncomfortable.

The rest of my setup is fairly standard. I use an MSR stove, redundant water filtration, and a solid sleeping bag. My issue is space- i need to be able to carry *all* supplies for around 3 days in this pack. I haven't shopped for a real backpack in years- i don't know where to begin!
 
I have backpacked a lot and have used almost every brand pack out there.
The amount of miles I have backpacked is around the 5000 mile mark, with a large chuck of that being the PCT.

The company of choice for me is Mystery Ranch.
In my opinion, there is not another pack out there that beats these in terms of comfort, fit, and load carrying capabilities. Kifaru packs are comfy too, but mystery ranch wins for me.
If I were in your shoes I would get either a Mystery Ranch Sphinx 60 or a Stein 65 and never need another pack (unless you start doing 100 milers)

Your back, legs, and feet can thank me later. :)
 
What are your priorities for weight, durability, load, and cost?
https://www.ula-equipment.com/products/packs/
https://www.granitegear.com/outdoor/backpacks
https://www.massdrop.com/buy/massdrop-x-granite-gear-crown-x60
https://www.gossamergear.com/collections/backpacks
https://www.gregorypacks.com/packs-bags/backpacking-packs/
These are middle of the road on weight, durability, load, and cost. The only one of those I have experience with is a ULA Circuit in woodland that I got on sale a while back. If I hadn't chosen the ULA, I would probably have gone with the Granite Gear Crown 60, Crown 2 60, or Massdrop Crown X60.
http://zpacks.com/backpacks.shtml
https://www.hyperlitemountaingear.com/collections/packs
https://arcteryx.com/us/en/c/packs
These are lighter, more expensive, and designed for light or ultralight loads.
https://seekoutside.com/lightweight-backpacks/
https://store.kifaru.net/packs-c3.aspx
These are more for pack hunting although SeekOutside has models for backpacking. They are more expensive, more durable, and designed to carry much heavier loads comfortably.
 
I'm checking out those links as I type. I will provide a little more detail about my priorities.

I don't think i can call myself a true ultralight backpacker, but i try to get close. I sleep in an ENO hammock with a tarp slung over it, and don't generally carry many amenities. I bring a multitool and my regular EDC Kershaw. I didn't weigh my pack before my last trip, but I'm usually around 40lbs or less. The majority of my camping happens in summer months, but not exclusively.

I don't intend for this to be the last bag I ever buy. If I need a bag suitable for a full week or more in the bush, I will get one. However, since my longest trips are normally around 3 days, I don't require extremely heavy reinforcement or an excessively large capacity. I am not made of money, but can be persuaded by strong features.
 
I'd go try a variety of packs somewhere with a sales staff able to size and fit you. Do you know your torso length?
 
Pack fit is so variable for different people. My internal frame is an Osprey Atmos 65, and I love it. It carries weight so well and has enough room to hold everything for my longer trips (7-9 days). But I have talked with other people who didn't like the feel of the Atmos 65. My suggestion to you is to try on several packs from different brands, with weight in them, to find what works best for you. Some places, like REI, have staff who can help adjust packs to find what fits you best.
 
Osprey to me fits the tough enough, cheap enough, light enough category. You can get more of each of those, but at the cost of the other factors. Osprey also has one of the best warranties in the business, very few companies will warranty wear for outdoor guides, and they do.
 
Just another company, but I have a couple of MountainSmith packs that are very good for their price point IMO.
 
Osprey.

If for no other reason, the suspension systems. For a 3-day pack, I use a 48L Opsrey Kestrel.

As has been mentioned their warranty is bombproof (it only needs to be an Osprey branded product - matters not when you got it or how you got it or how you broke it):
OSPREY'S ALL MIGHTY GUARANTEE
Osprey will repair any damage or defect for any reason free of charge – whether it was purchased in 1974 or yesterday. If we are unable to perform a functional repair on your pack, we will happily replace it. We proudly stand behind this guarantee, so much so that it bears the signature of company founder and head designer, Mike Pfotenhauer.

Also as has been mentioned, find a place that'll will let you try on weighted packs for both size and comfort. REI will do so. Trying on an empty pack is next to useless.

I have and use two Osprey packs, a 24L and a 48L. If I needed another pack, which I don't, I'd definitely pick up another Osprey.
 
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Osprey and ULA are both looking tempting to me. I will have to bust put the measuring tape when i get home, especially for the torso length. I also agree with others that getting to try this stuff on is key, and there is an REI and a Cabela's within striking distance. Looks like that's my next step. Thank you for saving me from walking in there blind...thats an expensive mistake to make at stores like that!:eek:
 
Osprey and ULA are both looking tempting to me. I will have to bust put the measuring tape when i get home, especially for the torso length. I also agree with others that getting to try this stuff on is key, and there is an REI and a Cabela's within striking distance. Looks like that's my next step. Thank you for saving me from walking in there blind...thats an expensive mistake to make at stores like that!:eek:
Once you try them on (with weight) and walk around the store a bit with them, walk out and think about it for a few days and check reviews. Then you can buy with much more confidence.
 
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This is YMMV territory.

IME, internal frame packs shine when loads are light and there's a huge need for twisting, as in backcountry skiing or scrambling. They also work better for bushwaking providing you pack everything inside and the bag is tough (and heavy) enough to stand up to abrasion.

I've given up on internals for multi day trips for trips in New England , including for ski touring. For me, the way mine off loads my spine is worth the hit in flexibility.
 
My primary distance pack has been a ULA-Circuit; it's held up well and doesn't allow me to overpack. The only problem at times is weight capacity. You're lucky to be near a Cabelas and REI, as you can actually haul your gear down and load up a pack to see how well it loads and fits. One thing to pay attention to other than pack capacity, is the rated "comfort weights" which identify the limits of pack weight for the rated suspension system...that's important. My ULA is awesome, but the "comfort" rating tops out at about 30 pounds; if I push it over 35 pounds, I can feel it.

I'm actually going to try a new system this spring. I've went to the higher end with Seek Outside packs. They are a hybrid system that actually have an external frame. I have the 4800 liter Unaweep and a smaller backpacking 3500 liter Gila pack that I can swap with the frame. Now, my base weights are typically between 12-16 pounds depending on season/shelter-system. I can normally do a 5-7 day hike and keep total pack weight under 30 pounds (includes 2-3 liters of water, food, and fuel). Some locations require more water capacity and longer trips without resupply also add more weight than bulk...those push the limit of my ULA pack. The Seek Outside pack frame/suspension system is designed to carry over 100 pounds...and it will. Weight is weight and sucks beyond a certain point for most normal people. Not that I want to pack more weight, as my goal is to continually trim when and where I can; however, there are times when you need to tank up on more water and more food, which is what affects my pack weight the most. I haven't been able to test out my Gila yet, and will next month for a 105 mile section hike, but I've done some road-march training (the best I can do in Afghanistan) with the larger 4800 pack, and carrying weights up to 65 pounds is far more comfortable than it has any right to be.

This hybrid external pack frame and suspension system is quite unique, and it works as advertised. It also gives you a lot of additional mobility the way it's designed. Just some feedback as I looked for some certain pack requirements. No one pack will be able to do everything, but a good pack will cover a wide spectrum of activities and seasons. My ULA-Circuit is by far my favorite pack for about 7-8 months out of the year, but it requires pretty strict pack weight management and limits me from doing longer trips (without resupply) or where I'm required to carry more than 2-3 liters of water.

Your pack's capacity and weight-ratings will depend highly on your kit contents. You'll need to measure the bulk and weight as you search for a pack. As many said, make sure you get measured and fitted properly; that makes all the difference in the world when actually using the pack and knowing how it should feel. Don't get too large a pack as you'll end up tempted to fill it up; however, some expansion capability really helps when you don and doff layers.

Pack weight is one of your "top three/four" items that make up the greatest amount of your weight. Frame/suspension is important, but I've been moving away from the larger 7-8 pound packs over the past several years. I do look at pack weights and try to keep them to 2.4-3 pounds. There are some ultralightweight packs that have no frame and weigh 1-2 pounds, but they require extreme minimalism and discipline to keep base weights well under 10 pounds and fully loaded weights 15-20 pounds...God Bless'em! The good news is that several companies make reasonably priced packs that are lighter and still capable of lightweight loads (25-35 pounds). Some good links above with ULA, Osprey Granit Gear, and Gregory. Next tier up get into the Seek Outside price range, but they're a little more niche for their capabilities.

Pack features are highly dependent on the user. Some like multiple pockets for organization which adds more to the overall pack weight and bulk. If you're disciplined, a more streamlined pack will be lighter and less bulky. I like the larger side/bottle pockets, especially with the smaller main-compartment packs like the ULA-Circuit. Additionally, I like an outer mesh type pack for storing my rain fly if still wet, along with my water purification system. While I do like a top lid pocket, it's not a deal breaker for me, but it does add extra weight. I also like larger hip belt pockets. I don't carry much in my pants/shorts pockets and nothing on my pants webbing belt, so those pockets are my "EDC" item pockets (as is my HPG Kit Bag, but that's for another topic). I can carry almost a day's worth of trail snacks in those pockets, hand-sanitizer, and mosquito repellant. I use a water bladder, so most packs now come with a port for the hose. Compression straps are important. If you're pack is not fully loaded and not compressed, it will flop around and drive you nuts.

Just a few thoughts on this wonderful morning in Afghanistan :D:

ROCK6
 
…I have the 4800 liter Unaweep and a smaller backpacking 3500 liter Gila pack that I can swap with the frame....
Those are some pretty large packs. Do you carry them in a truck? Or do you carry the truck in them? The largest pack I ever carried was an old Gregory the equivalent of 65L and that thing was huge for my needs.
 
Those are some pretty large packs. Do you carry them in a truck? Or do you carry the truck in them? The largest pack I ever carried was an old Gregory the equivalent of 65L and that thing was huge for my needs.

The 4800 is pretty big. It's meant to be my primary bug-out bag and for my longer, winter outings. The much smaller Gila is about the perfect size for my distance backpacking; about the same size as the ULA Circuit. The only difference is the potential weight capacity is greater without much penalty for empty pack weight. If I keep weight to about 30 pounds (including food, water and fuel) the Circuit is fine. Once I go above 30 pounds, the suspension isn't as comfortable. Pack volume isn't really the issue when adding a few extra days of food and a few extra liters of water...but that weight adds up fast. Not to bash on ULA as I think they're excellent trail packs, but when we go off-trail, it takes a beating that the Seek Outside packs can handle better...

ROCK6
 
The 4800 is pretty big...

ROCK6
My point was that I'm fairly certain you meant 48 liters and 35 liters vs 4800 liters and 3500 liters for the capacity of your packs. 4800 liters is equivalent to 170 cubic feet, and 3500 liters is about 125 cubic feet. Highway dump trucks carry 130-400 cubic feet. I seriously doubt you are carrying a pack with the cargo volume/capacity of a small dump truck.

My multi-day pack has a volume capacity of 48L.
 
My point was that I'm fairly certain you meant 48 liters and 35 liters vs 4800 liters and 3500 liters for the capacity of your packs. 4800 liters is equivalent to 170 cubic feet, and 3500 liters is about 125 cubic feet. Highway dump trucks carry 130-400 cubic feet. I seriously doubt you are carrying a pack with the cargo volume/capacity of a small dump truck.

My multi-day pack has a volume capacity of 48L.

Hahhaha! Yeah, that might not even fit in my truck:eek:...good catch; models and "liters" didn't quite translate for me. How does 3500 mL and 4800 mL?:D
 
I have been in the Alps hauling everything we might need to a hut for three days.... and both my dad and I were carrying 45-55l packs. Not much else is needed in my opinion. Sleeping bags were not needed (blankets at the hut) but we carried all our food, stove, etc in addition to two half ropes, harnesses, climbing gear, crampons, two ice axes each, helmet.... you know, all the crap needed for alpine climbing.

I don't doubt there will be instances where a HUGE pack is required, but if you carry smart, try to get light gear that packs small... you would be a much happier camper with a smaller pack.

I was carrying an Alpine Lowe Alpine Attack and my dad a Black Diamond. Both are internal frame packs, with stow-away belt (for climbing, so they don't interfere with the harness) and removable top lids (again, to lighthen up when the extra capacity is not there. The Alpine Lowe weights (complete) less than 1kg and the Black diamond is arround 1,25 kg.

You should have a look at the higher capacity climbing packs. You might find something that suits you.
 
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