Leather Bare necessity tools for leather sheath making

[baxtrom]

Hi!

(sorry if some similar post already exists)

I recently started to take an interest in working with leather, primarily for knife sheaths and such, and I'm trying not to binge buy big tool packs on amazon but rather allow for the tool supply to grow organically.
Which tools would constitute the bare minimum for said activities?

Now a week or so ago I started out with...
1. A scalpel/utility knife for cutting the leather
2. An awl for punching holes for thread
3. A set of saddlemaker's needles
4. Edge beveller(s)
5. I've also ordered a fork punch set, which I assume will make my stitching look a bit better.

Now, I'm thinking of ordering...
6. A stitching groover.

Optionally on my bare necessity list are
- An overstitch wheel? Do I need one when I already got the forks?
- A burnisher?
- Tool for riveting
- ...

Further down on the list I would put tools for stamping and decorations.


What are the expert opinions of my fellow BF members?
Any tips on what to consider, or perhaps what to avoid?
What would be the five tools you would bring to a desert island?
cheers /D

 

[Old Biker]

Frugal leather craftsman. He says it better than I can. I think you are on the right track. When you buy the stitching groover, I find this style works the best most of the time.

O.B.

 

[baxtrom]

Frugal leather craftsman. He says it better than I can. I think you are on the right track. When you buy the stitching groover, I find this style works the best most of the time.

O.B.

Thanks for the tip!
I think it boils down to 1-6 for my ka bar project. I have a 1271 fighter which came with this sloppy sheath-ish contraption…

 

[BitingSarcasm]

I have the same stitching groover, and I found that it made my stitching lines look neater and less like a Kindergarten art project. If you are going to use rivets, then get a rivet set kit; the little anvil plate with a series of size indentations and the setting post is what I use. Setting rivets without the little divots is possible, but I found it too easy to flatten the head and make the barrel of the rivet visible. Snaps can be done with a relatively cheap set that uses a series of posts that gradually spread the barrel of the snap until you can flatten it. Grommets use a different post that looks a bit like a wheel on an axle that spreads the inside curves without flattening or bending the whole thing.

I tried to just improvise tools at first, but the results from using even the lower end of the dedicated tools for the job made a huge difference in the ease of use and the end product stopped looking like an absolute mess. I waste a lot less hardware too, though it feels like all I have to do with a snap to ruin it is just blink at the wrong time.

 

[baxtrom]

Thanks B BitingSarcasm and O Old Biker for your feedback

Yes the kindergarten factor is something I am going to have to work on, I’ve been using an awl to stitch and while it looks ok on the front side it is definitely more 5yo style on the back

I’m going to have to experiment with threads too, I have high strength Gutermann synthetic thread, and now I ordered some waxed linen thread too.

I’m hoping the stitching groover in combination with the forks will help me out, also I see some people use a bench drill, luckily I am in possession of one so I guess I’ll try it out. I guess the forks can be used to mark positions for the holes also rather than to punch all through.

I ordered myself this one from a local retailer
Edit: it looks more or less identical to yours O Old Biker

 

[nick681]

A stitch groover is definitely a good investment. I use one on all my projects, even the ones I sew on my machine. I don't use rivets on knife sheaths so I didn't buy a rivet setter until I made a project that required them.

 

[Robber58]

Drilling holes for stitching can work quite well. However, is is easier than you might think to mess it up. Just a few tips:
1. Use a bit the same size or slightly smaller than your needle. It will most likely be small which leads to the next tip.
2. It is possible and tempting to just ram it through the leather. The problem is that it will probably deflect and not come out the back side where you want it., particularly if the leather is thick and/or stiff. Use a sharp bit and run it fairly fast. Take your time, peck and withdraw to clear the bit and it will generally go through straight. Some people use needles or awl blades in the press, both running and off. Personally, I have not had as much luck keeping the holes straight as I do with drill bits but others seem to do fine.
3. If your project is not really flat, such as a folded (taco) sheath, your will need to use something underneath it to ensure the joint is flat or the holes will be angled.
Hope this helps.
Randy

 

[baxtrom]

Drilling holes for stitching can work quite well. However, is is easier than you might think to mess it up. Just a few tips:
1. Use a bit the same size or slightly smaller than your needle. It will most likely be small which leads to the next tip.
2. It is possible and tempting to just ram it through the leather. The problem is that it will probably deflect and not come out the back side where you want it., particularly if the leather is thick and/or stiff. Use a sharp bit and run it fairly fast. Take your time, peck and withdraw to clear the bit and it will generally go through straight. Some people use needles or awl blades in the press, both running and off. Personally, I have not had as much luck keeping the holes straight as I do with drill bits but others seem to do fine.
3. If your project is not really flat, such as a folded (taco) sheath, your will need to use something underneath it to ensure the joint is flat or the holes will be angled.
Hope this helps.
Randy

Thanks, great tips

 

[Gary W. Graley]

Stitching prongs are quite handy, myself I prefer the straight ones vs the diamond ones and about 4mm spacing or so. I don't use the groover for where I am stitching, I just use that along the border at the opening of the sheath so it creates a ...well...a border instead of just plain leather leading off into space. It gives kind of an anchor to the sheath, for me at least.

Now, where I will put my stitching, I'll use a ruler on the straight parts and an awl to scribe the line that I want my stitching to follow. IF you have very thick leather that the stitching prongs can't reach all the way through, I still use them to get me a start that is going into the leather straighter than if you just tried to drill it. The stitching prong holes will help to guide your drill bit straighter this way.

I typically use just the 4 prong and the two prong tools to create the holes for stitching

IMG_0499 by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

Here's a sheath I did for a friend, since I don't take on fixed blade sheaths for several reasons, but you can see how thick that is with the welt that I glued in, and the thread gets pulled down into the leather a little so I never felt the need to cut a groove line.

Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

using a bone folder to press down on the leather so I can pull the stitching prong out helps a lot as it is snug once you have gone through the leather

28 by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

the two prong helps to go around corners, this one use to be a 4 prong but the prongs weakened with years of use and wobbled like a loose tooth, so I removed them and just kept it as a two prong

29 by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

If it isn't overly thick, I'll go back through with an awl that I made from a small screwdriver and hammer that down the rest of the way, as drilled holes don't always look very neat, I avoid that when ever I can.

39 by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

These edgers work pretty good and are not overly expensive

link to some tools

And of course, patience, always key, try to visualize before hand. I sometimes use the padded US Postal envelopes to create a pattern as you can fold and bend that to get an approximate dimensions before you start to cut leather and CUT a bit wider than you need, don't try to cut to only what you need. Having that little bit extra leather provides some secure glue up and keeps things neater. Trim after you sew up...

G2

 

[baxtrom]

Stitching prongs are quite handy, myself I prefer the straight ones vs the diamond ones and about 4mm spacing or so. I don't use the groover for where I am stitching, I just use that along the border at the opening of the sheath so it creates a ...well...a border instead of just plain leather leading off into space. It gives kind of an anchor to the sheath, for me at least.

Now, where I will put my stitching, I'll use a ruler on the straight parts and an awl to scribe the line that I want my stitching to follow. IF you have very thick leather that the stitching prongs can't reach all the way through, I still use them to get me a start that is going into the leather straighter than if you just tried to drill it. The stitching prong holes will help to guide your drill bit straighter this way.

I typically use just the 4 prong and the two prong tools to create the holes for stitching

IMG_0499 by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

Here's a sheath I did for a friend, since I don't take on fixed blade sheaths for several reasons, but you can see how thick that is with the welt that I glued in, and the thread gets pulled down into the leather a little so I never felt the need to cut a groove line.

Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

using a bone folder to press down on the leather so I can pull the stitching prong out helps a lot as it is snug once you have gone through the leather

28 by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

the two prong helps to go around corners, this one use to be a 4 prong but the prongs weakened with years of use and wobbled like a loose tooth, so I removed them and just kept it as a two prong

29 by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

If it isn't overly thick, I'll go back through with an awl that I made from a small screwdriver and hammer that down the rest of the way, as drilled holes don't always look very neat, I avoid that when ever I can.

39 by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

These edgers work pretty good and are not overly expensive

link to some tools

And of course, patience, always key, try to visualize before hand. I sometimes use the padded US Postal envelopes to create a pattern as you can fold and bend that to get an approximate dimensions before you start to cut leather and CUT a bit wider than you need, don't try to cut to only what you need. Having that little bit extra leather provides some secure glue up and keeps things neater. Trim after you sew up...

G2

Great tips, love your work . Interesting a pro like you are skipping the groove lines, I did the same on my little peanut pouch and the first sheath that I did, but in my case it was because I don’t even own a stitching groover (yet). I’ll try that out too of course now when I’ve ordered it. As an engineer I was wondering if “grooving” off the top layer doesn’t also weaken the joint. But having the thread catching on twigs or something is perhaps a greater risk, unless the stitches are pulled nice and tight like you show in your photos.

Some moderator should pin your post in the tutorials section…. FYI Kiah

 

[Gary W. Graley]

Grooving helps more in cases where the thread would be in a more contacted manner like a saddle or the sole of a shoe

and basically the details above are within one of the tutorials that are already pinned at the top, I just thought it would be easier to add here directly
G2

 

[baxtrom]

Grooving helps more in cases where the thread would be in a more contacted manner like a saddle or the sole of a shoe

and basically the details above are within one of the tutorials that are already pinned at the top, I just thought it would be easier to add here directly
G2

Thanks for your great posts and tutorials, the photos are beautiful. I can smell the leather 3,885 miles away. Your craftsmanship is an inspiration.

 

[RayseM]

Thanks baxtrom for getting this thread going. I think many of us now and in the future will find this to be a great reference thread!

Good posts thanks! As I have been trying my own stitching prep I discovered a few things. G2's idea of using a pad to hold down the leather as you pull up the pricking iron is a GOOD TIP and works very well while drilling holes too. In fact I would say that a solid fully supportive surface AND applied pressure very near the area of the leather to be drilled makes clean work as you prick with the iron OR drill through and pull up. The leather otherwise - being very flexible wants to ride up with your hole making tool, whatever it might be.

I have been using the pricking iron but I have found that with 3 layers (2 sides and the welt) the pricking iron will likely not go all the way through without determination on my part. I still then need to use an awl to finish the hole. This makes stitching slow and difficult with my needle and thread set up. Maybe my tools are the problem - I typically use a blunt tip #517 harness needle with size .035" light-medium weight MAINE twisted waxed thread. A WIP by PLackey gave me "permission" to drill my holes using a drill press. I tried that and liked it but found then that steady pressure on the leather as I drilled was essential. I have also drilled by hand. If properly set up and pressured, that works too. I use the pricking iron to establish the spacing. A 1/16" bit is OK but I found that the 3/32" is better for me. This is an evolving process for me.

Gary W. Graley - you mentioned elsewhere that you now spray dye your work. If baxtrom doesn't mind elaborating this thread I surely would like to read a summary of that process.

 

[Gary W. Graley]

I use an airbrush system, fairly inexpensive but you do need to spray in an open environment and I'd recommend using a good respirator as now you are dealing with vaporized particles which are not good to be breathing in.

airbrush that I use

One thing about the airbrush is that you need to clean it thoroughly when you are done so it doesn't clog up. Practice on some leather that you'll be working with to get the feel for using it, where when I used a dauber it would soak in randomly and look all splotchy, this gives a nice even finish.

Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

And to put the holes through, using a ground down small screwdriver works pretty well, I like to avoid drilling holes, just doesn't look as good to me.

I also use a pair of angled pliers to pull the needles through the leather, you want your holes to be tight, so that presents a few problems for the hand sewing folks.

These work very nicely

G2

 

[RayseM]

I learned about spraying dyes for woodworking and it certainly does result in a more even finish. Never thought about it for this scale of work. Do the embossed areas take the dye darker or is that with an added effort?

As for making holes, I think I would prefer not drilling too though it certainly makes the sewing easier. I agree that the stitching pricked holes looks better. I've been using my mini Knipex pliers for my needle pulling. I used to have a really nice sail makers sewing palm ( I did hand sewing work on sails so many years ago) but I "loaned" that to a friend and never saw it again. I've been reluctant to buy another - have never seen one as nice as my original.

Thanks for sharing Gary.

 

[Gary W. Graley]

I apply some highlighter from Fiebings that is diluted with a little bit of bagkote using a fine brush. I'll coat the embossing area with just bagkote first and then when dried I'll use the mixture that gives that darkened look and adds detail to the embossing.
That takes time, steady hand, and ...time did I mention time But it ends up with an nice effect I think.

Here's one of some smoother leather for some pliers that I made, the fellow wanted the skull embossing on there, you can see how the saddle tan is nice and even

Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr


G2

 

[Kiah]

Great tips, love your work . Interesting a pro like you are skipping the groove lines, I did the same on my little peanut pouch and the first sheath that I did, but in my case it was because I don’t even own a stitching groover (yet). I’ll try that out too of course now when I’ve ordered it. As an engineer I was wondering if “grooving” off the top layer doesn’t also weaken the joint. But having the thread catching on twigs or something is perhaps a greater risk, unless the stitches are pulled nice and tight like you show in your photos.

Some moderator should pin your post in the tutorials section…. FYI Kiah

Done.

 

[ron55]

I use an airbrush system, fairly inexpensive but you do need to spray in an open environment and I'd recommend using a good respirator as now you are dealing with vaporized particles which are not good to be breathing in.

airbrush that I use

One thing about the airbrush is that you need to clean it thoroughly when you are done so it doesn't clog up. Practice on some leather that you'll be working with to get the feel for using it, where when I used a dauber it would soak in randomly and look all splotchy, this gives a nice even finish.

Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

And to put the holes through, using a ground down small screwdriver works pretty well, I like to avoid drilling holes, just doesn't look as good to me.

I also use a pair of angled pliers to pull the needles through the leather, you want your holes to be tight, so that presents a few problems for the hand sewing folks.

These work very nicely

G2

Gary - I don't know if you've done this already somewhere here, but could you post a close up pic of the business end of your ground down screwdriver. I suppose you ground the edges of the screwdriver and not the flat part. Thanks!

 

[Gary W. Graley]

It's the bottom one, it has a magnet at the other end and a pocket clip, the flat end of the screwdriver was ground down into an awl shape and smoothed out, it's now a lot smoother as I sanded it down smooth and buffed it so it isn't as difficult to remove from the leather.

IMG_0496 by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

G2

 

[ron55]

It's the bottom one, it has a magnet at the other end and a pocket clip, the flat end of the screwdriver was ground down into an awl shape and smoothed out, it's now a lot smoother as I sanded it down smooth and buffed it so it isn't as difficult to remove from the leather.

IMG_0496 by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

G2

Thanks! I'll have to make me one of those. I know what you mean by drill bits leaving a mangled hole, so I was looking for a smoother alternative.