California Knife Laws

Anybody familiar with California Penal Code 20810? The reason I ask is I would like to order some Cold Steel FGX knives which are made from injection molded Griv-Ex (plastic). These knives include a steel ring which is usually attached to the handle so that they can be detected by a magnetometer set at standard calibration. The steel ring keeps these knives compliant with laws that ban undetectable knives. It's been difficult finding a vendor willing to ship these knives to California residents. As most of you know Cold Steel was based in Ventura, California for 40 years before being acquired by GSM. You could purchase as many of these knives as you wanted online or directly from Cold Steel's retail store in Ventura.

California Penal Code 20810
(a) Any person in this state who commercially manufactures or causes to be commercially manufactured, or who knowingly imports into the state for commercial sale, or who knowingly exports out of this state for commercial, dealer, wholesaler, or distributor sale, or who keeps for commercial sale, or offers or exposes for commercial, dealer, wholesaler, or distributor sale, any undetectable knife is guilty of a misdemeanor.

(b) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, commencing January 1, 2000, all knives or other instrument with or without a handguard that is capable of ready use as a stabbing weapon that may inflict great bodily injury or death that are commercially manufactured in this state that utilize materials that are not detectable by a metal detector or magnetometer, shall be manufactured to include materials that will ensure they are detectable by a metal detector or magnetometer, either handheld or otherwise, that is set at standard calibration.
 
How's this for irony. One vendor that refuses to ship to California has this CA warning in their product description!!!

The FGX Ring Dagger mimics the Cold Steel Drop Forged Battle Ring II in almost every respect except one. It’s injection molded from Griv-Ex to make it far far lighter in weight and highly affordable. Equipped with a sharp reinforced point and twin “grip and rip” serrated edges, it’s “no joke” when it comes to self-defense and thanks to its integrally molded ring it offers eight grip options to suit any situation or preference.



WARNING: This product can expose you to Nickel (Metallic), which is known to the State of California to cause cancer. For more information go to - www.P65Warnings.ca.gov.
 
Man with no name said:
Anybody familiar with California Penal Code 20810? The reason I ask is I would like to order some Cold Steel FGX knives which are made from injection molded Griv-Ex (plastic). These knives include a steel ring which is usually attached to the handle so that they can be detected by a magnetometer set at standard calibration. The steel ring keeps these knives compliant with laws that ban undetectable knives. It's been difficult finding a vendor willing to ship these knives to California residents. As most of you know Cold Steel was based in Ventura, California for 40 years before being acquired by GSM. You could purchase as many of these knives as you wanted online or directly from Cold Steel's retail store in Ventura.

California Penal Code 20810
(a) Any person in this state who commercially manufactures or causes to be commercially manufactured, or who knowingly imports into the state for commercial sale, or who knowingly exports out of this state for commercial, dealer, wholesaler, or distributor sale, or who keeps for commercial sale, or offers or exposes for commercial, dealer, wholesaler, or distributor sale, any undetectable knife is guilty of a misdemeanor.

(b) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, commencing January 1, 2000, all knives or other instrument with or without a handguard that is capable of ready use as a stabbing weapon that may inflict great bodily injury or death that are commercially manufactured in this state that utilize materials that are not detectable by a metal detector or magnetometer, shall be manufactured to include materials that will ensure they are detectable by a metal detector or magnetometer, either handheld or otherwise, that is set at standard calibration.
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I did some research on undetectable knives awhile ago, and I just double-checked, here's what I found, and didn't find-

To my surprise there is nothing in the current California penal code, or California case law that says it is illegal in California to own or carry an undetectable knife (with one exception*). There was a time when the California penal code did specifically say that it was illegal to possess an undetectable knife (CA pc 12020), but 12020 was repealed in 2012, and divided into separate statutes, and none of those new statutes says anything about undetectable knives being illegal to posses anymore. The old 12020, as it refers to undetectable knives, is now 20810 (linked below). The exception*- the only mention of undetectable knives being illegal to posses/carry in the current penal code specifically refers to possession in the secure areas of public transit facilities (Chapter 7, section 171.7).

Perhaps it was an oversight that they didn't ban possession in the new law, but the way the law works, if the law doesn't say something is illegal, then it isn't illegal.

There are several unofficial websites, including lawyer websites that say it is illegal to posses undetectable knives in California, but I imagine they are basing that info on the old 12020, or they didn't update their websites after the 2012 repeal.

Here is a link to CA pc 20810 direct from the official California legislative website. Notice how it says nothing about possession of undetectable knives.


And here is a link to 16590, the list of weapons that are completely illegal for the average citizen to posses in the state of California. Undetectable knives do not appear on the list (undetectable firearms do). That list was last updated in 2021. Off topic- although belt buckle knives appears on that list, California has it's own definition of "belt buckle knives" just like it has it's own definition of "switchblade". The fact is, belt buckle knives with blades under 2.5 inches are actually legal (CA pc 16260).


Despite the fact that current California law makes no mention of it being illegal to own or carry an undetectable knife (aside from Chapter 7), I would still advise against such actions. Why risk having to sit in jail while your lawyer sorts it out.

As far as buying/importing a plastic knife with a piece of metal added for personal possession and/or carry, current California law says nothing about it being illegal.


Aside from the law, I don't see any practical purpose for owning an undetectable knife in California. It is illegal to carry anything concealed that could be used as a stabbing weapon, so that means even if it is legal to posses and carry an undetectable knife, you would have to carry it openly and visible, and that would defeat the purpose of carrying an "undetectable" knife. A person might as well openly carry a steel knife/dagger, which is legal, and which could also be used to perform some amount of cutting.
 
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The knife in question, Cold Steel's FGX Ring Dagger #CS-92FR, is perfect for leaving in the shower, trunk of the car, garage, kitchen or open carry on a cold rainy day/night by attaching to a bead chain then around the neck. They don't cost much and are fully capable of light cutting chores and more! I'm not eyeing it with the intention of bypassing any security device. The whole reason the steel ring is attached is to make them compliant with laws regarding undetectable knives per California's PC 20810. If Lynn Thompson was anything, he was cognizant of California state laws regarding knives. It's not an undetectable knife as long as the steel ring remains attached.

From Cold Steel's website:
Our FGX Nightshade blades are unaffected by moisture. They never rust, warp, crack or split even in the most challenging environments. They are light enough to be tied, tucked, or taped just about anywhere, and, since they are unaffected by all but the most extreme heat and cold, they are a natural choice for concealed storage both inside and outside of your house - from hedges and flowerpots, to the refrigerator or the shower!
 
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One additional note, you can own a switchblade (as they define it) but people have been arrested and charged for carrying on their own property.

Hopefully Knife Rights v Bonta fixes this... but this is stretching out forever.
 
sternum888 said:
You can carry any blade length as long its folded( closed) and its manual folder knife. Under 2” blade rule only applies for switchblades.
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your telling me that if I make a lockback folding machete that someone can legally carry that as thier pocket knife as long as it has to be opened manually,because if that is true I might just make one and offer if free to the first resident of cali willing to strap it to their leg and take a walk throught the city.
 
Evan Wilson said:
your telling me that if I make a lockback folding machete that someone can legally carry that as thier pocket knife as long as it has to be opened manually,because if that is true I might just make one and offer if free to the first resident of cali willing to strap it to their leg and take a walk throught the city.
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Yes, it's the whole reason for the existence of Cold Steel's megafolder lineup.
20230909_004717~2.jpg
 
WValtakis said:
Yes, it's the whole reason for the existence of Cold Steel's megafolder lineup.
View attachment 2377532
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Cold Steel was based out of Ventura, California for the first 40 years of its existence then sold to GSM and relocated to Texas. While in California they kept an Arizona office for the merchandise that was prohibited in California (blowguns, throwing stars, sword canes and police batons). Everything else was California compliant.
 
Evan Wilson said:
your telling me that if I make a lockback folding machete that someone can legally carry that as thier pocket knife as long as it has to be opened manually,because if that is true I might just make one and offer if free to the first resident of cali willing to strap it to their leg and take a walk throught the city.
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SoCal here. I’d carry it around for a bit. Bonus points if there’s a way I could rig a sheath for it to my fuel tank. Im sure it would be different for a dude in an office but within my usual company it would be reasonably acceptable. Nobody bats an eye at my sharpfinger and it’s not uncommon to see buck 119s or bowies even.
 
Daedric Panther said:
SoCal here. I’d carry it around for a bit. Bonus points if there’s a way I could rig a sheath for it to my fuel tank. Im sure it would be different for a dude in an office but within my usual company it would be reasonably acceptable. Nobody bats an eye at my sharpfinger and it’s not uncommon to see buck 119s or bowies even.
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I'll try to get a design drawn up in the next week or two and I have a few knives and a machete to finish up before I can get it done but should be doable and ready by the end of Feb. next year if you want to send my a private message or find my e-mail under my profiles about to work out any details let me know this will be a fun project.
 
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Evan Wilson said:
I'll try to get a design drawn up in the next week or two and I have a few knives and a machete to finish up before I can get it done but should be doable and ready by the end of Feb. next year if you want to send my a private message or find my e-mail under my profiles about to work out any details let me know this will be a fun project.
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Cool I’ll absolutely take you up on that!
 
Billy V said:
If someone who knows could help answer this question:

Is the Cold Steel Safe Maker 2 legal to own and carry in Kalifornia?
or own in your Home
Specs are 3 1/4" blade, double edge.

Also the Cold Steel urban Pal ?
Specs 1 1/2" blade, single edge.
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Welcome to Bladeforums Billy V.

Both of those knives are legal to own and carry under California state law. However, they must be carried openly and visible. All fixed-blade knives, defined under CA state law as "dirks and daggers", must be carried openly.

Sometimes local (city/county) knife laws can be more restrictive, but I can't think off the top of my head if there are any counties or cities in California where such knives are illegal. What particular city/county are you concerned about?
 
killgar said:
Welcome to Bladeforums Billy V.

Both of those knives are legal to own and carry under California state law. However, they must be carried openly and visible. All fixed-blade knives, defined under CA state law as "dirks and daggers", must be carried openly.

Sometimes local (city/county) knife laws can be more restrictive, but I can't think off the top of my head if there are any counties or cities in California where such knives are illegal. What particular city/county are you concerned about?
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San Diego - city limits
 
Billy V said:
San Diego - city limits
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Small world, I also live in San Diego (54 year resident). San Diego mostly uses state knife laws, so there is no prohibition on the owning or carrying of the knives you referenced, you just have to wear them openly like I said before.

The only knife ordinance that the city of San Diego has refers to single use plastic knives/eating utensils, (city code Chapter 6, Section 66.0102).

And the only knife law that the county of San Diego has is a prohibition on the possession of throwing knives in county parks (county code Article 2, Section 41.117).

Beyond that, all we have down here are the state knife laws.

I've carried fixed-blades openly in San Diego off and on for many years without any issues whatsoever, and I've had a few cordial encounters with law enforcement while doing so.
 
Evan Wilson said:
I'll try to get a design drawn up in the next week or two and I have a few knives and a machete to finish up before I can get it done but should be doable and ready by the end of Feb. next year if you want to send my a private message or find my e-mail under my profiles about to work out any details let me know this will be a fun project.
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I’ve seen a few of the local homeless guys wearing 2 Large Fixed blades at once! Both worn on the same side (right).
Both knives were something bought at Big 5 for cheap, but one was a 10” Bowie and the other knife was at least a 6” blade.
Nasty looking knives, but as I said, cheap pieces.
 
killgar said:
To be clear, under California law, both gravity knives and butterfly/Balisong knives are considered "switchblades".

Here is how California state law defines a "switchblade"- https://www.leginfo.legislature.ca....aySection.xhtml?sectionNum=17235.&lawCode=PEN

Notice how that statute specifically includes "gravity knives", as well as knives that can be opened with a "flip of the wrist" (butterfly/Balisong).

And some cities/counties in California have their own blade length limits on knives that can be carried.




I've never seen an "air gauge knife". My best guess is that someone made one, got caught with it, and it was added to the list of prohibited items.
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Quick question:
If a butterfly knife is considered a "switch blade" and a "switch blade" has a bladelength of 2inches or longer
What about a knife with a blade under 2 inches and a butterfly knife style mechanism?
It seems like either it doesnt count or it explicitly counts? 😅
 
Deusdark said:
Quick question:
If a butterfly knife is considered a "switch blade" and a "switch blade" has a bladelength of 2inches or longer
What about a knife with a blade under 2 inches and a butterfly knife style mechanism?
It seems like either it doesnt count or it explicitly counts? 😅
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As far as California state law is concerned, butterfly knives, gravity knives, and knives that are commonly considered to be switchblades, do not meet the legal definition of a "switchblade" if the blade is under 2", and are therefore legal to carry.
 
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