Cannot get a CTS-XHP Gunhammer sharp

cpio

cpio

Joined
Jan 3, 2004
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I recently got my hands on a HTM Gunhammer with the torpedo CTS-XHP blade. I ran it through numerous passes with my Sharpmaker at the 40 degree setting, and finished up with the extra-fine rods. I still cannot get it sharp enough to push cut or make fine cuts without fraying material. I don't know what gives. Any ideas would be really helpful.
 
Did you work up a burr? I actually also found that the extra-fine only took me to working sharp, not shaving sharp. The ultra-fine rods proved more helpful with that.
 
Agreed with crimsonfalcon. I'm an Edge Pro guy myself, so whenever I've put a new edge on one of my Gunhammers, I just rebevel it anyway then work up through the stones of various grits to polishing tapes and then stropping. But if you're using something like a Sharpmaker, you'll need to make sure you're actually hitting the edge and working up a burr.

Assuming you are hitting the edge and so forth, I think the issue is just that you're trying to get the knife really sharp, to a greater degree than what just the fine rods on a Sharpmaker will typically allow. So I think crimsonfalcon is also right that you'll need a higher grit than the Sharpmaker's fine rods. Stropping also works wonders when trying to get (and touch up) that super refined edge that'll push cut notebook paper and do other cool stuff. So if you don't already have a good strop, definitely invest in one.
 
I think stropping is above my pay grade. I'll have to look into getting a strop and figuring out how to use it. Thanks for the suggestions!
 
Are you sure you are hitting the apex? If your Gunhammer is over 40 degrees inclusive, no amount of work on the 40 degree sharpmaker is going to do anything, just grind down the shoulders of the bevel.
 
I'm not quite sure what angle they're ground at from the factory...I haven't been able to find out.
 
cpio said:
I'm not quite sure what angle they're ground at from the factory...I haven't been able to find out.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure it is WELL over 40 degrees. What you can do is take a sharpie and just drag the knife through it so you get a reall thin black line just on the cutting edge. Do a few passes on the sharpmaker. If the black line is still on the edge, then you aren't hitting it.
 
Ok, after having done some searching around, according to crimsonfalcon07's previous review on a Gunhammer, the torpedo blades are ground at 35 degrees from the factory. I went ahead and cleaned my Sharpmaker rods really really well and took it very very slow from medium to fine at 40 degrees. This thing is now pretty damn sharp! It seems like CTS-XHP takes a bit of work to sharpen, but I am very happy with the results now. If I'm not feeling too lazy, I'll go back and run the blade nice and slowly over the extra-fine rods to see where that gets me. Right now, the edge push cuts through cardboard with little effort.
 
cpio said:
I'm not quite sure what angle they're ground at from the factory...I haven't been able to find out.
Click to expand...
Darrel told me a couple years ago that on the HTM knives they 35° inclusive (EDIT: whoops, didn't see your most recent post where you'd already found this info). That was consistent with my experience rebeveling my TNK exclusive copper-handled Gunhammer around that same time to 30° inclusive, where I didn't have to remove much metal to establish the new bevel. But they may have changed the factory angle within the couple years, and I've definitely had a custom DDR knife that must have been at least 50°, judging from the amount of metal I had to remove trying to get it to 30°. Like others have said, try coloring over the bevel with a Sharpie so you can see what you're hitting with the 40° setting on the Sharpmaker.

Regarding strops, these guys make a fantastic one already loaded with green stropping compound. If you get really into stropping you can make your own with your choice of compound, but I've never felt the need when these guys already take such care making a great one.
 
No Gunhammer I've sharpened over the years were under 50 degrees inclusive. The last m390 one I sharpened for a friend was 52 degrees inclusive. It was so blunt when he bought new that it would not cut anything. He could saw his arm and not draw blood. It is the one complaint I've expressed to Darrel many times over the years. No knife should ever leave any shop at 50 degrees inclusive unless the blade stock behind the edge is thin, which Gunhammers are not. One of the reasons is that blade stock thickness was increased in the later Gunhammers. At least from what I've noticed, the grind lines didn't change, which means that the edge angle actually became more obtuse when the blade stock thickness was increased. Anytime you use thicker blade stock, you have to bring the grind line up (in the direction of the spine) to either match the angle set by the former thin blade stock, or make it more acute. If you don't, you get basically a knife as dull as a butter knife, because you just widened the edge angle.

Taking the edge of that m390 Gunhammer down to 26 degrees inclusive actually destroyed some of my Wicked Edge stones. By the time I reprofiled and removed the edge material, several of my stones were shot.
 
harkamus said:
No Gunhammer I've sharpened over the years were under 50 degrees inclusive. The last m390 one I sharpened for a friend was 52 degrees inclusive. It was so blunt when he bought new that it would not cut anything. He could saw his arm and not draw blood. It is the one complaint I've expressed to Darrel many times over the years. No knife should ever leave any shop at 50 degrees inclusive unless the blade stock behind the edge is thin, which Gunhammers are not. One of the reasons is that blade stock thickness was increased in the later Gunhammers. At least from what I've noticed, the grind lines didn't change, which means that the edge angle actually became more obtuse when the blade stock thickness was increased. Anytime you use thicker blade stock, you have to bring the grind line up (in the direction of the spine) to either match the angle set by the former thin blade stock, or make it more acute. If you don't, you get basically a knife as dull as a butter knife, because you just widened the edge angle.

Taking the edge of that m390 Gunhammer down to 26 degrees inclusive actually destroyed some of my Wicked Edge stones. By the time I reprofiled and removed the edge material, several of my stones were shot.
Click to expand...

Well that explains why my GH couldn't tear paper or even my hand when I dragged it across my palm.

Shameful.
 
Last edited:
harkamus said:
No Gunhammer I've sharpened over the years were under 50 degrees inclusive. The last m390 one I sharpened for a friend was 52 degrees inclusive. It was so blunt when he bought new that it would not cut anything. He could saw his arm and not draw blood. It is the one complaint I've expressed to Darrel many times over the years. No knife should ever leave any shop at 50 degrees inclusive unless the blade stock behind the edge is thin, which Gunhammers are not. One of the reasons is that blade stock thickness was increased in the later Gunhammers. At least from what I've noticed, the grind lines didn't change, which means that the edge angle actually became more obtuse when the blade stock thickness was increased. Anytime you use thicker blade stock, you have to bring the grind line up (in the direction of the spine) to either match the angle set by the former thin blade stock, or make it more acute. If you don't, you get basically a knife as dull as a butter knife, because you just widened the edge angle.

Taking the edge of that m390 Gunhammer down to 26 degrees inclusive actually destroyed some of my Wicked Edge stones. By the time I reprofiled and removed the edge material, several of my stones were shot.
Click to expand...
I must have gotten lucky with that TNK GH I got that was right around 35. But yeah, HTM's knives need to be much sharper leaving the shop, or at the very least have a factory bevel of at most 40° so people can easily touch them up with something like a Sharpmaker or take the bevel down to 30° with an Edge Pro having to remove an absurd amount of metal. I basically ruined a DDR (custom) Madd Maxx I bought a while back trying to rebevel it from what must have been an the original bevel of 70° or more. So by the time I got it down to 30° the bevel was like a third of the way up the total height of the blade and the blade was scratched up just because of all the metal dust rubbing against it (despite frequently using compressed air and water to clean it). :(

I'm actually going to see Darrel tomorrow (Sunday) when I stop by the CA Custom Knife Show and will be sure to bug him about it then.
 
The Edge Pro seems prohibitively expensive. What would you think about say, a Lansky diamond kit?
 
I've heard the KME is supposed to be really good (better than edge pro, not as good as the wicked edge) for super cheap.
 
They look pretty good from what I can tell. I'm just not quite sure what stones I would use.
 
You might consider getting a paper wheel system. Cheap buffer from harbor freight and the wheels, and you're good to go. You might also figure out how to set up a guide for it, but it does a good job getting blades shaving sharp in record time.
 
Interesting. Just got this email back....I sincerely hope this means on each side...

Our shop sharpens the knives at a 17 degree angle. Hope this helps.

Thank you,
Lacey XXXXX (redacted for confidentiality)

Darrel Ralph Designs / HTM Knives
469-728-7242
12034 S Profit Row
Forney, TX 75126
 
If my GH is 17 degrees per side, then the bevels must just not meet in the slightest because I don't understand how it could have come so woefully dull. Even after having to send it back and have it resharpened, benchmade's factory edge LAUGHS at it.
 
I'm at the point where I might have to send this knife to HTM to be sharpened! I haven't the foggiest idea what they did to this thing at the factory.....
 
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