CFV vs 3v vs 20cv vs 154

OBX351 said:
Maybe Guy could make me a fish/fillet knife??!!
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Me too! Or even something similar the 4.5 but with a 2" longer blade would be nice.
I'd also like Guy to make an 8" kitchen/chef knife.
How about a folder too?
Ok ok, I'll stop now!

So back on topic, I guess I'd split my preferences for steel properties into two separate categories/situations.
Coastal:
1. Corrosion resistance
2. Wear resistance and ease of sharpening
3. Toughness
Inland:
1. Edge retention and toughness
2. Ease of sharpening
3. Corrosion resistance
 
I prefer 20cv personally, I live in the tropical regions of the world and most of my outdoor jaunts are to the coastal regions. I have a gso4.1 in 3v steel and it rust. I have a gso3.5 in 20cv and it is my preferred carry.
 
Poecilia said:
I prefer 20cv personally, I live in the tropical regions of the world and most of my outdoor jaunts are to the coastal regions. I have a gso4.1 in 3v steel and it rust. I have a gso3.5 in 20cv and it is my preferred carry.
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I think if I lived in an area like you, my preferences would be different from what I listed in my other post.

Do you mind saying what area of the world you live in?
 
All three are GREAT steels. I am sure that S!K has them heat treated correctly (especially the 3v) and that they are ground for maximum performance.

I am surprised that cpm 154 doesn't get more love here. While it is not the best at anything, it does EVERYTHING really, really well. It is by far my favorite stainless for use in a big knife. While 3v is my favorite "super steel," I would probably feel differently if I lived in more humid environment.

...anyway, there is not a bad choice among the three options. Cheers!
 
Poecilia said:
I prefer 20cv personally, I live in the tropical regions of the world and most of my outdoor jaunts are to the coastal regions. I have a gso4.1 in 3v steel and it rust. I have a gso3.5 in 20cv and it is my preferred carry.
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Out of curiosity do you have a delta 3v with the new heat treatment? I've read that has better corrosion resistance which can rival stainless steel.
 
You can only take the alloy content of 3V so far, and it lacks quite a bit of chromium to be considered stainless.
I do find that 3V is sufficiently corrosion resistant for my freshwater needs, but if you use it near salt it is going to rust.
 
Musashidin said:
Out of curiosity do you have a delta 3v with the new heat treatment? I've read that has better corrosion resistance which can rival stainless steel.
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The 3V 4.1 he is referring to will be an old spec 4.1 with the older tumbled finish. The new spec 3V has the newer heat treatment and a peened finish. It is the combination of HT and finish that gives the new spec 3V a really good corrosion resistance, comparable to (but probably not rivaling) the 20CV.

The newest GSO 4.1 with the delta 3V is not really in circulation yet, but is expected to be the same as the existing 3V blades in terms of corrosion resistance.
 
ncrockclimb said:
All three are GREAT steels. I am sure that S!K has them heat treated correctly (especially the 3v) and that they are ground for maximum performance.

I am surprised that cpm 154 doesn't get more love here. While it is not the best at anything, it does EVERYTHING really, really well. It is by far my favorite stainless for use in a big knife. While 3v is my favorite "super steel," I would probably feel differently if I lived in more humid environment.

...anyway, there is not a bad choice among the three options. Cheers!
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Same here. I've been pleased with the 154 CM I've used in the past, a very 'balanced' steel. Still haven't used any from Guy yet.

I wonder if some of our different experiences with a certain steel come from trying to compare the 'same' steel but from different makers and with a different heat treat. When you add in the different geometry from each maker and the different HT protocol it's almost as if we're not comparing the same steel any more. I can guarantee I've had 3V that was more difficult to sharpen than either S!K's or CPK's 3V. I don't have any trouble with it from either of these makers. At this point in time, my favorite is 3V, and since Guy's D3V should be the exact same protocol as Nate's D3V, I'm going to go ahead and say Delta 3V.
 
I love CPM 154. I make a lot of knives with it. Peter's Heat Treat does excellent, and I run the Hardness on different models from 59 up to 62. It takes a lot of abuse. I have customers tell stories about that. Fletcher knives out of Andy Roy's shop also uses it a lot. For a typical use hunting knife, and camp knife, it does very well and takes a high polish. Does not stain under normal care.

Sent from my LG-H820 using Tapatalk
 
I've owned, and used, recent production Survive! knives in all 3 steels. All 3 are incredible, but I prefer CPM-154. It's easy to sharpen, doesn't rust, and holds an edge plenty long. It seems like 3V and CPM-154 hold their edge about the same, and I haven't found 3V to be any tougher in actual use. They both roll and chip when I nick a rock or drop them onto concrete, and they don't roll or chip if I don't do something stupid. While I can accept that D3V is 'better' than other 3V, I'm not holding my breath for a noticeable difference. Survive's 20CV surprised me with its' toughness, but I found it to be extremely difficult to sharpen.

My GSO-4.7 in CPM-154 is the best all around user I've ever had.

Hard Knocks said:
When you add in the different geometry from each maker and the different HT protocol it's almost as if we're not comparing the same steel any more. I can guarantee I've had 3V that was more difficult to sharpen than either S!K's or CPK's 3V. I don't have any trouble with it from either of these makers. At this point in time, my favorite is 3V, and since Guy's D3V should be the exact same protocol as Nate's D3V, I'm going to go ahead and say Delta 3V.
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I totally agree that people comparing steel from one maker to another confuses things. A Kershaw in CPM-154 isn't going to perform as well as a Strider.
 
Interesting choice of brand comparisons. Are they just the two brands that you can recall that use the same alloy?
 
Fancier said:
Interesting choice of brand comparisons. Are they just the two brands that you can recall that use the same alloy?
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I don't know of many makers using CPM-154, mostly seen in customs.

I assume that's why so many get it confused with 154CM, and think that "It's the same thing".
 
Bark river has used it and I was less than impressed with it.
 
So just thought I'd throw in a few more observations. I've been working on a 1 1/3" very hard oak dowel as well as a treated pine hand rail about the same size with my CFV 4.7 and my new 3v 4,7. Most of the work was carving grooves and leveling. After about 90 minutes of work with my CFV I looked at the blade and it had a bunch of micro folds in the areas of the blade I was working. On a break I stroped the knife for about 5 minutes and I got 90% ot 95% of the micro folds out and got the knife back to Guy/scary sharpness, meaning that it cuts very thin slices of paper effortlessly with no snags. I am really impressed with the CFV.

Working my new 4.7 in 3v with the latest heat treat, not the delta, for about the same amount of time I found that it had far fewer micro folds and took about 10 minutes on my stop got the knife 95% back, with just a shadow of the largest micro fold still visible. Again meaning that it cuts very thin slices of paper effortlessly with no snags. So far the trade off is 4x to 5x fewer micro folds and 75% to 100% more time to resharpen than CFV. I think that's a great trade off especially since I am resharpening the knives with a strop without using a diamond infused compound. I'd also like to add that the cutting I am doing with these two knives is on very hard seasoned and treated wood. Additionally I am using a lot of force in small controlled 2 handed cuts as well as scraping and twisting the blade all of which can play havoc on the edge of a knife.
 
I live in Singapore, it is an island, very warm and humid. I would also like to clarify that although it is an older spec of the 3v steel, it doesn't rust as much as the 1095 carbon steel as a comparison. I would think that it is manageable, but you really do need to clean and oil it every night, and if it the sheathe gets wet, and in the tropics it gets wet easily from all the condensation. I prefer 20cv for the ease of maintenance. Both 3V and 20cv are excellent steel in my opinion.
 
Poecilia said:
I live in Singapore, it is an island, very warm and humid. I would also like to clarify that although it is an older spec of the 3v steel, it doesn't rust as much as the 1095 carbon steel as a comparison. I would think that it is manageable, but you really do need to clean and oil it every night, and if it the sheathe gets wet, and in the tropics it gets wet easily from all the condensation. I prefer 20cv for the ease of maintenance. Both 3V and 20cv are excellent steel in my opinion.
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Guy's changed the heat treat on the new 20cv knives and they are even better than before.
 
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