Does any one out there have any simmons hardware or keen kutter knives?

waynorth said:
Looks good in pctures, JP!! But in person it's nicer!!! Hope someone ( danno50 danno50 ?) can date it!!
A stockman like that always makes me think of cowboys in the older days of the American West!!:)
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A very interesting observation you make there my friend. I have exactly the same thought process. Stockman knives take me back to the days of the frontier/cowboy settlers from the old west days. As do Lamb Foot and Sheep Foot knives in a similar way to the early farmers/graziers that opened up and settled and farmed our country over here. These thoughts may have a romantic connotation to our past, but one thing is indisputable, these knives were designed to be hard wearing working knives. Hope you and everyone else on the forum has a good weekend.:thumbsup:
 
I have these two pruners with KeenKutter tang stamps, the top one having the name E.C.SIMMONDS across the top of the logo. I assume the "Simmons" is the older. There are also subtle differences in construction.
KKs 1.jpg KKs 2.jpg KKs 3.jpg
 
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waynorth said:
I have these two pruners with KeenKutter tang stamps, the top one having the word SIMMONDS across the top of the logo. I assume the "Simmons" is the older. There are also subtle differences in construction.
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Mate,your collection of cutlery just absolutely staggers me. I know you have been collecting for a long time, but still, absolutely amazing. Keep posting pics., i am sure everyone loves them as much as i do. Have a great day.:)
 
Chaysons, your KK was made sometime after 1940, for Shapleigh Hardware. The "ears" at the top of the tang stamp are one indication of Camillus manufacture. The shape of the spey blade also is indicative of a Camillus made knife, however, Camillus made knives usually had a K preceding the pattern number stamp? That pattern number is not listed in Sellens guide to Keen Kutters, however, the only catalogs put out by Shapleigh were in 1940, 1942 and 1958, so your knife was likely made sometime between 1942 and 1958.
Beautiful stock knife, Jolipapa!:thumbsup: Sellens says that particular shield was first used in 1942, so it would have been made sometime between 1942 and 1959, when Shapleigh went out of business. It would appear to be a Camillus made knife, based on the shape of the spey blade. That beautiful bone also looks like some of the Rogers? bone used by Camillus, to my eyes anyway. I have no idea why there is no tang stamp?
Beautiful pair of pruners, Charlie!:thumbsup::thumbsup: You are correct, the EC Simmons is earlier, pre 1940 for sure and I my guess would be early 1920s or earlier. To me, the older Walden made knives often have a very distinctive shape of the curve up to the kick, but I could be full of pickled porcupine :poop: on that one? The other pruner was made post 1940 for Shapleigh, possibly by Camillus from the ears at the top of the tang stamp.
 
Tangs;
Simmons HDWE Co
Germany
Stylized wasps stamped on the back of the three blade tangs.
3 5/16" closedSimmons Germ 5.jpg Simmons Germ 6.jpg , hefty gents knife; feels like a junior cattle knife but with gent's blades.
Curved scissors nesting in the back!! Inked numbers, beautiful finishes.
Simmons Germ 1.jpg Simmons Germ 2.jpg Simmons Germ 3.jpg Simmons Germ 4.jpg
 
Beautiful knife, Charlie!:thumbsup: Love those curved scissors and the curve of the belly on the short clip blade!
 
Thanks for the comments North Shore and Charlie and for the likes.
Anybody out there have any more Keen Kutters or Simmons knives to show???
 
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Dan, I have just finished completely going through this Thread.
To the other contributors - thank you so much as there are some absolutely Stunning knives- as we know that are out there with KK stampings!

Dan your dedicated vision for Keen-Kutter is something you are very well down the track of- where I have swayed to and fro from pattern to pattern trying to centralize at least 4 main groups of knives.
You have a amazing ciollection of absolutely fantastic knives my friend - what a pleasure to see them all!
I am going to have a dig around for a few photos...

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Another Keen Kutter HJ...
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Dan, when viewing my Keen Kutter HJ's there is a stamped Punch Pat # 833146, so it has Empire Knife connections ( S .Alvords Patent ) and quite possibly Empire made, but when I look at your Scout Knife on page 14, a gorgeous scout at that too by the way Dan ( Post #279), That Punch looks to be the same- even on the reverse of the Punch - the "Shoulders" are the same, interesting!

A couple more KK scouts to add to this wonderful Thread
I love the Mellow Bone on this Older Knife....

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Another Nice KK Scout..
Darker deeper Bone that tends to capture the attention of everyone who sees this Knife - it does me every time I see it - I really love it :)!
Dan, this knife as well has the Keen Kutter Tang stamps on every Blade / utensil.

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The punch on This Knife looks exact to an Girls Scout Knife I have from Empire- as well as a Challenge that I suspect is assembled by Empire ( I will show - poorly lit photos showing these punches at the bottom ), I am not 100% on this one as I actually got this KK scout and the Empire punches out and compared them in the hand as a exercise.

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Punches from left, Challenge HJ with the Alvord Punch, next a Townsley stamped HJ that is exact in every way as the Challenge, same Punch,so both quite possibly Empire made, the next two are a jigged Bone Challenge and far right is a Empire's Girl Scout sporting Empires other type of Punch that has the raised edge as this Darker Boned Scout Punch seems to share.
Apologies for the broken record on the Empire Punch- it's when looking at these knives it seems to come up at times?

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As I have said- I am not a 100% sure on the Punch of the Darker Boned Scout- as I haven't compared these in the hand to specifically look at the difference between these two Knives- but by the Photo's it looks as though it might be the case.
You see this in the comparisons of the two KK HJ's at the top of this post as well- where each of the HJ's seem to sport Empire's Punches.but there are other who know a lot more on this, and welcome any information.
 
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Thank you very much for the kind comments on my Keen Kutters, Duncan. And thank you very much for posting your Keen Kutters, you also have some great ones.

I know nothing about punches, really just what I pick up reading the discussions between Charlie, yourself and others. I believe I remember a recent discussion regarding the Alvord punch. I think the conclusion drawn was that until some paperwork comes up to document the issue either way, it is not possible to know whether the Challenges and other brands, with the Alvord punch, were actually made by Empire, or whether Empire just provided the punches? I cannot find that discussion, but in my memory, that is the way the discussion ended? Hopefully, Charlie, or yourself, will correct me if I am wrong.

In regards to your Keen Kutter harness jacks, they very much look like early Walden made knives, IMHO. Sellens makes the statement that all Keen Kutters produced during the years that Simmons owned Walden were made by Walden. I assume he states this based on claims made by Simmons in their catalogs?
I have also posted an ad from the Jan 1923 issue of "The American Cutler", which states that Walden was the "sole maker of the celebrated Keen Kutter pocket knives". The date on this raises other issues, which I plan to get into, sometime, in another thread.

I can't make out the tang stamp, but I believe that the first Scout you posted, is a later knife made for Shapleigh. The second, dark boned Scout, is a twin to mine (with the etched pattern number K6559). Sellens say that model, with the sabre spear blade, was in the catalogs between 1913 and 1920.

1923WaldenAdinACJ.jpg
 
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Hi Dan

Super interesting information as per usual my friend,

The Keen Kutter HJ with the etching has been suggested that it is possibly Empire by a well know source, BUT- this is not to say that the Punches were sold to outside manufacturers? as you have just said and we in past, and the question was pretty much left up in the air my friend.

Old Catalogs are great to get patterns etc, but to see the real detail in a Punch often leaves one ( me ) frustrated, I think the Patent Numbers are the answer- Oh to find them all! I have started saving photo's so I can document Punches- and to try and gather as much comparative material - but this is a big job that will probably take years.

Dan it would be a treasure to find such documentation of such out-selling from Company to Company!!

This leaves me in the Predicament - - so we have a Shrade HJ, with an Punch that could possibly have been sourced out by many from Empire?

Here is your typical Schrade Punch with a nice curvature in the face..

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Dan, I cant tell you enough just how much I appreciate looking at your knives, and reading what you have to say.
 
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Duncan, I believe your well known source has seen and handled thousands more knives, many of them Empires, than I have in my relatively short time collecting. If he says Empire, odds are it is an Empire.
 
My friend Tom from Winsted, CT, has told me verbally, and believes firmly, that Empire made punches , and sold them to other cutlers! He said he has seen a letter that offers them for sale!!
I will have to talk to him some more!!:rolleyes:
 
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