Extreme "Hard Use " Folders vs Fixed for same purposes . Pros , Cons , and Personal Preference .

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DocJD

DocJD

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This keeps coming up , even though it's been done to death , still seems to be lots of hate and prejudice against folders for this use .
I'd like to hear some, nice and polite , logical discussion to explain WHY ? .
If that's possible here ?
 
As an EDC I like my ZT0452 and ZT0470. Can't say I've used either for "hard use" but it's nice to know they're overbuilt (see box). My 0452 was in my pocket on a recent beach excursion... so that sweet action got gritted up. There's one con. Ill be using my new 2nd torx set to clean that up tonight. When im hiking around the farm or this wilderness, I always carry one of my fixed blades. They can take much more of a beating, clean up easily and are the right tool for those jobs. I don't like carrying a fixed blade in public or at work, so it's nice to have a pretty capable folder. Sometimes i pocket a small fixed blade if im in the mood.
 
Strictly my own opinion, but I believe that fixed-blades (full-tang) offer superior strength, when afield, or in combat. Heavy-duty folders are a substitute-standard, and most have overcome the weakness of the pivot-lock, inherent in the design. Folders are more concealable, and therefore city-friendly. Ergonomics can be equal in both cases, depending on the design characteristics. Personally, I have never felt under-knifed when carrying a folder. Most of the larger Cold Steels have negated this argument. Others opine, that if your opting for a large, heavy, folder; then you might-as-well sport, a full-blade. There is some merit in this argument. A heavy, folder just makes more sense, in my suburban lifestyle.
 
A folder's handle has to be at least as long as the blade, usually longer. That makes the overall length of a folder much longer than a fixed blade given the same length of blade (or cutting edge) WHEN the blade exceeds certain length (say, 4" or longer). Except for certain very limited tasks That require both hands to hold the handle, I do not see the benefits of a very long handle.

Another thing is carry. Folders may have some convenience of easily to be clipped to a pocket. But again when it is long (say, 5 inches or longer), That convenience diminishes quickly.

So, for short blades, folders and fixed blades can each have advantages and disadvantages. For longer blades, fixed blades prevail.

Yet another factor to consider is ease of cleaning, which obviously fixed blades have a huge advantage.
 
DocJD said:
This keeps coming up , even though it's been done to death , still seems to be lots of hate and prejudice against folders for this use .
I'd like to hear some, nice and polite , logical discussion to explain WHY ? .
If that's possible here ?
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Prejudice? Lol! You know the definition of prejudice is a preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience, right? Not exactly a polite way to frame a discussion...

For myself, going into tasks that I think will require extended use, twisting or prying, possibly getting the knife stuck, batoning, and extensive mess, those are tasks I will use a fixed blade for if at all possible. And since I am a knife nut, it is possible most of the time. The only real exception is the excessive mess part. I think that is why I am so attracted to Spyderco Salt folders. I carry those when I know I am going to get sweaty and/or dirty and I know I won't be able to clean them right away or at all.

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DocJD said:
This keeps coming up , even though it's been done to death , still seems to be lots of hate and prejudice against folders for this use .
I'd like to hear some, nice and polite , logical discussion to explain WHY ? .
If that's possible here ?
Click to expand...
I can tell by the way you asked this question (that you admit has been done to death) that you are a knob and wont listen anyway.
 
dogstar said:
A fixed blade will always be stronger than a folder. That is an indisputable fact.
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That said, 99.99% of the time, it's not a life or death situation. If you break your folder, it's an excuse to buy another knife, which forumites would all welcome.

Even if you break the lock in a survival situation, you still have a friction folder, right? :)
 
dogstar said:
A fixed blade will always be stronger than a folder. That is an indisputable fact.
Click to expand...
This is a much repeated nonsensical myth . ;)

The strongest hard use folders, now available, are much less breakable than the weakest fixed . :p

If you mean : fixed blade made for hard use of the same quality level , then of course you are perfectly correct .

I don't think anyone seriously contends otherwise .

They are also most always simpler , more reliable , and cleaner /easier to maintain . :cool::thumbsup::thumbsup:
 
DMG said:
I can tell by the way you asked this question (that you admit has been done to death) that you are a knob and wont listen anyway.
Click to expand...

DocJD said:
Please elaborate , I'm not familiar with this word usage ? o_O
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PLEASE DON'T...or we will be handing out warnings. Discuss the topic, (not each other), or move on.

Otherwise, expect moderators to get involved, however reluctantly.
 
DMG said:
wont listen anyway.
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Basically , the reason for the thread is that many here still don't accept that this is even a valid category of practical knife for anyone , not just themselves .

The "listening" has to be both ways or it does't work .

Edit after moderator comment read .
 
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Blues said:
PLEASE DON'T...or we will be handing out warnings. Discuss the topic, (not each other), or move on.

Otherwise, expect moderators to get involved, however reluctantly.
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OOPS ! Yes , what you said . :cool::thumbsup::thumbsup:

I'd like this issue to be fairly aired , so that maybe it can be understood better by all concerned .
 
NO folder will probably ever outdo the best extreme hard use fixed blades . I've never claimed otherwise .

But the whole core reason and purpose of a folder over a fixed blade should be obvious ...IT FOLDS !

Add a decent lock , detent , clip etc and you can ditch the sheath . Just clip it into your pocket .

How convenient ! Revolutionary concept .

Also in some places , more socially acceptable . Less noticeable . Easier to carry and conceal in many cases .

But folders have always been a compromise .

The extreme hard use / tactical /survival folder is just a natural evolution for the folder , IMO .

Many people, nowadays , either can not ,or simply will not, routinely carry a fixed blade .

But they still want the nearest thing to a fixed blade in overall strength and reliably .

Hopefully , they understand the limitations and compromises any folder entails .
 
If you
DocJD said:
NO folder will probably ever outdo the best extreme hard use fixed blades . I've never claimed otherwise .

But the whole core reason and purpose of a folder over a fixed blade should be obvious ...IT FOLDS !

Add a decent lock , detent , clip etc and you can ditch the sheath . Just clip it into your pocket .

How convenient ! Revolutionary concept .

Also in some places , more socially acceptable . Less noticeable . Easier to carry and conceal in many cases .

But folders have always been a compromise .

The extreme hard use / tactical /survival folder is just a natural evolution for the folder , IMO .

Many people, nowadays , either can not ,or simply will not, routinely carry a f
But they still want the nearest thing to a fixed blade in overall strength and reliably .

Hopefully , they understand the limitations and compromises any folder entails .
Click to expand...
can
 
I cannot legally conceal a fixed blade knife in my state and since I stopped dressing like Jim Bridger when I was 12 that leaves me with a folder. Is it a compromise? Maybe. Do I care? Nope. Truth is in my life there just isn’t a reason or place for a fixed blade and at no time in the last 25 years have I wished I owned one and that includes 20+ years working as a tradesmen in the field. Have i used folders in ways that a fixed would have excelled? Yes because that’s what I have and will have with me so its a mute point which is better to me.
I know my reasons are not an indisputable truth but from this side of the coin the folder wins every time. Of course this is all just the ramblings of an aging redneck so take it for what its worth.
 
My feeling on the matter is if i truly need a knife i will be happy with whatever blade i have as i only by what i feel is quality now. With that said i also feel that yes a fixed is stronger than a folder no moving parts to give out. Secondly if you can conceal a pistol you can conceal a knife. Carry a pocket knife whatever your choosing for utility purposes but also a fixed for that just in case. I edc a sak everyday at work and also conceal a esee 3 in s35vn most days. I have one day where im in bad neighborhood plus bad dogs and i conceal a ontario sp1. No one has ever known i had it and they wont until god forbids i need it.
 
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